Motor Boat & Yachting March 2012

[PowerYachtBlog]

I purchase like a magazine a month from different titles some Italian some Brits and some US etc etc

But the issue and boat report of the Fairline 50 Squadron from MBY really got me thinking.
First of all the article is full of assumptions, being the boat tested in a river the tester assumes that the boat could take the same wind and seas in comfortable condition, albeit a difference in waves of 6 feet in height.
I was surprised by this assumption considering that in the MBY video test of the new 50 Targa (same hull), the tester says that the boat due to added bulkiness and beam slammed in head seas unless you slowed down to a couple of knots (what looked like 1 meter seas). The tester does not mention in all this the difference in deadrise from the 50 Phantom went less to 12.5 from 18. Which can make a difference especially in following seas. In head seas you will have to reduce a knot or 2, but usually if the entry forward is good (something Fairline always have) a flatter Vee can take a head sea more comfortable in slower speeds. At least that is my experience.
I also was dissapointed when the astern galley was mentioned the tester did not mention who produced this first on a medium sized yacht (Ferretti 630 and 510), and how the only competition for the 50 Squadron are the Sealine T50, an Princess 50 Mk.III.
Considering the MBY considers itself as best European mag of the year that is simply blind folded and just a protection to the British builders.
No Prestige 500, the top selling Azimut 50 (where everywhere I go I see loads of them).

Anyway nice read as usual.

 

[henryf]

There is no doubt that the magazine will be careful in what they say when reviewing one of their key advertisers products. You have to read between the lines a little bit. I'm not saying that's right, just how it is.

I read the review with a lot of interest given my purchasing position at the time. I'm not saying it put me off, more confirmed my thoughts and raised a few points I hadn't thought of.

One of problems with some of the other brands you mention - and there are others, is that without a central dealer (rather than brokerage offices around the country) and often no physical stock it's a bit tricky to get a test subject. The same is true for a would be punter and so you could argue they should only compare to physical boats available in the UK today.

As a buyer it would be great to have access to no punches pulled hard hitting reviews, the problem is I'm not sure manufactures would leap at the chance to put their products forward.

On a final point we read all the words, hang on every syllable but with what authority do the writers write? Are they owners of similar craft? Have they lived aboard them for weeks at a time? Are they designers skilled in the black arts required to match engine to hull, hull to sea and flushing toilet to pink bottom? I suspect more than a few reviews get written by people who will be writing about the new Vauxhall Vectra the following week and holiday cottages in the Cotswolds the next.

All the same I go out and chuck my four quid at the lad behind the counter most months

Henry

 

[Nick_H]

I agree with a few of your comments, though not really the last two sentences. At that size and type, British buyers buy British boats 90% of the time, so its no surprise they will be more interested in how it compares to the other boats they are considering buying. Unless pricing has changed then Azi50 is not really competition because it's in a different price bracket. On the other point, I really can't see why they should mention who first used a particular layout, who cares!

On the main question, I think it's a difficult balance for a UK mag, particularly when the boat builders (their advertisers) are all struggling. We've seen on here in the last couple of days that the magazine test reports can be a big factor in which boat a buyer chooses, so they have quite a responsibility, although that shouldn't extend to misrepresenting anything. They did make it quite clear the boat was only tested in a river however.

 

[PowerYachtBlog]

Is not the Sealine so much cheaper to the Fairline and in a difference league when it comes to price and luxury fit out inside.
I think both Azimut and Prestige have British dealers, and the price is not that much far off in the models. Fairline is not a cheap priced boat by all means.
Yes they did make it clear it was tested in a river, but by all means a wind with less to one feet waves comparing it to six foot changes all your circumstances. Four feet waves to the head start to become heavy seas for many crews.
Everyone is struggling at the moment. I think making a picture or presenting more alternative offers to the buyer of the mag is what is important. Testing the boat, giving it a headline picture, is already giving something back to the advertiser.

