Old diesel engines - What's your view? Would you rely on it?

Re: Old diesel engines - What\'s your view? Would you rely on it?

Looking at buying with two 6 pot Perkins lumps. Assuming they are the same age as the boat they are 37. Service records suggest thay have certainly been cherished over the last few years, new bits when needed etc so I am not too nervous about old engines. Hours run are probably fewer than a well used truck.
 
Re: Old diesel engines - What\'s your view? Would you rely on it?

I was looking at boats in the 30-year old price range a couple of years ago. Original engines caused me some concern as well for the all the views aired above + usually there was the extra sting that the boat for sale was on the hard so it was difficult, without putting in and hauling out at the buyers expense, to hear the engine running. If the engine is covered in oily gloop, the filters have a similarly aged appearance, the oil is black, the cooling water (if fresh water) is not a nice bright antifreeze colour and there is no evidence of routine servicing in the ships log then I would walk away or accept that a replacement engine might be needed in the near future at an installed cost of about £6k. Spend a little more time looking, there are mature boats out there with new engines already installed (I found a Rival with a new engine and 40 hours on the clock) and maybe paid £1k extra than equivalent boats with an old engine. It is also worth remembering that newer engines are quieter and much smoother running.
 
Re: Old diesel engines - What\'s your view? Would you rely on it?

[ QUOTE ]
Ah well you see.
.........Marine actually made one run backwards (rather than reversing the drive through the gearbox)......

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Actually, this was quite common practice when you mirrored the engines to have all aux & service equipment in the centre, to save having to go to outboard to change filters etc. Makes interchanging replacable easier ... except for water and fuelpumps that is... From one that have 2 x 23 year old 2-stroke Detroit's in the cellar... great and smooth running, btw.... and runs similar to yours /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif...
 
Re: Old diesel engines - What\'s your view? Would you rely on it?

With our MD7a now 27 years old, we have been researching a modern replacement.

At last year's SIBS we were quoted between £2400 and £4800 for a replacement 20hp (or there about) suitable for our Griffon.
 
Re: Old diesel engines - What\'s your view? Would you rely on it?

[quote
Actually, this was quite common practice when you mirrored the engines to have all aux & service equipment in the centre, to save having to go to outboard to change filters etc. Makes interchanging replacable easier ... except for water and fuelpumps that is... From one that have 2 x 23 year old 2-stroke Detroit's in the cellar... great and smooth running, btw.... and runs similar to yours /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif...

[/ QUOTE ]

Strange thing is Alf, when you look at the fuel pump figures, the one that runs backwards is calibrated for approx 20% more fuel. /forums/images/graemlins/confused.gif
 
Re: Old diesel engines - What\'s your view? Would you rely on it?

I would love to give you an encouraging answer but the advice on here so far looks good.

The reality is that you cannot see an engine component that is about to break and being new is no guarantee of reliability. Generally older engines are more lightly stressed and if maintained well will go on for years.

Once you find the boat of your dreams it worth posting on a few websites whether there is anything in particular to look out for that make /model of engine.

Personally I will not touch a Volvo but having a regularly serviced one fail when just over a year old and my cousins new Bav being delivered with a Volvo that the oil pump failed on initial start up you can appreciate my reasons but others may have had better experiences.
 
Re: Old diesel engines - What\'s your view? Would you rely on it?

Age is irrelavant, the engine in my last boat was a year older than me, ie it was then 52, Perkins P6M, Self Change Gearbox, never missed a beat in 6yrs, started instantly, it was a great engine. Agree with others history of tlc more important than age.
 
Re: Old diesel engines - What\'s your view? Would you rely on it?

Hmm. I still run a MD2B, after having both oil pump and dynastart issues, I replaced both. replacement pump made all the difference to oil, and the dynastart was replaced by a starter motor and alternator. Total cost about ££300.
 
Re: Old diesel engines - What\'s your view? Would you rely on it?

Rely on it? How can you?

But reduce the risk - suggesed strategy:

You find a good boat and take it out for a spin (you can't buy an old boat dry without running the engine for at least an hour!)

