New to Diesel Engines, Advice me!

vandy

vandy

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Hi everyone!

We have been boating on Ribs and Motor Cruisers all using petrol outboard engines since 1996! So I feel quite confident about any make and model of outboards and their typical problems and how to rectify them.

But now we have been looking for some fishing boats (Arvor, Quicksilver etc.) and some use Diesel Engines i.e. VW, MerCruiser, Cummins etc.

Because all the boats which we are going to view are pre-owned packages, I appreciate if you could help me on this.

What do we have to look for in a diesel engine? what could go wrong and what usually goes wrong say after 2-3 years?

Any advice on this is very much appreciated. ;)
 
stay away from Diesel engines, they are pain in the a***.

So many things could go wrong with them, like diesel cars...

General advice is to check oil tank for milky oil, and see if it cold starts OK.

Not much you can do if you diesel engine is dead, not as easy as an outboard which you can just unbolt and then buy a new one...
 
newtothames said:
stay away from Diesel engines, they are pain in the a***.

So many things could go wrong with them, like diesel cars...

General advice is to check oil tank for milky oil, and see if it cold starts OK.

Not much you can do if you diesel engine is dead, not as easy as an outboard which you can just unbolt and then buy a new one...
Click to expand...

Pretty radical views, I think most people would say completely the opposite.

I am not a fan of s/hand petrol engines, I have several second hand diesel engines, they are pretty straight forward to trouble shoot when they go wrong and don't require "professional" help for most jobs.
 
newtothames said:
stay away from Diesel engines, they are pain in the a***.

So many things could go wrong with them, like diesel cars...

General advice is to check oil tank for milky oil, and see if it cold starts OK.

Not much you can do if you diesel engine is dead, not as easy as an outboard which you can just unbolt and then buy a new one...
Click to expand...


Now that's the voice of a knowledgeable and experienced, boater,

my optimax 200 has stopped,

I know, just unbolt it and buy a new one, 13k plus labour:rolleyes:

If diesel engines are as bad as you say, how come most boats over 28' use them?
 
newtothames said:
stay away from Diesel engines, they are pain in the a***.

So many things could go wrong with them, like diesel cars...

General advice is to check oil tank for milky oil, and see if it cold starts OK.

Not much you can do if you diesel engine is dead, not as easy as an outboard which you can just unbolt and then buy a new one...
Click to expand...

Unless this is a joke, this post should be removed.

Apart from some of the newer electronic controlled engines

The only thing that will stop a diesel, is If it's not getting any fuel. Mostly easily rectified with a clean filter. Or air in the system, probably a loose fitting or joint.

Air water or muck in the fuel is about the only thing that will stop it.

Virtually every truck in the world runs off diesel, there has to be a reason.
 
nobody seems to be giving the OP any advice!

I kind of agree with newtothames's response; although Diesel engines are less complicated compared to 4 stroke petrol engines, the "marine" version of them is not as easy to handle as other engines.

This is not really a problem with diesel engine itself, it is more to do with the fat that it is an "INBOARD" engien not an OUTBOARD! So you effectively have the engine, the hull of the boat and the driveshaft.

Common Problem: Leak between the engine and driveshaft.

Engine problems: Blown Headgasket is the worst you can think about and as oppose to outboard engine, in an inboard engine the cost is ££££!!!

If you are buying an Arvor, they usually come with VW and they are amazing engines.
 
inception said:
nobody seems to be giving the OP any advice!

I kind of agree with newtothames's response; although Diesel engines are less complicated compared to 4 stroke petrol engines, the "marine" version of them is not as easy to handle as other engines.

This is not really a problem with diesel engine itself, it is more to do with the fat that it is an "INBOARD" engien not an OUTBOARD! So you effectively have the engine, the hull of the boat and the driveshaft.

Common Problem: Leak between the engine and driveshaft.

Engine problems: Blown Headgasket is the worst you can think about and as oppose to outboard engine, in an inboard engine the cost is ££££!!!

If you are buying an Arvor, they usually come with VW and they are amazing engines.
Click to expand...

Another one talking total twaddle, what has this place become.

The idiots are running the asylum.
 
vandy said:
Hi everyone!

We have been boating on Ribs and Motor Cruisers all using petrol outboard engines since 1996! So I feel quite confident about any make and model of outboards and their typical problems and how to rectify them.

But now we have been looking for some fishing boats (Arvor, Quicksilver etc.) and some use Diesel Engines i.e. VW, MerCruiser, Cummins etc.

Because all the boats which we are going to view are pre-owned packages, I appreciate if you could help me on this.

What do we have to look for in a diesel engine? what could go wrong and what usually goes wrong say after 2-3 years?

Any advice on this is very much appreciated. ;)
Click to expand...


Im no marine engineer by any stretch of the imagination, but would say that for either engine history is key the same as the car world. If i found two boats i was happy with and the price was right i would narrow it down on which has most service history, then buy the petrol:D
 
Warpa said:
Im no marine engineer by any stretch of the imagination, but would say that for either engine history is key the same as the car world. If i found two boats i was happy with and the price was right i would narrow it down on which has most service history, then buy the petrol:D
Click to expand...



Nutter, I dont know why I come here anymore.
 
