New Standing Rigging

[trapezeartist]

I am looking to buy a boat about 10 years old. This probably means it will have it's original standing rigging but the insurance company will want it renewed. What is a ballpark figure for putting new standing rigging on a typical 32 foot boat with single spreaders?

 

[Tranona]

Too many variables to give a "ball park" figure. Basic lengths of wire are easy - look on the Jimmy Green website for a guide, but types of terminals make a big difference as does whether you do it your self or get a rigger to do it.

 

[trapezeartist]

Definitely a rigger's job. I'm too new to this to embark on removing any of the holdy-up bits on a big fally-down thing.
Even more approximate than "ball park"? How many noughts?

 

[PeterGibbs]

I am looking to buy a boat about 10 years old. This probably means it will have it's original standing rigging but the insurance company will want it renewed. What is a ballpark figure for putting new standing rigging on a typical 32 foot boat with single spreaders?

Unless the boat was raced a lot under its previous owners there is no "automatic" need to replace standing rigging. I do not see why an insurer would insist on new rigging at this age.

But you may wish to take a cautious line on this - why not.
If your rig is one where the forestay bears all the strain, and its failure would be catastrophic, why not have it replaced? Cost - £300 up, done with rig standing.

You could lower or climb your rig and inspect it very carefully to check all is well in all other respects, and run on for another 3-4 years. Replacing all gear like for like, not much change out of £1k for your size boat, excluding labour/charges for lowering and raising the mast again. If you have the boat surveyed on purchasing, the surveyor will give no assurances on the rigging - how could he?

Why not ring a rigger and ask direct for estimates?

PWG

 

[CaptainBob]

We're having our Tempest (30.7 feet) done. Quote was _just_ over £1k by Hemisphere Rigging in Plymouth (located at Yacht Haven).

But, they warned that the Rotostay II we have will almost certainly need replacing in the process, so another £500 -> £1000 (depending on replacement choice).

What furling gear has it got?

 

[milfordman]

Last year I replaced the standing rigging on my 20 year old Ebbtide 33. It had never been raced. The insurance company St Margarettes did not insist on replacement. I was able to check the rigging with the mast up, I have steps up my mast. I could not see any signs of distress, apart from slight discolouration. However I decided to replace it any way. My rig has double spreaders and a triactic stay. I replaced every part including the Sta-loc Fittings which take away all the concern of accuratelly measuring the rigging. The parts were supplied by UK Yacht Rigging supplies of Grimsby ( 'phone No. 01472360700. They were recommended by other forumites. Total cost was £1392. It was relativly straight forward to replace each piece separately with the rig up. This was the first time I had ever repaced any standing rigging. I f you want more detailed advise just ask. P.S. UK Yacht rigging gave excelent service.
All the best.

 

[Leonidas]

I am looking to buy a boat about 10 years old. This probably means it will have it's original standing rigging but the insurance company will want it renewed. What is a ballpark figure for putting new standing rigging on a typical 32 foot boat with single spreaders?

You are not saying where you are buying this boat. Is it in UK or the Continent?
I had the same situation because of the 10 year policy renewal issue four years ago. This is in my view arbitrary and though maybe relevant for racing boats, in my case, the replacement of the standing rigging proved to be totally unecessary as they were in very good condition and did not need replacement in the first place.
Anyway.
Reverting to the costs. I have a 42 ft boat with masthead rigging. The total cost including taking the mast down and refitting it, replacing the standing rigging (fore stay- back stay, capshrouds, intermediates, lower fore and lower aft shrouds ) using the existing turnbuckles and tensioners as well as the original hooks came to 1200 euros plus the cost of the crane ( abt E 250) This job was done by a rigging company in Greece
The insurers are usually happy to receive a copy of the work done by the riggesrs ; but they occasionally may also require certificates of the wire used.
Once you decide to do this, it may be worthwhile to check with your riggers the type of equipment they use for swaging and if they have any testing facilities.
You may decide to do the job with the mast up. It is doable but more labour intensive and it might cost you more than unstrepping the mast In any case, when the mast is down it will give you the opportunity to carry out a thorough inspection of the upper regions and give you some peace of mind that all's well up there -for the time being.

 

[nimbusgb]

Just a thought. How about the RYA takes on the task of collecting a significant number of 'replaced rigs' and having them tested to destruction to see if there is really any merit in this apparently ridiculous requirement?

 

[misterg]

I am looking to buy a boat about 10 years old. This probably means it will have it's original standing rigging but the insurance company will want it renewed.

Probably the way it will work will be that your pre-purchase survey will identify that the rigging is over 10 yrs old & *recommend* replacement. Insurance co. will offer cover provided that survey recommendations (non specific) are addressed. (Always worth discussing it with ins. co. though.)

But anyway:

What is a ballpark figure for putting new standing rigging on a typical 32 foot boat with single spreaders?

£850 + crane charges (32' last year, N. Wales). Was warned about not being able to dismantle furler, so went down there with WD40, spanners & a blowlamp and loosened it before they started. Probably need to add VAT to the £850, too (rigging co. wasn't VAT registered at the time, but is now).

