Ofcom did really good but I am confused

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RIN

RIN

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I noticed the posts on the Forum about the need for an ATIS number on your VHF set if you are going to use the inland waterways of Europe See here for more info.

Well since we will be using French Inland waterways this August, I emailed Ofcom with the details specified last night (Sunday 5 April) and to my surprise they had issued the variation and allocated an ATIS number by 13.25 today (Monday 6 April) I was very impressed with this, well done Ofcom.

However the accompanying letter said

"As the UK has yet to accede to the Basel Arrangement, we cannot guarantee that those operating UK vessels on inland waterways in mainland Europe will not encounter problems with the authorities in RAINWAT states. For example, they may not recognise UK paperwork concerning ATIS, even though we have varied a ship radio licence for the purposes of the Wireless Telegraphy Act 2006 (the UK law under which licences are granted). So, although we are happy to vary your ship radio licence this does not guarantee at all that you will beable to use ATIS without problems in all RAINWAT member states."

So it is not clear if it is going to be accepted, and secondly,

"We should like to draw two conditions of the NoV to your attention. First, the ATIS equipment must not be used near the coasts of the UK, Isle of Man or Channel Islands."

So it looks like you have to update your VHF with the ATIS number when you get there and make sure you remove the number before you get back.

So what do you think? Should I key the ATIS number into the set or not, will the lock keeper refuse a VHF request if not from an ATIS updated VHF?

By the way the ATIS number is your MMSI number prefixed by a "9"
 
If you Google RAINWAT, you can find the latest version of the agreement in English. It is quite short and easy to understand.

You may be alarmed to find that not only may you not use ATIS in British waters, you may not use DSC radio calling in RAINWAT either.

Plus you need two radios, as dual watch is not allowed in RAINWAT, but you must be able to listen to two channels simultaneously.

Don't be tempted to use a handheld radio as one of those two, they are frowned upon in RAINWAT and may only transmit on channels 15 and 17 (IIRC).

Best to have one radio with ATIS for transmissions in RAINWAT and a DSC radio for the extra listening channel, then reverse their use on the high seas.

A lot of radios allow you to switch the ATIS function off and on as you change areas.
 
OK I've had a look.
Obviously you have to use a DSC radio as I believe that is the only sort that can have an ATIS number. But you cannot use DSC calling (or presumably press the distress button?)

The helm radio we have is DSC and I can enter the ATIS no into that. Luckily we also have a non DSC cabin radio with a speaker at the helm so if we need dual watch we can listen to that (presumably C16).

The DSC radio with the ATIS no can then be used for calling for calling locks. Presumably the lock keeper will see our ATIS number when we make a call.

I hope I have it right now.

Best to take mobile phone though!
 
You hear the ATIS number being sent by others when they release the transmit key. A sort of short hiss. The bridge and lock keepers supposedly see this number displayed on their posh sets. You can ask for a confirmation of receipt from them, to check your number is correctly transmitted, but as far as I can tell, nobody checks its use normally.

I was transmitting the previous owner's ATIS for ages before I found somewhere that could change the number for me on my old Sailor radio. No one queried why I was transmitting a Dutch ATIS on a Belgium flagged boat. Likewise, nobody switches off the ATIS, when they leave the RAINWAT area, as far as I hear. Pretty well all the Dutch flagged boats in the North Sea still have that end of transmission hiss.

By the way, in most RAINWAT countries, the user is not allowed to change either the MMSI or ATIS numbers himself. I had to have mine inserted by the retailers. I guess in the UK you get the option to set it or change it on your sets.

I supposed it's been introduced to dissuade the channels being used for general chat, but its not very effective. I listen to long conversations between bargees about the mother-in-law's cat and other professional transmissions. On the other hand, there is very little radio traffic compared to that in UK waters. Maybe knowing that big brother is watching helps.
 
thing\'to Know

when you get your ATIS nr and change your Licence,and travel on the inland waterway abroad ,you nead to do a test (UBI) to use the radio inland ,SRC (DSC) ist for see use,when you turn your set power down for binnen then your atis nr will be sent evertime you transmit,when you leave it on dsc then it will not be sent ,but your transmit power is to hi,belgem law yow need two sets with atis as dual watch is not enabled on atis ,big fine if not.in german waterways you only need one set ,but nead a UBI licence to use it the SRC is not anougth.in germany Hand held sets not allowed .only for workboats ,and then only for onboard kontakt .If you are passing hannover on the way to berlin on boat and nead help ,ring me 01739828985 inside germany 00491739828985 outside. ex pat always willing to help when can.
 
Re: thing\'to Know

HI

We will only be travelling through France (to Paris via the Seine) I could not enter the ATIS number on my DSC VHF so I had to take it back to the dealer who says he is converting it to a Dutch (Netherlands) set which will allow me to switch ATIS on when I get to the Seine and off when we get back.
 
Re: thing\'to Know

Ragarding French lockeepers use of VHF, last summer virtually every lock keeper replied immediately to my call on either VHF 18 or 22 on my handheld and prepared the lock for arrival as long as I told him I was a pleasure boat and proceeding either up or downstream.

One even apologised when he told me he was closing for lunch and I would have to wait. I wished him bon appetite and he called me when we had both finished our respective meals and on we went.

It did all have to be in French.

I never thought a thing about ATIS and no-one seemed to give a toss.

Tom
 
Re: thing\'to Know

I think all the legislation is new for 2009 Anyway we'll see how it goes this year. Assuming I get my set back from the dealer with the ATIS update working
 
Re: thing\'to Know

The carriage requirements for VHF in european inland waters are part of the CEVNI rules. So long as your boat is less than 20m, (15m in some places) VHF is not compulsory. But it is useful to have it, particularly to help deal with locks and bridges.

Rather than having different specifications and operating procedures in different countries, most of Europe has got together and produced a single set of harmonised rules called RAINWAT. The only recent change is that they are now saying that these rules apply to *everyone* using VHF in european inland waters -- even the Brits. In other words, if you have a radio, it has to have ATIS.

If you don't have a radio, your non-existent radio doesn't have to have ATIS.

Unfortunately, there is the problem that the UK government still insist that ATIS is illegal in UK waters. (Of course they do: getting one of their tame ministers to sign off a bit of secondary legislation to make it legal is far to simple for Britain's europhobic bureaucracy!)

Fortunately many (most?) recent radios have an ATIS function that can be switched on or off by the user. This has got to be the best option. Second best, and perhaps marginally cheaper than replacing a perfectly good but not-switchable radio is to have a second radio, permanently in ATIS mode. If you only have one antenna and power supply, and swop them betwen the two radios as you enter/leave the RAINWAT area, you shouldn't have any problem convincing officialdom on either side of the channel that you only have one operational radio, and that it's the one they want.

The third alternative is to do without a radio. But I don't think just switching it off will do, because you might have problems convincing the bloke who is standing in your saloon with a peaked cap and a pistol that the radio that he can clearly see beside your steering wheel doesn't exist just because it's switched off.

And of course, there's always the fourth option: if you don't want to play by their rules, don't play on their pitch! /forums/images/graemlins/frown.gif
 
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