nasa clipper wireless wind system

[Seajet]

Your derisory dismissal of antifouling the log transducer seems to suggest you've never done it! There's no interference fit in a transducer, and the paint makes no difference to calibration. I and lots of other forum members use antifoul on transducers with great results.

Your quick snotty answer suggests you haven't applied thought !

I said I've tried antifoul on paddlewheel transducers; if I say I have, that means I have.

An interference fit can easily be accomplished with a layer of paint on the rotor tips, as I'd have hoped was obvious.

Paint on the vanes will have an effect varying dependent on thickness - I used to work on aircraft instrument calibration and such a crude set-up as a paddlewheel log would never be contemplated let alone with layers of paint; the same consideration for a short trip with aircraft systems should apply to long trips with such boat kit, especially if relied on for dead reckoning.

If you ' use a paddlewheel log with great results ' it's presumably a case of ' Look Ethel, we're doing 5 knots ! " on a Sunday afternoon rather than finding Tahiti over the horizon.

 

[pvb]

Your quick snotty answer suggests you haven't applied thought !

I said I've tried antifoul on paddlewheel transducers; if I say I have, that means I have.

An interference fit can easily be accomplished with a layer of paint on the rotor tips, as I'd have hoped was obvious.

Paint on the vanes will have an effect varying dependent on thickness - I used to work on aircraft instrument calibration and such a crude set-up as a paddlewheel log would never be contemplated let alone with layers of paint; the same consideration for a short trip with aircraft systems should apply to long trips with such boat kit, especially if relied on for dead reckoning.

If you ' use a paddlewheel log with great results ' it's presumably a case of ' Look Ethel, we're doing 5 knots ! " on a Sunday afternoon rather than finding Tahiti over the horizon.

If you have actually tried antifoul but have had problems, I can only assume you're rather heavy-handed in applying the paint. I'm sure your work on aircraft instruments was incredibly difficult, but paddlewheel logs aren't rocket science and work very well for most of us who inhabit the real world.

 

[lindsay]

Wow, never expected such an enthusiastic response. I normally use the liveaboard forum which rarely triggers off such a reaction.

As an 80 year old, single handed, year round liveaboard git in the Mediterranean for the last 18 years, i think its back to telltales when the Stowe finally gives up. Fyi the mast head unit stopped indicating wind speed ten years ago, and I found that it is absolutely unnecessary. The wind direction, however, is useful, but not worth the price of buying, getting installed and frigging about with maintenance of a unit costing several hundred pounds.

Thanks for all the replies. Very entertaining

 

[rotrax]

What a result-told the OP everything he needed to know-and a lot he did not, and entertained him as well!

The power of these pages amazes me............................

 

[AngusMcDoon]

I used to work on aircraft instrument calibration and such a crude set-up as a paddlewheel log would never be contemplated...

Ah yes, because a paddlewheel is not useful on an aeroplane it's therefore completely useless on a boat. I can see where you're coming from. Of course, the facts of the density of the fluids being different by a factor of 800, the phase of the fluids different, the speeds being measured different by a factor of a few hundred and the amount of money to spend on the instrument also many times greater for aviation all make no difference. Paddlewheels? Pah! Amateurs' kit.

 

[Seajet]

Angus,

don't be a deliberate dick all your life, I and possibly you know how aircraft instruments work and they don't include paddlewheels.

However I was present at probably one of the most significant British aircraft instrumentation moments of recent times, the Sea Harrier FSR2 trial leading to the shift of the pitot probe to the tailfin - embarassing as it was there on the intermediate prototype the Kestrel -so FRS2 became FA2.

the FRS2 probes were trying to go beside the world beating Blue Vixen radar - now incorporated into the Typhoon before it gets the laser/ EASAE job but you knew all this didn't you Angus ...

Paddlewheel transducers are as much use for navigation as McDonalds are for vegetarians.

 

[LittleSister]

I get irritated by NASA shaving costs by having inconveniently short connecting leads on their kit, and doing without on/off switches, but I've found their logs and echo sounders (various models) very reliable and satisfactory in performance. Their after-sales advice, spares and repair service is excellent.

I'd never heard of any problems with their logs before Seajet's rant. There was a Duet on our boat when we bought it about 7 or 8 years ago, which I replaced because the display had been smashed. (I didn't know then I could have just bought a replacement display LCD from NASA for a fraction of the price.) I just plugged the original log and echo transducers in, and they've been going fine all those years, and thousands of miles, since. (The transducers that came with the new head are still in their box.) I did replace the LCD screen about a year or 2 ago, as it had lost a couple of segments on the depth readout.

The log head does get fouled sometimes (East Coast), despite application some years of antifoul (which I haven't noticed affecting the calibration) but as far as I understand it that's common to all makes of thru-hull paddle wheel logs, and it's easy enough to withdraw the head and clean it off.

I have no experience of their wind instruments, but even allowing for the blind prejudice for and against NASA, they seem to have more problems reported than the other NASA kit. (Not that the other makes of wind instruments are immune.)

 

[AngusMcDoon]

don't be a deliberate dick all your life, I and possibly you know how aircraft instruments work and they don't include paddlewheels.

Aviation don't use them because the operating parameters are so completely different. That's why your claim that because they are not used in aviation they are therefore useless in marine applications is just your usual Harrier inspired Andy-wibble.

