Navtex stations - database problems

[alanwilson]

But Circular 14 is dated 18/12/2012, so it's already 4 months out of date! And it still isn't available on their website! There doesn't seem to be an effort to keep the data up to date with amendments as they happen; instead, they seem to wait until there are a number of changes, then issue another circular (then don't make it available for months). Not especially helpful.

 

[Bilgediver]

But Circular 14 is dated 18/12/2012, so it's already 4 months out of date! And it still isn't available on their website! There doesn't seem to be an effort to keep the data up to date with amendments as they happen; instead, they seem to wait until there are a number of changes, then issue another circular (then don't make it available for months). Not especially helpful.

A USCG source has just advised me they have corrected the issue regarding the older Circular being on their website and now they are displaying Circular 14 which at this source there is no charge. It is a complex excersize keeping the world shipping updated regarding these resources and I think it is unfair to comment that the current Circuular is 4 months old. This information will no doubt be filtering through to all those other folk who include them in their websites

USCG...


http://www.navcen.uscg.gov/pdf/marcomms/imo/Circulars/GMDSS1_Circ14.pdf

 

[alanwilson]

Have to disagree: it's not a complex exercise at all. There should be a master database or document, held by the IMO with half a dozen people (to cope with holidays) in charge of it: they liaise with the relevant people in the countries concerned & keep the database/document up to date. Changes can then be made to the on-line version within an hour or so of new data being received, so yotties can be assured that the online version always has the very latest data. There should also be a specific route for notifying mariners by NtMs.
There is no excuse for an updated document taking 4 months to get on to the official website: at most it should take a day.
The problem is highlighted by responses from the UKHO: instead of simply making Navtex data available easily on their website, it is published in a printed document (ALRS) (ensuring delays in proof-reading & printing), then updated by NtMs - a tortuous bureaucratic waste of time that ignores the ease of modern electronic communications. So as a leisure sailor, I have to spend £45 on the ALRS volume, then wade through every NtM since it was published, just to get up to date Navtex station data.
Also, if you look at the comparative data in my document, you'll see that changes to the data simply do not filter through: over the three websites consulted, 90% of the stations have incorrect data listed. Not impressive.

 

[Bilgediver]

I don't know about a firmware update, but there is the facility to manually edit the database - that's where we started

Pete

Wot a lot of button pushing Pete....Wouldnt you prefer an update?????

 

[prv]

Wot a lot of button pushing Pete....Wouldnt you prefer an update?????

It would be nice . But I've already done all the button-pushing for anywhere I'm likely to go (not as ambitious as Alan's plans). Now I just need to get hold of a copy of this mythical "correct" document and see how the results of my button-pushing compare.

Pete

 

[Bilgediver]

It would be nice . But I've already done all the button-pushing for anywhere I'm likely to go (not as ambitious as Alan's plans). Now I just need to get hold of a copy of this mythical "correct" document and see how the results of my button-pushing compare.

Pete

It is available now on USCG as my previous post. They have corrected the issue of having the previous document still on the site. Alans comment are slowly having an effect. It seems certain key authorities were unaware of the currency of this information on their respective web sites.

 

[alanwilson]

Finally now got (fairly) definitive answers to the Navtex database problems.

IMO: they are responsible for collecting station data from the countries that run them. They publish a list of station data, but only about once a year (last one was in December 2012) and confirm that they will not make updated data available online.

UK Hydrographic Office: say leisure sailors must buy ALRS Vol 3 (£45), which is only published about once a year (last in July 2012), then download every weekly Notice to Mariners since that date to check for any changes. They confirm they will not make updated data available online.

ICS Electronics (manufacturers of the Navtex 6+ which I have): acknowledged there were serious problems with the station data on their website and have now corrected them, and are overhauling the automated way they update their online database from weekly NtMs. They have responded quickly and comprehensively, even though Navtex is no longer a major part of their business: full marks.

The other web sites don't seem to update their data regularly: forget them.

So unfortunately the official sources of data (IMO, UKHO) are determined not to grasp the opportunities given by instant online availability of data: the IMO will provide the data, but up to a year out of date; the UKHO will sell you the data (£45) but up to a year out of date & provide a tedious method of updating.

The best source of data is ICS, who make the station data available free and up to date: icselectronics.co.uk.

If you have an ICS Navtex and need to know more about exactly how the settings affect reception of transmissions (including how to check whether any station is being received and how to bypass the internal database filtering altogether), phone their very helpful tech support.

If you're interested, it looks as though the data problems (only 10% of stations had data correct across all the databases) seem to have originated from finger problems when manually entering the data originally (& not checking the data as it was entered), then possibly problems with automated updating routines, compounded by the updating routines not checking existing data (only changing updated data), so once data was in wrong, it stayed wrong. Also, the frequent slight position differences are probably due to different chart datums.

I can now go sailing round Greenland with some confidence that I will get weather reports by Navtex!

Alan Wilson