New VHF Mayday Distress Procedure

[prv]

Unfortunately time may be wased by the coastguard trying to find out if the MMSI in the DSC call belongs to the tender to a yacht....A Yacht or a bl**dy great big cruise liner...Mind you the later would have followed correct procedures!

I've seen pictures of Coastguard control rooms, they've got lots of computers in them. If those computers don't immediately pull up the registered station details from the MMSI when they receive a DSC Distress message, then someone isn't doing their job right.

(Of course, it's government IT, so someone probably isn't doing their job right )

Would be good to hear confirmation from ChanelYacht or one of his colleagues how this works.

Pete

 

[prv]

there is a golden rule when things go wrong:-
Aviate, Navigate, Communicate - in that order
[...]
I want my crewman in the liferaft not pussyfooting around trying to make the perfect call!

I've always thought that the two most important bits of the message which should go first, are, the fact that it's a Mayday and position.
All the rest is a luxury which can be given if circs allow.

I've always assumed that in the majority of situations it is likely to be the least experienced person on board that I send down to the VHF.
[...]
I usually just teach whoever I nominate the absolute minimum to do the job without overloading them with details they'll probably forget and which might cause them to get confused & panic.

I agree with all this. Which is why it seems sensible to me to brief my crew only on the easy and quick task of making the DSC part of the call, and to expect the Coastguard to then be speaking to them (the set switches itself to ch16 as soon as it's sent out the alert). In a way it doesn't seem right to omit the voice Mayday procedure we've all expended effort in learning, but in the areas I sail I can't think of a rational reason to have inexperienced crew struggling over an unnecessary voice call.

Pete

 

[dt4134]

In a way it doesn't seem right to omit the voice Mayday procedure we've all expended effort in learning, but in the areas I sail I can't think of a rational reason to have inexperienced crew struggling over an unnecessary voice call.

Pete

I'm not saying omit the voice call, after all the closest boat to come to your aid might not have a DSC radio, I'm just saying that inexperienced crew making an emergency call should be briefed on only the essentials and shouldn't have to worry about the fine detail of a syntactically correct mayday call.

 

[Solitaire]

I can't think of a rational reason to have inexperienced crew struggling over an unnecessary voice call.

Pete

Do you not have a procedure card next to your radio? But in the main I agree with your comments. As long as somebody knows at least how to operate a distress alert then the situation is transferred to the professionals - the CG.

I recant the story of a vesel that "broke down" outside of Portsmouth Harbour. The message went - "Mayday, is there anybody there? I have run out of petrol and there is a big ship heading for me. CG responded - "Mayday, Isthereanybodythere, what is your position?

But at the end of the day at least control had been handed over and a dialogue took place.

 

[prv]

So please explain to me again what the benefit of a DSC radio is?

DSC was invented so that big ships no longer needed to maintain a full-time radio operator on listening watch. Instead a box could beep to alert the OOW only to something interesting happening, like a routine message intended for the ship or a distress or urgency message broadcast for everyone. DSC exists on MF and HF too, which is of very little interest to yachtsmen.

DSC was not invented for the benefit of small leisure craft. We may gain a useful facility or two on the side, but if you look at those and think "was it really worth all the bother just for that?" you're misunderstanding why it was introduced.

Pete

 

[prv]

I'm not saying omit the voice call,

I know - but I am saying that.

after all the closest boat to come to your aid might not have a DSC radio

This is true - but they are going to hear the Coastguard talking to me immediately after the DSC call is made, so will be aware that something's going on. They're not going to have the position unless we or the CG read it out again (perhaps CG asking if anyone is in the area) but then again how many leisure craft / small fishing vessels would be alert enough to catch the lat/long in a rushed voice message either?

Perhaps my view of things is coloured by Solent practice (where I seem to hear a Mayday practically every time I go out, often for trivial incidents, and everything is very much managed by the Coastguard rather than involving nearby vessels) - but then again, that's where I sail, so having procedures that make sense for the area is fair enough.

Pete

 

[Ariadne]

Just use your call sign - its tied to your MMSI No. in any case!

Try using your ships name and MMSI No. to a non English speaking coast station and see how you get on!

Call sign, position, POB, nature of distress, any other info. VHF 16 or MF 2182mHz.

 

[prv]

Do you not have a procedure card next to your radio?

Did last year, because the radio wasn't connected to the GPS so no point using the DSC facilities (and I told people so, especially experienced sailors who would expect it to work). Now everything is properly wired up, I was making a new card to include the DSC steps. It's this that triggered the ponderings behind my original post in this thread - I was trying to make a very simple step-by-step card covering everything from applying power onwards, and realised I didn't have a clear idea how to incorporate both DSC and voice actions in a sensible way.

Pete

 

[Philthy]

Well whoever taught you did not teach the procedure Ofcom want you to learn.

When you issue the verbal distress call after the DSC call you need to include the MMSI so that any DSC equipped boat knows that the verbal call is from the same boat that sent a dsc call and not a second emergency.

Maybe I should expand a little.
He didn't say the MMSI is unnecessary, he said it might not be priority.
Once you've got across the fact it's a mayday, vessel name, location, nature of emergency, and number of people, everything else is gravy. You can clarify anything you want, if the coastguard, or other vessels need it, after that.
This is of course presuming the nature of the emergency allows.

Personally, I agree with him. Putting a possibly useless MMSI number across before the location seems a waste of valuable time?