OP you will have to pick the bones out of what has already been posted but basically most of it a load of old bollix. lol

OK. A diesel donk is far more reliable than any petrol engine. Less to go wrong. Works very similar mechanically to a petrol jobbie but without relying on a spark to ignite the fuel. Hence no ignition system which is the cause of most petrol engine failures.

Hard to say what to look for or what could/would go wrong with a diesel after just a couple of years except to say look at her service history..................has she had regular oil & filter changes would be the obvious and important one, especially on todays higher reving engines. On most boats after such a short time in the life of a diesel its probably only just worn in. My old girl is 35 years old plus and as good today as when she was installed. But then she has been well looked after by the previous owner & myself. I know of a diesel that was installed in the 1930's still in regular use today that has never needed a major overhaul because it was regularly maintained. Look after your donk & she will look after you.
 
If you are going to get a diesel engined boat familiarise yourself with the engine. Learn how to change fuel filters, change an impeller (even fit a quick replacement Speedseal cover for it) Learn how to "Bleed" your system for the rare occasion when you may run out of fuel or replace filters. Carry a double set of fuel filters, a couple of spare impellers, rags and Swarfega. Get yourself a decent tool kit with every Metric socket from 6mm to 24mm (and a 1/4 drive socket set up to 14mm )and if your boat is on a trailer make sure you carry a spare set of wheel bearings and the socket which fits the hub "Castle" nut.
I am moving from an Inboard Diesel boat to an outboard.(Until I can afford a bigger diesel boat) One advantage that petrol has is that the fuel is as clean as it gets, whereas when I ran haulage and or Tractors I was always having to clean filters and it is no different with boats especially with the rubbish which is on sale today which appears to encourage the growth of a "Diesel Bug" which can only be eradicated by the addition of Additives which have been dealt with at great length by Boating Magazines as the phenomena is so widespread.
The boat I have just sold had an inboard diesel (Iveco) which was 25 years old and despite having done 2400 hours still ran perfectly. Getting a boat with an inboard diesel is ideal providing that you follow the same rules which you would if you were buying a car, how has it been used, how many owners, and is it low engine hours. The one I sold although high engine hours had one owner from new for its first 20 years who really looked after it and it showed. There are hundreds of boats for sale, choose with care.
 
Last boat I had the diesels had 4500 + hours on the clock and still reliably chugging along.
Find me any 30 year old outboard that has lasted that long and is still running with plenty of life left.

No magic formula or added chandlery shelf snake oil potions.Just down to regular fluid/filter changes,simple basic mantaince and keeping things clean and tidy.
 
Is no-one going to answer the OP's questions?

The vast majority of diesel engines are ultra-reliable lumps that will do many thousands of hours if looked after properly. Like anything else, they will die of neglect far more than they will die from other causes.

A naturally aspirated, mechanically governed diesel is a far simpler beast than a petrol engine and much better suited to a marine environment because of the lack of reliance on electrics. However, newer turbo/supercharged common-rail, electronically controlled diesels are a more complex proposition. In their favour, they are usually derived from high volume manufactured car engines and hence for the most part will be trouble free.

There have been a very small number of modern diesels that suffered from reliability issues (Spannerman et al will no doubt name and shame), but by and large these have been design faults and rectified under warranty.

A 2-3 year old diesel will be likely to be highly reliable, quiet and economical, but there is far less the owner can do in terms of repairs & maintenance than with an older mechanical unit. But the same is true of modern petrol engines too.

So as to what to look for, I guess it's down to service history and visual condition in the first instance. Once you have found a boat you think is right for you, come back and ask for opinions and experiences on the engines it has fitted...
 
I have not read all through this thread but something here may give you an insight
http://www.worldseafishing.com/forums/archive/index.php/t-124996.html

Not got any experience of late small high output diesels, but Have heard of a few problems with the VW engines, i.e. gate valves jamming? not a lot about the mercruiser/cummins, what I do know is an inboard properly serviced will give you years of untroubled and less expensive use than any outboard or outdrive. Before the supporters of the latter interject I KNOW THE FORMER ARE NOT AS FUEL EFFICIENT. sorry that thread is not too helpful
 
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newtothames said:
stay away from Diesel engines, they are pain in the a***.

So many things could go wrong with them, like diesel cars...

General advice is to check oil tank for milky oil, and see if it cold starts OK.

Not much you can do if you diesel engine is dead, not as easy as an outboard which you can just unbolt and then buy a new one...
Click to expand...


You have no knowledge or authority to make claims like this and just appear ridiculous.
 
If a diesel starts easily according to the expected procedure (not all have glowplugs) and the oil pressure picks up to spec within a few seconds there is nothing fundamentally wrong with it. If it revs up, out of gear, happily to the rated max rpm without sounding like a bag of spanners being shaken, and without immense gouts of smoke or steam, thats even better. Hard to check much more without a proper test run to look at operating temperature and so forth which need a more sustained run. Oil can be black but not thin or sludgy, no obvious oil or fuel leaks and coolant system should be filled to spec and stay there.

A basic diesel is a far simpler and forgiving beast than petrol, give it clean fuel and enough air and it runs, pretty much end of, its not fazed by some damp in the area. But, a very modern diesel with electronic common rail injection and emission control systems is just as complex as a modern petrol engine, simply in a different way.
 
Well done Andrew! Finally some real words of wisdom. Agree with everything you say.
If it starts easily from cold it's probably fine.

ps
We know there are idiots on this forum. It seems they all showed up at the same time today!
 
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