Online Daily Telegraph Poll re Gibraltar

Personally I think it's got bugger all to do with either the Spanish or the British, this is an issue solely for the people of Gibraltar. I think we all support (or should support) the right of people to self-determination, so if the Gibraltarians want to be an administrative part of Western Somoa for example, that's their business.
 
What normally happens in these polls is that the Spanish Foreign Minisry has staff that look for them and vote by computer. Proven in past polls.
 
>865,403 people voted Spanish (88.3%)

When I saw that I wondered if people were having a laugh, I can't believe that's what Brits think or were they all Scottish voters. I just looked up the D Telegraph's circulation and it's 552,065 so it's being hit by a Spanish server.
 
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Tony Cross said:
Personally I think it's got bugger all to do with either the Spanish or the British, this is an issue solely for the people of Gibraltar. I think we all support (or should support) the right of people to self-determination, so if the Gibraltarians want to be an administrative part of Western Somoa for example, that's their business.
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Self-determination is a fallible concept. When we British captured Gibraltar some 300 years ago the existing population largely fled. How many of the present 30,000 population have roots that precede our invasion?
The Argentinians argue much the same about the Falklands.
I am sure the same applies in many countries around the world, always has and always will.
A less fallible principle is that possession is nine tenths of the score.
 
Resolution said:
Self-determination is a fallible concept. When we British captured Gibraltar some 300 years ago the existing population largely fled. How many of the present 30,000 population have roots that precede our invasion?
The Argentinians argue much the same about the Falklands.
I am sure the same applies in many countries around the world, always has and always will.
A less fallible principle is that possession is nine tenths of the score.
Click to expand...

Gibraltar was taken by General Rooke in 1704 with a detachment of marines.

In 1713 the Treaty of Utrecht was signed between Britain and Spain granting Gibraltar to Britain in perpetuity. This treaty was agreed in conjunction with Minorca (then a British possession) being ceded to Spain.

But shortly after it became obvious that the Spaniards were not going to respect the treaty they had just signed and that they were planning to lay siege to Gibraltar.

The then military governor knew how many troops he had under his command but not a clear idea of how many civilians there were at that time. So he organised a census.
He decreed that those who could not afford to buy provisions for six months or who did not physically have those provisions had to leave the fortress.

My family were allowed to stay together with some seventy other families or individuals.

We have been here ever since and have suffered a total of 13 sieges. Our origins are not Spanish by the way. We are of Hungarian descent and originally from Livorno (Leghorn), in Italy.
 
VO5 said:
Gibraltar was taken by General Rooke in 1704 with a detachment of marines.

In 1713 the Treaty of Utrecht was signed between Britain and Spain granting Gibraltar to Britain in perpetuity. This treaty was agreed in conjunction with Minorca (then a British possession) being ceded to Spain.

But shortly after it became obvious that the Spaniards were not going to respect the treaty they had just signed and that they were planning to lay siege to Gibraltar.

The then military governor knew how many troops he had under his command but not a clear idea of how many civilians there were at that time. So he organised a census.
He decreed that those who could not afford to buy provisions for six months or who did not physically have those provisions had to leave the fortress.

My family were allowed to stay together with some seventy other families or individuals.

We have been here ever since and have suffered a total of 13 sieges. Our origins are not Spanish by the way. We are of Hungarian descent and originally from Livorno (Leghorn), in Italy.
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The twists and turns of our histories can be quite fascinating. Do you know why your 1700 ancestors had wound up in Gibraltar?
 
Yes I agree...and for want of a better word bollox to the Spanish.. Lord Nelson would be turning in his grave now.!!!
Gib is ours & should always remain so...
 
ribrage said:
we could always swop Gibraltar for the canaries, thats no where near Spain is it ?

:-)
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You can swap your own farm for somebody else's if you like, that is your choice.
We Gibraltarians choose.
And we choose not to give up our homeland or to change our nationality or our way of life or our standards.
What you choose for yourself is your choice
What we choose is our business and not yours, so there.;)
 
VO5 said:
You can swap your own farm for somebody else's if you like, that is your choice.
We Gibraltarians choose.
And we choose not to give up our homeland or to change our nationality or our way of life or our standards.
What you choose for yourself is your choice
What we choose is our business and not yours, so there.;)
Click to expand...

Touchy! If I remember correctly Gibraltar is a British Overseas Territory which means that the UK government has a little say in what happens in Gibraltar. Defence is one notable area. So it is our (British) business to some extent. Or has something changed while I was looking the other way?
 
VO5 said:
You can swap your own farm for somebody else's if you like, that is your choice.
We Gibraltarians choose.
And we choose not to give up our homeland or to change our nationality or our way of life or our standards.
What you choose for yourself is your choice
What we choose is our business and not yours, so there.;)
Click to expand...

wouldn't you rather have an island on its own , with no direct border with those spanish blighters ?

Better all year round climate and the ARC for an annual income boost….come on swopsies, you know you want too ! !

fortunately Im not a UK tax payer so not offended by your comments, are there enough of you willing to physically fight the spanish for it ? looks a bit on a limb to me :-)

but I'm sure its strategic enough to warrant defending by UK forces, …….for now
 
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