New-gen autopilots. Any good ones?

[dom]

Maybe I've misunderstood your question, but virtually all current autopilots will steer a decent course relative to the wind, as long as the wind data exists on the network. Just how steady the course is will depend to some extent on sail trim and boat characteristics.

Apols if unclear; basically in even a F6/7 my current prehistoric B&G AP (H1000 genre) becomes ponderous to the point of dangerous, and much above that one really wants to hand steer, like really! Uphill (even on an easy to sail boat with a decent selection of laminate sails), and in anything much over a F3, the AP expends a lot of energy through its persistent inability to settle itself down, get in the groove and stay there. It just saws away wasting energy and is generally annoying.

Now from the racing side I'm familiar with the fancier NKE/Hercules gear, which after playing around with a laptop for a while are quite simply beautiful, but ££££ :ambivalence:

What I'm looking for is basically to spend the least dosh that I can on an AP I can rely upon in a blow ...and the reason I sail in blows is simply that with limited time, what else can one do in good old Blighty?

 

[pvb]

Apols if unclear; basically in even a F6/7 my current prehistoric B&G AP (H1000 genre) becomes ponderous to the point of dangerous, and much above that one really wants to hand steer, like really! Uphill (even on an easy to sail boat with a decent selection of laminate sails), and in anything much over a F3, the AP expends a lot of energy through its persistent inability to settle itself down, get in the groove and stay there. It just saws away wasting energy and is generally annoying.

Ah, understand. I think the answer lies in your own term "prehistoric". Current autopilots have much better electronics and programming than old ones. Equally, they have more user-selectable parameters, enabling better matching of the autopilot's performance to the boat's characteristics.

 

[Twister_Ken]

I have a one of Raymarine's SPX10s (now superceded) which coped admirable with a dead run in rolly conditions in the Alderney Race, big rollers reaching across Biscay, and light airs beating in the Med. I suspect the latest generation of the same (or maybe its big bruv if you've still got the 47.7) would be quite good enough.

 

[dom]

I have a one of Raymarine's SPX10s (now superceded) which coped admirable with a dead run in rolly conditions in the Alderney Race, big rollers reaching across Biscay, and light airs beating in the Med. I suspect the latest generation of the same (or maybe its big bruv if you've still got the 47.7) would be quite good enough.

Well that's as sound a test as any! ...it would seem that Raymarine kit is much better than I thought. I'll visit the big three at the LIBS next week and make a final decision then. The good news is that the big three have quite clearly made great progress with both rate-sensors and better software and it would seem that they all would work just fine.

What I might end up doing is going with B&G, especially if they agree a generous trade-in on Triton processor against a Hydra/Hercules one if it doesn't adequately do the job, which I'm sure it will. Either way, tks for all the input and I'll stick a proper review up here if that helps anyone.

 

[RobbieW]

Something thats been alluded to here is that the actuator needs to be up to the job. My boat, Rival 41 at c. 13 tonnes, had a knackered type 1 electric actuator when I bought her. I replaced that with a Type 2 coupled to the existing Raymarine S3G - thats works well enough in up to 40 kts (thats as far as I've tested it!) but it does help to try and balance the rig. So while Javelins link is interesting on the electronics side, it needs an actuator for a working system.

dom, if your actuator is adequate and working then coupling that to updated electronics may reduce the overall cost - a Type 2 linear actuator is now around 1600 quid. Theres nothing 'special' about them so it should be agnostic so far as the electronics are concerned.

 

[neil1967]

I'm currently looking at replacing the electronics of our autohelm (an AH6000), which looks to have died (final investigations this weekend). As far as I can tell it uses a Raymarine/Autohelm Type 1 linear actuator/ram, which I believe is still serviceable. It is operating at the top of its capacity (Vivere weighs around 12 tons), but I hope to re-use the drive and just connect new Raymarine (EV-1/ACU200) or Garmin GHP12 electronics. I am erring towards the Garmin, as my backbone network is NMEA2000 rather than SeaTalk NG, and also the GHP12 will handle a bigger drive unit if I subsequently want to upgrade it, whereas with the Raymarine I would need to buy the bigger, more expensive, ACU300 for future proofing. Any feedback from anyone that has done this would be much appreciated.