In the end Fairline has nothing to be afraid of some critism as they make one good of a production boat which can take it with the best.

 

[Hugo_Andreae]

Thanks for your comments. Our technical editor David Marsh is away at the moment testing a couple of (Jeanneau) Prestiges but I can comment on some of these points.

Firstly, while it's true that we don't often get to live on the test boats for days at a time, we do have a lot of experience of what makes a good boat. David Marsh is a trained naval architect who spent the first part of his career designing all manner of power and sailing craft. Since then he has tested, cruised on and reviewed many hundreds of different power boats of all shapes and sizes, far more in fact than most of the people who design, build and sell the craft we're reviewing. In that respect I am confident he is one of the most experienced, thorough and respected boat reporters in the world.

Of course he can only report within the limits of the test itself, which may or may not include a suitably rough passage. In some cases he can draw on his experience of the same or very similar hulls (eg the Targa 50) and speculate as to what it may be like but he will always make it clear when it is speculation and when it is based on actual test findings.

It is also true that we have a responsibility both to our readers and to the manufacturers to give a balanced report rather than one that is heavliy subjective or primarily written to entertain. Sales of individual models are so small in numbers that an MBY report can literally make or break a model or in some cases an entire yard, whereas even a Top Gear slating will barely make a dent in sales of Vauxhall Vectras.

With regards to the rivals column, we only ever have space for two major competitors to be mentioned alongside the main subject of the test. We try to choose the two boats which we feel are closest to the boat being tested in terms of size/type/style and what potential buyers are most likely to be comparing it with. In the case of a 50ft Fairline, the chances are it will be its two closest British rivals. We'd need another whole page if we were to list every possible competitor.

I hope this answers some of your questions.

Hugo

 

[Deleted User YDKXO]

I have to say I thought the same thing. The Sq50 looks very bulky next to the Phantom 50 and clearly Fairline has sacrificed a bit of seakindliness for interior volume. I'm not saying that's a bad business decision because that's a route a lot of builders have gone down and it clearly sells boats at boat shows (SS Man50 being a good example of that). Yes, I do agree that MBY/MBM are very one eyed when it comes to testing UK boats but then most of their advertising revenue comes from UK builders so you wouldn't expect them to do otherwise.
This pro British/anti foreign stance goes back a long time. I remember reading a test of an AZ43 or something like that by a certain Mr Bartlett of this parish and he droned on in the test about how unsafe it was to have the lower helm position on the port side. A couple of months later there was a test of a UK built Nelson and there was no mention at all of the fact that the lower helm on that boat was also on the port side

 

[stillwaters]

With regards to the rivals column, we only ever have space for two major competitors to be mentioned alongside the main subject of the test. We try to choose the two boats which we feel are closest to the boat being tested in terms of size/type/style and what potential buyers are most likely to be comparing it with. In the case of a 50ft Fairline, the chances are it will be its two closest British rivals. We'd need another whole page if we were to list every possible competitor.

I hope this answers some of your questions.

Hugo

Personally,I've always thought showing just a couple of rivals to the test boat extremely limiting and often quite pointless when there are clearly,in most instances,a number of other options available which,if also shown,would be far more helpful to would-be buyers. Whilst I think you've handled the rest of the issue raised in a very balanced manner,I for one,at least,am unable to see why you wouldn't want to devote a whole page,if not more,to some of the alternatives as I believe it could make your test articles even more interesting than at present.

 

[Trundlebug]

I think it makes a pleasant change for a small section of the UK media / publishing industry to have a positive stance on British built products. We could do with much more of it in other areas, then we might have a much bigger and stronger UK manufacturing industry.

I remember years ago reading regular Which? reports which seemed invariably strongly anti-British, biased against all manner of products: cars, kettles, washing machines whatever. The general attitude towards everything was "foreign, good, British bad" despite their supposed, and very nominal impartiality.