However I was present at probably one of the most significant British aircraft instrumentation moments of recent times, the Sea Harrier FSR2 trial leading to the shift of the pitot probe to the tailfin - embarassing as it was there on the intermediate prototype the Kestrel -so FRS2 became FA2.

the FRS2 probes were trying to go beside the world beating Blue Vixen radar - now incorporated into the Typhoon before it gets the laser/ EASAE job but you knew all this didn't you Angus ...

Well done. Have a gold star. I know nothing about military aviation or planes, so no, I didn't know. Or care. What it, or your CV, have to do with marine instrumentation only you can know. Or care.

Paddlewheel transducers are as much use for navigation as McDonalds are for vegetarians.

If you couldn't get on with one the last time you tried in 1972, fine, don't have one. Meanwhile, in the real world, everyone else...

 

[Seajet]

Little Sister,

I don't think my comment was a rant, I am just relating the experiences of myself and many others !

I dearly wish with this British Company that it was not the case.

 

[Buck Turgidson]

Nothing wrong with paddle wheels.

And I'm about 30 years more current on aircraft instrumentation than seajet.

;-)

 

[AngusMcDoon]

Little Sister,

I don't think my comment was a rant, I am just relating the experiences of myself and many others !

I dearly wish with this British Company that it was not the case.

Nasa are dominant in their niche of the market. They are cheap and cheerful but fulfill a market segment very well. No other manufacturer comes close to their prices. If they can run a successful company in their niche, good on them. For anyone wanting higher quality, there is plenty of choice.

 

[TSB240]

I get irritated by NASA shaving costs by having inconveniently short connecting leads on their kit, and doing without on/off switches, but I've found their logs and echo sounders (various models) very reliable and satisfactory in performance. Their after-sales advice, spares and repair service is excellent.

I'd never heard of any problems with their logs before Seajet's rant. There was a Duet on our boat when we bought it about 7 or 8 years ago, which I replaced because the display had been smashed. (I didn't know then I could have just bought a replacement display LCD from NASA for a fraction of the price.) I just plugged the original log and echo transducers in, and they've been going fine all those years, and thousands of miles, since. (The transducers that came with the new head are still in their box.) I did replace the LCD screen about a year or 2 ago, as it had lost a couple of segments on the depth readout.

The log head does get fouled sometimes (East Coast), despite application some years of antifoul (which I haven't noticed affecting the calibration) but as far as I understand it that's common to all makes of thru-hull paddle wheel logs, and it's easy enough to withdraw the head and clean it off.

I have no experience of their wind instruments, but even allowing for the blind prejudice for and against NASA, they seem to have more problems reported than the other NASA kit. (Not that the other makes of wind instruments are immune.)

Wonderfully balanced response!

I also had a full set of NASA instruments on our old boat. I have nothing but praise for them and found them easier to view than our Simrad gear currently in use. Paddle wheel magnets can go awol easily repaired with cheap spares from NASA

The gps repeater was one of the best pieces of kit I bought prior to having a chartplotter in the cockpit.

I think if you did a survey of the various posts on here about wind instruments you would find all brands seem to suffer as much as NASA do now. All I know is a replacement IS 15 simrad head unit is a lot moe expensive than a NASA unit.

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Simrad-IS...875502?hash=item35b78f19ee:g:bb4AAOxy0NtTEyqq
EEK!

 

[Seajet]

If you have actually tried antifoul but have had problems, I can only assume you're rather heavy-handed in applying the paint. I'm sure your work on aircraft instruments was incredibly difficult, but paddlewheel logs aren't rocket science and work very well for most of us who inhabit the real world.

 

[Seajet]

Ah you have me there PVB I only use thick gold leaf encrusted with the finest diamonds; I thought these would disrupt the boundary layer to give a better flow ?

 

[RichardS]

I would never have thought that a simple thing like a paddlewheel could generate so much heat!

Richard

 

[pvb]

Ah you have me there PVB I only use thick gold leaf encrusted with the finest diamonds; I thought these would disrupt the boundary layer to give a better flow ?

I always knew you were lying!

 

[Thedreamoneday]

I love some of the responses on this thread, it reminds me of 'Triggers' comments on Only Fools And Horses- 'I've had this brush for 25 years I've replaced the handle 6 times and the head 8 times'

Not meant to have a pop at anyone, just were my head went at 7am reading this!

 

[Seajet]

I always knew you were lying!

Idiot response, try googling the phrase ' joking '.

My original comments re paint stand true.

 

[mattnj]

Angus,

don't be a deliberate dick all your life, I and possibly you know how aircraft instruments work and they don't include paddlewheels.

However I was present at probably one of the most significant British aircraft instrumentation moments of recent times, the Sea Harrier FSR2 trial leading to the shift of the pitot probe to the tailfin - embarassing as it was there on the intermediate prototype the Kestrel -so FRS2 became FA2.

the FRS2 probes were trying to go beside the world beating Blue Vixen radar - now incorporated into the Typhoon before it gets the laser/ EASAE job but you knew all this didn't you Angus ...

Paddlewheel transducers are as much use for navigation as McDonalds are for vegetarians.

Oh dear.

You should edit/delete that post, it's just stupid. What are you on about?

 

[RichardS]

I always knew you were lying!

Idiot response, try googling the phrase ' joking '.

Richard