New 2 stroke outboard?

One can still buy a legal, new 2stroke in the Channel Islands. A mate has just bought a new Tohatsu 3.5.

Because Jersey and Gurnsey are not part of the EU.

There is little in the way of checks made should you buy a two-stroke out of the EU and bring it to the UK on your boat as the UK authorities have little understanding of the Recreational Craft Directive RCD.

The Department for Business Innovation and Skills told me frankly that they have too few resources and time to investigate issues concerning yachts, boats and the RCD.

I reported on a new 31 Cat A (Ocean going) yacht (built during 2011) that the dealer of was concerned that it was defective. I inspected it and found a lot of faults, some of which were serious and which would have meant that the yacht did not satisfy the requirements of the RCD. I complained that the yacht should not have been signed off by the Notified Body that was given the task of checking its type. The builder told me that the yacht that they presented was “even worse than this one” and that had been signed off. The Notified Body failed to note the serious defects; one was that the gas locker drain hose was missing! My report shamed the builder into modifying the yacht and repairing all of the defects, which took a lot of time and money but my compliant to our UK government about the Notified Body whose name was on the yachts certificate of Declaration of Conformity with the RCD has so far got nowhere.
The Department of Skills, Innovation and Enterprise simply forwarded my email of complaint directly the Notified Body! Who then said that the yacht was a prototype and wrote directly to me threatening me if I complained too much. Another email to our government demanding that all sister ships are recalled for safety checks and modifications was ignored. The Notified Body also forwarded my email of complaint, which was forwarded to them without my consent, to the yacht building company, whose owner personally sent me a threatening email telling me to stop.

The yachts UK dealer worked hard to ensure that he was selling a well made and safe product, he should be commended and has acted correctly but the European Notified Body, the yachts builder and our UK government have acted shamefully as potentially dangerous yachts are still out there unchecked. The yacht was NOT a prototype as it was being sold as a standard production yacht and my client paid good money for it. It is hull number three which means that No 1 and 2 plus later built boats that were sold carry the same potential defects.

The Notified Body, that is based in a central European Country in the first world failed in my opinion to properly supervise and check the essential safety requirements of this yacht type. They don’t have to check and sign off each one but had checked the first sample yacht offered up for inspection (“even worse than this one”) and missed so many defects.
Last year I reported a used boat dealer to Trading Standards as the CE plate in the cockpit looked fraudulent. The boat was an American Sea Ray 27 but the CE plate had Bayliner 255 on it. The dealer refused to show me the builder’s certificate and certificate of declaration to the RCD which confirmed to me that it was a grey import and would not comply with the RCD. It looked as if he had just robbed a CE plate off another boat and stuck it on with double-sides as it was not even level. The complaint to Trading Standards fell on deaf ears and I simply advised my client to not buy the boat. The above has happened to me lots of times BTW.
Boats and engines sold new within the EU must have a certificate of conformity with the Recreational Craft Directive. This certificate must be signed by the builder who declares that it complies with the relevant ISO standards which apply to that engine, boat, yacht or fridge. The certificate must also carry the four digit identity number of the Notified Body, whose task it was to check that it conforms. This number must also be on a small CE plate or sticker that is stuck onto the engine, fridge or in the cockpit of the boat. Without these two items dealers can’t sell the product.
However, it is rumoured that the Chinese use a similar logo to the CE mark that they call the Chinese Export mark. I have not seen one myself but I understand that it was designed to look very similar.

In other words, and to get back to the question. If you are an individual and want to buy a two-stroke outboard for use on your own boat there would be no one to stop you as no one in officialdom would understand the rules and laws and no one would bother you.
Nick Vass
 
I know someone in the Irish Republic who bought a Mariner 5 2-stroke new, a year ago.

The dealer had spotted the upcoming demand for decent lightweight engines and ordered a large number in...

I have no idea of the import regulations to the UK, but expect they are awkward.

Might be alright if one sailed over there and paid cash...

As for the environment, Dylan these things run on 100:1 mixture and are very 'clean', not to be confused with Seagulls leaving a slick behind them !
 
Contrails

Going on from previous comments about the environment and 2-strokes, it's now quite a well known thing that jet airliner contrails have a major negative effect.

After 9/11 when everything was grounded, the average temperature in the Northern hemisphere rose 1 degree C...I was one of those stuck on the ground and thought the balmy weather was just a coincidence, but now I think about it...

I discussed this with a Chief Test Pilot I'd happily trust my life to, and he goes along with it.
 
There is little in the way of checks made should you buy a two-stroke out of the EU and bring it to the UK on your boat as the UK authorities have little understanding of the Recreational Craft Directive RCD.

The Department for Business Innovation and Skills told me frankly that they have too few resources and time to investigate issues concerning yachts, boats and the RCD.
Does that mean Tom Cunlife has wasted his money caning his new Mason 44 over the RCD sticks ?

I ask because this topic crops up from time to time on these forums and someone here posted that is is trading standards who have responsibility for enforcing the RCD and that their right to take action expires 1 year after import. Any comments on that ?

(Note - I have no intention of importing a boat from outside the ECA).