If the sails and rigging are on their last legs - what's the betting the engine is too?

Checking the engine - is the oil clear flowing - if black and buttery you've got water in the oil and rust on top of the engine - means new head gaskit/top gear refirb at least. Walk away.

Is starting from cold difficult - compression is faulty, could be gaskit or valves. Usually serviceable. If you can get into the rocker case you'll see if there's major rust and deterioration there- most vendors will not allow such access, and surveyors will not give an opinion on the engine in any case.

The hidden deterioration lies in the cooling galleries - if there's corrosion there it will be hard to detect. Likewise if the oil has been left in over the winter and corrosion has got at the sump, you may not see this until later. Look at the sump underside with a mirror - any signs of corrosion - walk away.

If the gearbox is original it must be close to its life's end - another 4 figure replacement job, unless a renovated box can be bought.

The expensive bit of gear is the high pressure fuel pump - usually over £1000 to replace. Starter motors go eventually - £3-400, or a renovated replacement.

So how's your appetite for this level of uncertainty and risk? A conscientious owner will have a record of replacments and upgrades to show you with pride - your confidence can take a boost! Bought as seen - just got to be one hellofaprice to justify the risk!

Oh, and why exactly is the vendor selling at this juncture?
Is he anticipating a big outlay...?

The chances are you'll have your hand in your pocket within 2 years of buying an old engined boat. If by then you love the boat, and all else is dandy, why not keep it for 10 years, put in a new/recon engine and amortise it over the years of dependable fun?



PWG
 
Re: Old diesel engines - What\'s your view? Would you rely on it?

At 571 hrs it had its pre delivery one, then one after it had done some demonstrations by the Dufour dealer and used for the LIB, then one ever 100hrs so I think about 7 in total!! Clutch in gearbox went next and next was the saildrive seals twice. Sold boat after 3 yrs making it clear to new owner that while there had been no reason for unreliabilty, everything had been replaced by Volvo dealer, I was fed up with it. New owner had saildrive seal problems again and as it happened, luckily, just outside Cherbourg there was an big bang. When examined the whole of the saildrive leg had fallen off. In fact sea water bubbled up from the gearbox dipstick!

I am happy with my new Jeanneau and a Yanmar Engine and the guy who bought my boat - he is happy as he bit the bullet and scrapped the Volvo and had a Yanmar saildrive engine fitted.

We all have opinions based on personal experience and mine lead me not to unnecessarily worry about old engines but mainly Volvo ones!!
 
Re: Old diesel engines - What\'s your view? Would you rely on it?

I'm an ex-owner of an old Volvo and changed it for a Yanmar. I need no convincing there. I was just surprised that you needed more than one service in a year. My engine ran about 30 hours in it's first year and has yet to hit 100 hours/season despite my recent retirement. I've just checked my engine log and it's 370 hours in eight years....(ten if you count the last yacht refit). /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif
 
Re: Old diesel engines - What\'s your view? Would you rely on it?

If it starts and runs OK what is the problem. The engine in mine is over 20 years young - original engine. NO problems with it - mind you it is a "pukka" marine engine and not a "marinised tractor engine". The only major service was to have the pump and injectors overhauled after 2500 hrs.

If you do re-engine do get one with a starting handle - real peace of mind.
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"Artificial intelligence is no match for natural stupidity"
sailroom <span style="color:red">The place to auction your previously loved boatie bits</span>
 
Re: Old diesel engines - What\'s your view? Would you rely on it?

I knew very little about marine diesel engines when I bought my boat. It had a Volvo 2001 with saildrive but was out of the water with a dead battery so I couldn't test it. I paid for a Volvo engineer to come and 'survey' it for me. He had a battery and instrument panel with him so was able to start and run the engine, test compression etc. Well worth the cost (about £100 at the time) and I got a 2 page report. If there had been anything seriously wrong with it, I could have used the report to knock the price down (even more than I had already /forums/images/graemlins/blush.gif).
 
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