When the test results didn't match their bias they would sneer comments like "this product worked suprisingly well on test, but we don't think they'll all be this good"

I would like to think that many readers are wise enough to spot and read through any bias, but those that arean't should at least be encouraged to support UK manufacturing (and the UK economy) rather than automatically buy foreign by default because they're told it's always better.

I'm not xenophobic by any means, but it does irk me that large sections of the general media have for years seemed to think it's trendy to knock UK products, without any thought for the wider consequences.

Good on MBY and MBM then. At least they know which side they're bread's buttered, whilst maintaining reasonable objectivity.

 

[ari]

I suspect more than a few reviews get written by people who will be writing about the new Vauxhall Vectra the following week and holiday cottages in the Cotswolds the next.

Must admit I've always thought the exact opposite. It's always struck me that the testers from both mags seem to have a wealth of boat experience and are as well qualified to comment as anyone.

I've never got the impression that they're just inexperienced jobbing freelancers that are writing about cars, holidays, or whatever in between boat reviews. How long has David Marsh been with MBY for instance? Certainly as long as I can remember.

 

[Nick_H]

This pro British/anti foreign stance goes back a long time.

I agree that all boat reviews big up the good points and play down the bad (for advertising reasons, as you say), but that just means you have to read between the lines a bit.

I don't really agree that they're anti foreign though, I remember some foreign boats getting great write ups, and IIRC (don't have the copy in front of me) weren't a high proportion of the "boat of the year" awards given to foreign boats, at least in proportion to the number of foreign boats tested.

 

[Deleted User YDKXO]

I don't really agree that they're anti foreign though, I remember some foreign boats getting great write ups, and IIRC (don't have the copy in front of me) weren't a high proportion of the "boat of the year" awards given to foreign boats, at least in proportion to the number of foreign boats tested.

It was more apparent in the Bartlett days when the only good foreigner was a dead one

 

[Red]

Poweryachtbug - you mention that you also get Italian and American mags are their reports are based on assumptions. My experience is that they seldom bother to drive the boats, and some of the Italian mags just send the photographer and a bikini clad girl and write the report from material in the office.....

 

[timbartlett]

...
This pro British/anti foreign stance goes back a long time. I remember reading a test of an AZ43 or something like that by a certain Mr Bartlett of this parish and he droned on in the test about how unsafe it was to have the lower helm position on the port side. A couple of months later there was a test of a UK built Nelson and there was no mention at all of the fact that the lower helm on that boat was also on the port side

It was more apparent in the Bartlett days when the only good foreigner was a dead one

Yes, I saw the smileys. But the fact that you are "droning on" about my supposed prejudice suggests that you think there may be a grain of truth in it.

I can't remember every word of a boat report that I must have written at least 15 years ago, but I would be astonished if I devoted more than a passing comment to the port side helm position: if I did, I can assure you that it would not have been out of pro-british bias: starboard side or centre-line helm positions are pretty standard regardless of nationality.

 

[timbartlett]

Poweryachtbug - you mention that you also get Italian and American mags are their reports are based on assumptions. My experience is that they seldom bother to drive the boats, and some of the Italian mags just send the photographer and a bikini clad girl and write the report from material in the office.....

FWIW, I also write for a US boating magazine (not as a boat tester) All I can say is that if their tests are based on assumptions, and if they seldom bother to drive the boats, then I wonder why their boat testers have all bothered to get themselves qualified with the US equivalent of Yachtmaster Commercial Cerificates (and keep them in date) and why the magazine bothers flying them all over the USA.

What is noticable, however, is that their boat reports tend to be much less structured than ours: US magazines seem to be terrified of cross-headings.

 

[PowerYachtBlog]

Red, I wonder which Italian and US magazine you view.

I can give you a review of many Italian magazines and US;
Barche a Motore (which stands for Power boats) give a very detailed review of all including a list of 10 or more competitors with photo in half of a page. Including Brits and US producers + French.
Nautica magazine is very simple written Boat International stlye and give any major facts unless they really try them

Boat International is again a nice read but not much facts.
Power and Motor Yacht give quite a good review of the boat which I like, low planning speeds how wet and dry and they do go offshore with the boat.

