outhaul on single line reefing

mrplastic

mrplastic

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My Southerly 110 has single line reefing and although we have owned her for almost 2 years we have never had to reef her. Anyway last weekend on the Orwell it was a bit gusty so we thought for experience's sake we'd put a reef in to see what sort of difference we could expect, (we have the tall mast and self tacker). Frankly it didn't seem to make a lot of difference as the outhaul is redundant when reefing and we could'nt flatten the sail which was quite 'loose' and remained powered up.

I am by no means a experienced sailor having made the switch from power, I have got to grips with a lot of issues and techniques but however this one leaves me a little mystified.

Comments and advice appreciated as always

CLP
 
If the main does not flatten satisfactorily with the reef pulled in hard it sounds as if the position of the blocks (or whatever) for the reef lines are not positioned correctly.

They should be well aft of the static position of the reef clew so that when you winch it tight the foot of the sail is pulled aft in the same way as the outhaul does for the full sail.
 
This is what I find strange. The aft end of the reef clew is attached to a pre-determined position on the boom (this is attached via a bowline around the boom through a fixed aperture) so I have no way of moving this any further aft. Sounds like I may have to talk to Selden about this.
 
Leighb said:
If the main does not flatten satisfactorily with the reef pulled in hard it sounds as if the position of the blocks (or whatever) for the reef lines are not positioned correctly.

They should be well aft of the static position of the reef clew so that when you winch it tight the foot of the sail is pulled aft in the same way as the outhaul does for the full sail.
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Seconded.
The reef should pull the sail aft until its taut. My blocks are riveteed to the undersode of the boom, and the line passes through it before tying off
 
mrplastic said:
we could'nt flatten the sail which was quite 'loose' and remained powered up.
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Perhaps you could describe for us exactly how your 1 line reef is rigged?

As mentioned above, you should be able to pull the foot completely straight and tight. If you can't then it's not rigged correctly.

Have you looked at http://www.seldenmast.co.uk/pdfs/tech_guide/595-488-E.pdf. If that's what you have you need to move where the Clewline end ties around the boom further aft. You can tap and screw on new eye straps to hold it further aft if you need to. This selden design is not ideal because it does not hold the tack firmly forward against the mast and allows the tack to be pulled aft, letting the foot bag. Some people have put a pad eye on the mast and tied the tack line end there to create more forward pull.
 
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jimi said:
is the set up the same in principle as this?

http://www.harken.com/pdf/4171.pdf
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Thanks for the info but no it's not that system. The system I have closely matches that in the diagram supplied by estarzinger. Oddly enough it seems to work the other way to Estarzinger's description. The tack is pulled tightly down at the boom/mast junction but the clew end remained a good foot above the boom and no amount of sensible winching would tighten it any further. It would therefore seem that the eyes need to be moved further aft? This all seems a bit of a saga though, surely Selden should have the knowledge to position these correctly in the first place, the boat was bought brand new I I would have expected all this to be correct without me having to start altering stuff...........?
 
When reefing I leave the mastside reefing point about 18" above the boom before cranking the reefing line in then ease the halyard and crank some more. If the halyard is eased too much too quickly then on my system it becaomes almost impossible to pull the reefing line taut enough, if that makes sense?
 
aquaplane said:
That Selden system looks like you have to let off the kicker to allow the boom to raise and the clew to be pulled down, did you do that? I suppose you then reset the kicker and the sail will flatten.
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No, that's a good point. I will try that out next weekend
 
Looking at the Selden diagram, the tack reef line passes through the cringle and then down to the boom. Our reef is not connected that way, the reef line is simple tied to the tack cringle with a bowline. So I assume that's not correct?
 
mrplastic said:
Looking at the Selden diagram, the tack reef line passes through the cringle and then down to the boom. Our reef is not connected that way, the reef line is simple tied to the tack cringle with a bowline. So I assume that's not correct?
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That is wrong ,with that set up you will get plenty of outhaul but not get the clew down near the mast as you use subsequent reefing cringles the problem would get worse as the clew becomes further from the boom end.
 
The correct way to attach a single line reefing clew is to thread the clew reef line from the boom end through the correct cringle on the leach and then through a second cringle on the foot of the sail, loop it round the boom, ending in a bowline around the same line between the two cringles. Thus, when tightened, the line secures the upper cringle to the sail foot and the boom and at the same time pulls the clew aft, flattening the reefed sail.
 
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mrplastic said:
The tack is pulled tightly down at the boom/mast junction but the clew end remained a good foot above the boom and no amount of sensible winching would tighten it any further.
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Sounds like you should try three things:

(1) Put a reef in and look inside the forward end of the boom. Its possible that the block inside the boom is coming all the way forward when you pull down the tack and then can't come any further and so the clew can't come down any more. That is most consistent with what you are describing. If that's the case you need to adjust the reefing lines so that this block is further aft inside the boom. The easiest way make this adjustment is to wrap the clew line twice around the boom before tieing it. That shortens the clew line and moves the block aft.

(2) ease off the vang when you are cranking in the reef to allow the boom to raise to the clew. You should be doing that in any case, but it does not sound to me like your problem. You would still get a flat sail even if that was your problem.

(3) move aft where the clew line ties around the boom aft. That will create more 'outhaul' pressure and a flatter sail, but probably will not pull the clew down further, so again is probably not your problem

Regarding the tack reef line - it can work either way - tied to the reef point on the sail, or led thru the reef point and back down to the boom. I actually prefer the set-up you now have because there is a 2:1 purchase on the clew and a 1:1 purchase on the tack and that helps getting good clew tension.
 
many thanks to all those who took the time to share their knowledge and thoughts with me. Particular thanks to Erstazinger, I will have a good look at the points you have mentioned as I feel you are bang on the money.

Cheers

CLP
 
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