Andy

 

[Leonidas]

Just a thought. How about the RYA takes on the task of collecting a significant number of 'replaced rigs' and having them tested to destruction to see if there is really any merit in this apparently ridiculous requirement?

Or at least pursuade the insurers that they should accept the test of any stay or shroud picked up at random . If it proves to comply with testing requirements, then to wave the need for a complete replacement of the whole lot.

 

[pwc51]

Like Misterg we did our Channel 32 about 18 months ago - £750 Plus craneage. It was our decision as mast had been up for 18 years and we began to feel uncomfortable .... The task was really very straightforward - we simply sent the old rigging and the new rigging was delivered the same size!

 

[johnalison]

Just to cheer you up, I was reading a discussion about this topic elsewhere and apparently the most likely time for a rig to fail is in its first year! Does anyone have some 2yr old rigging for sale?

 

[misterg]

Or at least pursuade the insurers that they should accept the test of any stay or shroud picked up at random . If it proves to comply with testing requirements, then to wave the need for a complete replacement of the whole lot.

I'm not convinced that the insurers see it as a 'hard and fast' requirement. I vaguely recall (sorry) that a visual inspection and report by a rigger may be accepted; There is also a technique whereby the electrical resistance of the rigging terminals is checked (in-situ, I presume) to verify their integrity, so well worth discussing with your insurer. (Plug for Bill Southgate of Bishop Skinner here - I had a thoroughly sensible conversation with him about the survey on our boat, and without wishing to misrepresent him, he was genuinely more concerned with double-clipping hoses below the waterline and fitting a bilge pump than he was about the 12 year old standing rigging.)

I don't see much point in the suggestion to test the old rigging:

Stranded wires, cracked terminals and external corrosion should be picked up on inspection anyway, but the big issue with stainless rigging is that it is susceptible to crevice corrosion. By its nature this takes place where you can't see it and is unpredictable. You could take all the rigging off and have it X-rayed (or similar), but it's cheaper just to replace it after a nominal life.

I don't think that there's any argument that the '10 year rule' is conservative - I guess it has been arrived at as a round number through the experience of rigging companies - but whatever the life is, it mustn't be so long that there is an appreciably increased risk of the rigging failing. Ergo: rigging tested at the end of that 'life' shouldn't show significantly increased probability of failure.

Andy

 

[trapezeartist]

Thanks for all the helpful advice. It certainly helps to clarify the picture. I'm not talking about a specific boat at the moment: I'm still searching. However, the boat will almost certainly be bought from somewhere around the south of England, say between Ipswich and Milford Haven. (Yes, I know Milford Haven is in Wales.)

I'm not entirely surprised that most rigging failures happen in the first year. It's very hard to test rigging without breaking it, so we're really relying on the job being done properly and then it must be right (mustn't it?).

Given the problems of non-destructive testing of rigging, I can understand insurance companies' desire to draw a line under the life of it. It does seem very crude to just come up with a one-size-fits-all age limit though. Surely some rigs will be working much closer to their ultimate limit than others.

 

[jason -and the arguenauts]

I am looking to buy a boat about 10 years old. This probably means it will have it's original standing rigging but the insurance company will want it renewed. What is a ballpark figure for putting new standing rigging on a typical 32 foot boat with single spreaders?

Just done the job on a 36 footer with twin spreaders, fore and aft lowers, forestay, backstay and intermediates. Excluding the extra for the Stalok insulators for SSB the cost was £800 for the rigging. That was from Z spars who I have used twice before for re-rigging and who do an excellent job. Add to that whatever it will cost to get the mast down and up again.

I have in the past replaced forestay with the mast up but I wouldnt recommend it unless you are relaxed with the idea of being up a mast with no forestay.

Ring Z spars and ask for Craig.

 

[Salty John]

I am looking to buy a boat about 10 years old. This probably means it will have it's original standing rigging but the insurance company will want it renewed. What is a ballpark figure for putting new standing rigging on a typical 32 foot boat with single spreaders?

Allow about £1500.

 

[Pete7]

Is it normal to re-use the turnbuckles etc? do they not suffer the same problems as the wire?

Pete

 

[Leonidas]

Is it normal to re-use the turnbuckles etc? do they not suffer the same problems as the wire?

Pete

Yes, if they are stripped down ,examined and dye checked for cracks, corrosion or damaged threads.

 

[Ubergeekian]

I am looking to buy a boat about 10 years old. This probably means it will have it's original standing rigging but the insurance company will want it renewed. What is a ballpark figure for putting new standing rigging on a typical 32 foot boat with single spreaders?

The Jimmy Green marine website has an order-your-rigging-o-matic which will let you know. Assuming 5mm stainless, it's £3.50/m plus £10 per eye at the end (other terminals cost more).

A 32' boat probably has a 10m mast, so that's £55 per masthead stay (10 x £3.50 + 2 x £10) and £40 per inner/babystay (6 x £3.50 + 2 x £10). Four of the former, three of the latter, £340.

You'll also need to budget for a crane if you don't do this when the mast is down anyway and for the two riggings screws which you will inevitably bend at some point in the proceedings.