Boo2
 
Going on from previous comments about the environment and 2-strokes, it's now quite a well known thing that jet airliner contrails have a major negative effect.

After 9/11 when everything was grounded, the average temperature in the Northern hemisphere rose 1 degree C...I was one of those stuck on the ground and thought the balmy weather was just a coincidence, but now I think about it...

I discussed this with a Chief Test Pilot I'd happily trust my life to, and he goes along with it.

Does that mean that you are gounding your jump jet then Andy?

Will you stop flying on airline planes?
 
Recreational Craft Directive. RCD

Does that mean Tom Cunlife has wasted his money caning his new Mason 44 over the RCD sticks ?

I ask because this topic crops up from time to time on these forums and someone here posted that is is trading standards who have responsibility for enforcing the RCD and that their right to take action expires 1 year after import. Any comments on that ?

(Note - I have no intention of importing a boat from outside the ECA).

Boo2

No. You might have misunderstood. It is right and proper to buy a yacht that complies with the standards of the RCD or to make it complient if impoorted or built at home.

A broker would not be able to sell your boat, if you chose to sell it, if it was built after 1998 and did not have a CE plate and if it did not comply with the RCD. There are some exemptions though.

The ISO standards that make up the RCD are sensible and it is not my place to comment on whether they are good or not.

What I was trying to say was:

Even if a yacht has a CE plate in the cockpit and has a declaration of conformity with the Recreational Craft Directive does not always mean that it actually complies and was properly tested or was tested at all!

Yes, Tom Cunlife was right to jump through the hoops and get it CE certified as his boat is properly legal, can be insured and he is at liberty to sell it within the EU if he wanted to. He has done things properly.

Concerning the yachts that I have inspected myself. I have come across many that have dubious CE plates, many with no CE plate at all, many with made up certification with no mention of Notified Body ID number, many grey imports and several where owners have tried and are trying to take yacht builders to task as they suspect that the yacht does not comply.

My concern is that the mechanism to check certification and follow things up when an issue is found is not good enough.

During the last episode Trading Standards local to where the yacht is kept, put me onto the Department of Business, Innovation and Skills as they said that they lacked knowledge of the subject. Hampshire County Council Trading Standards is better but they would not deal with it as the yacht is not in Hampshire! Hants CC Trading Standards check boats at Southampton Boat Show.

I notified Cornwall Trading Standards, based in Truro when I discovered a stolen CE plate on an American sports motor cruiser. They did not have a clue what to do and told me to report it to the Police. I did this but got nowhere.

I can't see how there would be a time limit on action that can be taken by Trading Standards? I'm more concerned that they would not do anything in the first place.

When I dealt with an RCD Policy Directive Advisor at the dept of Business, Innovation and Skills, I very much got the impression that it was all too much trouble and they really could not be bothered.

I was told by Trading standards that RCD issues are dealt with by the Department of Business, Innovation and Skills. The MCA, who gave me this particular RCD Policy Directive Advisors contact details. Without the help of the MCA I would not have even got that far!

The fault is with our government and infrastructure and not with the RCD standards or the RCD in theory or general.
 
16356308.png


Quote "The latest saga consists of equipment that is labeled with a new label that I feel is now giving the consumer a false sense of security and leading the customer to assume that a product meets CE safety testing when it fact it does not. Of interest in particular to EU buyers here is the latest in new marketing concepts from some less than professional Mainland Chinese manufacturers that I have recently run into… a label that designates “China Export” and may be confused with the recognized “CE” product safety label. Compare the two labels".

http://www.qualityinspection.org/chinese-manufacturers-certificates/
 
16356308.png


Quote "The latest saga consists of equipment that is labeled with a new label that I feel is now giving the consumer a false sense of security and leading the customer to assume that a product meets CE safety testing when it fact it does not. Of interest in particular to EU buyers here is the latest in new marketing concepts from some less than professional Mainland Chinese manufacturers that I have recently run into… a label that designates “China Export” and may be confused with the recognized “CE” product safety label. Compare the two labels".

http://www.qualityinspection.org/chinese-manufacturers-certificates/

That is an old trick, back in the days when Japanese stuff was considered cheap tat, they created a new town called USA and everything made in the factories there was of course labelled 'Made in USA'.

The real problem is too many importers look at the price not the certification.
 
Does that mean that you are gounding your jump jet then Andy?

Will you stop flying on airline planes?

Nick,

I must point out I'm a photographer not a pilot; but this idiot 'government' grounded then gave away our Harriers, though other more clued up people are happy with them !

I never fly on airliners if I can possibly help it; on Cessna's I have a chance of landing the thing if the pilot slumps unconscious, don't laugh I've had this happen...

Chief Test Pilot John Farley at 30 feet, 300+ knots
JFarleyfly-by30-14.jpg
 
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Nice Harrier piccy!

I must admit that I've done many airliner miles though; its all the fault of my former employers, honest!

Cessna miles? Loved them, but almost all of them were upwards as skydiving is far more fun than being in ANY aircraft. (But I gave it all up to return to sailing...)
 
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