 

[pvb]

I'm currently looking at replacing the electronics of our autohelm (an AH6000), which looks to have died (final investigations this weekend). As far as I can tell it uses a Raymarine/Autohelm Type 1 linear actuator/ram, which I believe is still serviceable. It is operating at the top of its capacity (Vivere weighs around 12 tons), but I hope to re-use the drive and just connect new Raymarine (EV-1/ACU200) or Garmin GHP12 electronics. I am erring towards the Garmin, as my backbone network is NMEA2000 rather than SeaTalk NG, and also the GHP12 will handle a bigger drive unit if I subsequently want to upgrade it, whereas with the Raymarine I would need to buy the bigger, more expensive, ACU300 for future proofing. Any feedback from anyone that has done this would be much appreciated.

The old Type 1 linear drive is one of the wonders of the marine world - a piece of kit which just seems to keep on doing the job for years and years! The Type 1 in my old boat was 24 years old and still going strong when I sold the boat.

I have a GHP12 system in my new boat and it certainly seems to be very good. With its bigger current capability and NMEA2000 plug-and-play convenience, it would seem to be a logical choice for you.

 

[knuterikt]

I'm currently looking at replacing the electronics of our autohelm (an AH6000), which looks to have died (final investigations this weekend). As far as I can tell it uses a Raymarine/Autohelm Type 1 linear actuator/ram, which I believe is still serviceable. It is operating at the top of its capacity (Vivere weighs around 12 tons), but I hope to re-use the drive and just connect new Raymarine (EV-1/ACU200) or Garmin GHP12 electronics. I am erring towards the Garmin, as my backbone network is NMEA2000 rather than SeaTalk NG, and also the GHP12 will handle a bigger drive unit if I subsequently want to upgrade it, whereas with the Raymarine I would need to buy the bigger, more expensive, ACU300 for future proofing. Any feedback from anyone that has done this would be much appreciated.

I have a mixed NMEA 2000 / SeatalkNG network on my boat.
Autopilot is a Raymarine EV-200, with a Jefa LD100 Linear drive
Plotter is Furuno
Wind/log/depth sensors is the old Raymarine, linked to the network using ITC-5, display Raymarine i70
AIS is em-trak AIS B100

No problems with this mix (Cabling is SeatalkNG with adapter cables for the NMEA 2000 stuff)

It looks as if the EV series from Raymarine and the new GHP12 from Garmin are using the same type of sensors in their new kits.

We upgraded the AP from a Coursemaster CM851, to the EV-200.
Installation was easier - new cabling system
Setup was much easier.
The new AP uses less rudder movements to keep the boat on course = less power and smoother sailing.

Have not tested it upwind in choppy conditions. But with the old AP we could see that the wind sensor got confused every time the both lost speed into a wave (it started to oscillate), we concluded that this was the main problem going upwind in choppy conditions.

I saw that Garmin has got a new wind sensor design - don't know if that will give more stable wind data.

 

[dom]

dom, if your actuator is adequate and working then coupling that to updated electronics may reduce the overall cost - a Type 2 linear actuator is now around 1600 quid. Theres nothing 'special' about them so it should be agnostic so far as the electronics are concerned.

Fully agree with this point. I currently have a hydraulic Lecomble & Schmitt Type 2 linear drive which I intend to keep. FWIW the general rule of thumb in racing is to spec a drive that is a good 50% over the expected max loads, an especially important calc for non-balanced rudders.

Like you I'm also agnostic as to these gadgets, but some of the puritans claim that a hydraulic drive when disconnected and operating with an open bypass valve spoils the "feel" of the helm. These guys will swear to this, but others (like me) see them as a bit like the buffs who listen to their Hi-Fis fearful of hearing some any imperfection

 

[Dockhead]

It's been a long time since heading sensors were proprietary to the pilot.

No matter how good the pilot computer is, it won't work well without good stabilized heading data. In my experience, the quality of heading data is actually more important than the pilot computer itself, as all of those are fairly decent in my experience. There have been great leaps forward in heading sensor technology in the last 10 years.

I use an Airmar H2183 heading sensor, three-axis gyro stabilized. It outputs both NMEA2000 and NMEA0183 and so is compatible with most pilots made in this century.

Even better are satellite compasses like the Furuno SC-50, which achieve dynamic accuracy of less than a degree. But you pay for that.

Accurate heading data is not only important for good pilot performance, but also for radar overlay, radar bearings, and other nav functions.