 

[Locki]

I'm moored right next to a brand-new Squadron 50 and Targa 50 (I'm on my SQ55 snagging for the season).

They both have incredible presence for their length (because of their height), and the interior is incredible.

I think if you saw one moored 'alongside' you'd be quite shocked by the NINE square portholes.. It looks a little like a seventy-footer scaled down.

To anyone not in the know, the 50 looks as big as my 55 from the rear.

The Targa 58 is the best looking new hull version IMHO though.

 

[emibel98]

Funny how it is in the eye of the beholder. I was at Swanwick the other day casting an envious eye at all those new boats when I saw a turgid (sounds like) brown Fairline 50 squadron mooching about. An extraordinary colour and it looked like a slab sided, too tall, top heavy lump. More random and abstract than pretty and graceful. I wonder if it won't date ever so quickly as it is so different from what came before and likely from what will come next. Those Princesses down there though all look like from the same family however old they are, just sort of evolved. I don't know what is best for all, just me, and I am not an owner just an interested wannabe, but the Princess approach seems more like it to me....

 

[jfm]

Firstly, while it's true that we don't often get to live on the test boats for days at a time, we do have a lot of experience of what makes a good boat. David Marsh is a trained naval architect who spent the first part of his career designing all manner of power and sailing craft. Since then he has tested, cruised on and reviewed many hundreds of different power boats of all shapes and sizes, far more in fact than most of the people who design, build and sell the craft we're reviewing. In that respect I am confident he is one of the most experienced, thorough and respected boat reporters in the world.

Hugo, not particularly picking a fight and merely chucking in my $0.02, but you para above sums up the weaknesses in Dave's otherwise good reports. He majors on the stuff that is apparent to him as a guy allowed the drive the thing for a few hours but he totally misses out on what really matters to an owner/buyer, which is lunch. As tcm often used to write on here, the most fun you have on a boat is when you're stopped. All the things Dave covers are important,a bit, but ultimately a boat is a platform for having fun with your mates. Dave totally misses out is how well the boat works for that, becuase he's too interested in how nicely positioned the sodding raw water filters are. I got my boat about a year ago and my ratio of lunches to r/water filter clean outs is about 100:0 (and I'm really sure about that zero)

The other thing about Dave is he often writes a line saying a dashboard is nicely laid out when you can see from the picture that you have to get off your chair, stand on the floor, lean over some poxy useless switches for the battery link switch, all to tweak the range on the plotter. I'm sorry, but that just aint proper dashboard design.

But I'm mentioning only some small detials here and not picking a massive fight. I enjoy reading both Jack's and Dave's boat reports and the current team has done an all round great job in making the mag a much better read than it was a few years ago.

 

[Locki]

Actually John, in the video Dave talks quite a lot about making lunch on board

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y0-lrBsKqJw

 

[ari]

What JFM says is absolutely correct, however to my mind, what has come on a lot in boat magazines is in having moved from glorified brochures (a bit harsh perhaps, but it seemed to me to be little more than a description of the boat) to an actual feel for what the boat is like to drive.

So whilst lunching, and how the boat operates to simply be aboard is important, I can suss out a lot of that by looking at photos and layouts. What I like to read about is how the boat feels when on board, and how the boat drives and how it feels out on the water, whether it's particularly noisy, particularly quiet, whether you can see over the bow once on the plane, whether it tries to fall over when cornering. This is the stuff that I can't get from brochures or wandering round a boat show, and so this is what I want to read.

Yes, if the fuel filters are in a particularly stupid place it's worth noting, but I agree the very technical stuff is generally less interesting.

Finally, the vast majority of boats I read about I can't afford, but as an enthusiast I still want to know about them, same as I like to read about aircraft or nice places to visit or whatever. And I think the mag articles do a good job of providing consumer (ie potential buyer) info as well as enthusiast info.