Don't worry, he taught us what OFCOM wanted. He also taught us how it was likely to be applied in a real emergency. Reading off a nine digit MMSI number, with flames licking your arse, is unlikely to happen. Better to tell them where your arse is.

 

[Talbot]

Number of people onboard is very nearly as important as the location. I suspect this is a case of someone insisting on radio requirements without any concept of the needs of the emergency services *so what is new!

 

[Searush]

DSC was invented so that big ships no longer needed to maintain a full-time radio operator on listening watch. Instead a box could beep to alert the OOW only to something interesting happening, like a routine message intended for the ship or a distress or urgency message broadcast for everyone. DSC exists on MF and HF too, which is of very little interest to yachtsmen.

DSC was not invented for the benefit of small leisure craft. We may gain a useful facility or two on the side, but if you look at those and think "was it really worth all the bother just for that?" you're misunderstanding why it was introduced.

Pete

Thanks for that, Pete,

You confirm my belief that DSC is another gismo that we don't need. What a shame that the CG re-organisation assumes we will all have it!

I'm also doubtful about giving positions in Lat/Long. I can't visualise where a Lat long is - can anyone? That means it MUST be looked up, and it has to be read, transmitted & written down without error (unless DSC wired up). For verbal comms & instant understanding, I would always prefer to state 12m NE Puffin Island or similar. Anyone hearing that would know roughly where to look & how far away they are, without even looking at the chart.

 

[ProDave]

We were taught that distance and bearing from a point is okay for location, as long as it's a clearly identifiable point.

E.g it would be no good me saying we are 3 miles west of Tarbet, as there are at least half a dozen Tarbet's in Scotland, but 3 miles NE of the Kessock Bridge is a unique location.

Another point perhaps is a small boat like we sail can get into trouble a lot quicker than a large ship. If a large ship has an engine fire, then there's going to be plenty of time for the radio operator to convey the nature of the emergency. The ship isn't going to sink quickly. So no doubt the procedures are thought out for that situation.

But in a small sailing boat, an engine fire is likely to even prevent you getting near the radio. If you can get near the radio, your mayday may need to be very brief indeed.

 

[Fantasie 19]

So let me get this right;

I spend extra money on a new DSC VHF, even tho my existing one works fine, because I want "hit the button response" to a problem. The radio sends the alarm, my location & the emergency type. I then have to repeat the call by voice, giving my call sign & the long, complex, MMSI to confirm that I am the same boat in trouble?

Or I can stick with my current radio & just make the voice call saying who I am, how many aboard & where I am & what the problem is.

So please explain to me again what the benefit of a DSC radio is?

+1!

 

[ditchcrawler]

The DSC mayday card I downloaded from the Skysail website includes reference to the MMSI number.It is nice that you can download it into word and type in your own boat details to make it look nice.

 

[LadyInBed]

On a DSC radio, it's not necessary if the emergency call has been activated, and a non DSC it's immaterial

Exactly so.

 

[Beadle]

I've seen pictures of Coastguard control rooms, they've got lots of computers in them. If those computers don't immediately pull up the registered station details from the MMSI when they receive a DSC Distress message, then someone isn't doing their job right.

(Of course, it's government IT, so someone probably isn't doing their job right )

Would be good to hear confirmation from ChanelYacht or one of his colleagues how this works.

Pete

Just a thought

But if they they could get all the info on one machine they would only need one machine

Which wouldn't look nearly so impressive

 

[Searush]

If they haven't got all the info on one machine then someone needs sacking.

 

[bryantee]

shame on you

Just a thought

But if they they could get all the info on one machine they would only need one machine

Which wouldn't look nearly so impressive

if quotas are fulfilled. happiness and bonus. if quotas not fulfilled bofnus.??
tongue in cheek and with the greatest respect for the guardians of your shores. the rest of the world has to get by. some are worse some are better?comments please.

 

[mcframe]

As my username suggests, my day-job is in aviation; there is a golden rule when things go wrong:-
Aviate, Navigate, Communicate - in that order

I see no reason not to bring that principle with me onto the water.

The priority is to command the vessel in an appropriate way that keeps her safe, then to navigate and only then to make a call.

Interesting.

Having done a test DSC call to the coastguard (abet without position - that's my /next/ annual radio check), they were interested in the last four digits of my MMSI - a bit like truncating aviation callsigns to the last two characters once comms have been established.

In the event of a mayday, I'd be tempted to try to slip in a "Yacht FOOBAR, MMSI ending 1234, further to my DSC call" somewhere.

If you've not done a DSC alert, then I don't see the MMSI (or callsign) adds anything - at least in the initial call.

In case of false EPIRB alarms, I've got a sticker with Falmouth phone number & my hex ID *behind* where my PLB usually lives.

 

[mcframe]

So let me get this right;

I spend extra money on a new DSC VHF, even tho my existing one works fine, because I want "hit the button response" to a problem. The radio sends the alarm, my location & the emergency type. I then have to repeat the call by voice, giving my call sign & the long, complex, MMSI to confirm that I am the same boat in trouble?

Or I can stick with my current radio & just make the voice call saying who I am, how many aboard & where I am & what the problem is.

So please explain to me again what the benefit of a DSC radio is?

Unambiguous position.

I've been on a boat where we heard a pan-pan following a grounding - the position was "somewhat doubtful" (by visual fix), so we stood by while our helm called in "We are 200 yards south of the grounded vessel and are at <read out position from repeater on cockpit mic>" (5 miles away from reported position) - a 'position send' might have been handy from either vessel...