NHC rating number help please

[Medway Matt]

Hi

I realise this is a bit of a longshot but I thought I'd ask anyway.

We have a boat competing in our club Autumn series that doesn't have an RYA assigned NHC rating. The boat is an Albin Singoalla, she's 10.26 m loa, 8.3 m lwl, 3.3 m beam, displaces 4000 kg, 1701 kg ballast, 46.5 sqm sail, SA/Disp 18.84 and Disp/Length 192.89.

Does anyone have a reasonable idea of what an appropriate rating would be, or how I might go about getting a suitable rating?

Cheers
Matt

 

[Praxinoscope]

First try contacting RYA, they may be able to give you some ideas, unfortunately the Albin Singoalla was not as widely produced as their Vega, so difficult to find any historic ratings, it can be a rather long winded process but when we had a similar problem in rating a boat the wasn’t on the list, we scoured old PY, IRC, records, and sites such as sailboat data in an attempt to find boats with similar (never going to be the same) characteristics, which we could find a rating for and used that as a starting point.
Obviously not a recognised method or really accurate way of coming up with a rating, and many will argue unacceptable, but if all else fails the NHC system should iron out the errors over the season.

 

[Birdseye]

Byron will calculate a rating for the boat given all the data and the reciprocal of his number could be your starter fot NHC. Mind you his number wont make allowances for the boat maybe being an "old banger" with knackered sails etc.

The NHC system is designed to rapidly adjust the starter number to reflects both boat and crew performance so if the starter number is wrong , it wont be badly wrong for that many races. Unless of course the owner plays silly games and doesnt try at first it has been known but I wont name him ) so that he gets a wrong number but then that sort of "gamesmanship" occurrs with any system.

At a guess you will be somewhere between 0.95 and 1

 

[SaltIre]

The Clyde Yacht Clubs Association site has "presumably a Singoalla 34" listed as 19 min/hr in their handicap list. Here are a number of other classes with the same/similar handicaps. I'm not sure how they calculated the 19 min/hr for the Singoalla, but if you know the NHC rating for other classes might you get/use a similar one for "your yacht"?
The Clyde Yacht Clubs Association

 

[SaltIre]

Some more info. Hope this helps.

 

[awol]

The Clyde Yacht Clubs Association site has "presumably a Singoalla 34" listed as 19 min/hr in their handicap list. Here are a number of other classes with the same/similar handicaps. I'm not sure how they calculated the 19 min/hr for the Singoalla, but if you know the NHC rating for other classes might you get/use a similar one for "your yacht"?
The Clyde Yacht Clubs Association
View attachment 142430

There's a fair number of bandits on that list!

 

[Nabb]

For what it’s worth, using a fairly basic VPP, assuming a folding prop, 150% Genoa , and with a fair number of estimates, I would suggest 0.895 with spinnaker. That’s a fair bit slower than Birdseye‘s estimate but probably faster than the Clyde list would indicate.

 

[Medway Matt]

Thanks very much for you help and advice everyone.

In the end I trawled through a fair bit of yacht data and found the Norlin 34 to have a fairly similar hull and rig, though heavier displacement, and chose a rating of 0.900 based on that. I've had no complaints from anyone yet but that may change!

The boat seems to be fairly quick and spent most of the first race swapping places with a nicely sailed Bav Cruiser 34 (not a racing boat of course but still has decent enough performance). The rating should be corrected over time anyway.

I hadn't realised that Byron will provide a rating based on data so have filled out the form and hope to get something back, I'll do the same with the RYA.

The CYCA list made for interesting reading but as AWOL says, I couldn't help thinking there are a few bandits there, which gave me some doubts about its accuracy. Though no rating system is perfect of course!

Cheers
Matt

 

[awol]

The CYCA list made for interesting reading but as AWOL says, I couldn't help thinking there are a few bandits there, which gave me some doubts about its accuracy. Though no rating system is perfect of course!

The way to game the CYCA system is to choose an unusual boat for the Clyde and West Coast - something like a bilge-keeler which either has a large handicap or can be given one. Then kit it out with reprofiled fins, carbon mast, rod rigging, carbon sails and smart instrumentation! Bitter? Moi?

 

[dunedin]

The way to game the CYCA system is to choose an unusual boat for the Clyde and West Coast - something like a bilge-keeler which either has a large handicap or can be given one. Then kit it out with reprofiled fins, carbon mast, rod rigging, carbon sails and smart instrumentation! Bitter? Moi?

A bit like this Round the Isle of Wight Race winner - 18ft bilge-keeler Eeyore wins the 2019 Round the Island Race - Yachts and Yachting
Which seems to have no more original Alacrity 18 in it than Trigger’s famous broom

 

[Medway Matt]

The way to game the CYCA system is to choose an unusual boat for the Clyde and West Coast - something like a bilge-keeler which either has a large handicap or can be given one. Then kit it out with reprofiled fins, carbon mast, rod rigging, carbon sails and smart instrumentation! Bitter? Moi?

That sounds like a fairly severe case of pot hunting. There surely can't be much satisfaction in winning through that tactic?