More than 6 months in the Canaries/Spain and tax?

[davethedog]

Hello all, and as we are looking to head across to the Canaries soon (we are now in Cascais) been looking into things in a bit more detail and it appears that, even if you are an EU citizen (let's not go down the B word path) you can only spend 6 months in any year in Spanish areas (see the book section attached).



Question is, is this the case and are there any "work arounds"? Or are we stuck at 6 months per person in the Spanish areas per 365 days?

Cheers in advance

DTD

 

[Heckler]

Hello all, and as we are looking to head across to the Canaries soon (we are now in Cascais) been looking into things in a bit more detail and it appears that, even if you are an EU citizen (let's not go down the B word path) you can only spend 6 months in any year in Spanish areas (see the book section attached).

View attachment 79955

Question is, is this the case and are there any "work arounds"? Or are we stuck at 6 months per person in the Spanish areas per 365 days?

Cheers in advance

DTD

Yes, stay more than six months and you get in to residency and then wealth tax etc. However, break your stay and the clock resets. The boat staying there, at the mo, doesnt mean anything, its you that matters. Go to Portugal and we break the stay of the boat from the 1st of Jan so it isnt there for more than 6 months and you dodge the tax implications.

 

[davethedog]

Yes, stay more than six months and you get in to residency and then wealth tax etc. However, break your stay and the clock resets. The boat staying there, at the mo, doesnt mean anything, its you that matters. Go to Portugal and we break the stay of the boat from the 1st of Jan so it isnt there for more than 6 months and you dodge the tax implications.

Sorry, can you please explain a bit . ore, as in do you leave the boat there and just YOU go to Portugal?

 

[Trident]

We spend several years there and no one ever cared or noticed - unless you have a multi million super yacht the wealth tax wouldn't even be considered and the port police at marinas (we stayed in the same one 3 years running for winter) welcome you back each year and don't even ask for a passport because they have met you before. Its a complete non event and not worth worrying about - unless the unmentioned B word changes everything in which case you'll need a visa to stay more than 90 days anyway

 

[GHA]

+1 to trident, not likely to be a problem. Plus your screenshot said 180 days in a harbour with owner living onboard, so 6 months onboard without moving the boat - unlikely to happen or if it does, unlikely anyone will be bothered. Though new Las Palmas de Gran Canaria marina apparently has new rules forbidding you having a 'holiday home' moored up in their marina. >>

https://www.boe.es/boe/dias/2019/08/14/pdfs/BOE-A-2019-12065.pdf
– La utilización de las embarcaciones como vivienda habitual o vivienda para usodistinto de vivienda habitual, incluyendo la utilización de las embarcaciones para suexplotación con fines de alquiler vacacional, ya sea entre particulares o a través de lasplataformas electrónicas o empresas de cualquier tipo dedicadas a este tipo de actividad.

- The use of vessels as usual housing or housing for use
other than usual housing, including the use of boats for
exploitation for holiday rental purposes, either between individuals or through the
electronic platforms or companies of any kind dedicated to this type of activity.

 

[davethedog]

Thanks all and we are looking to depart Cascais thursday I reckon to head that way. Once there we will see what sh@t sandwich we get delivered regarding the B word as that may force our hand to head to the Caribbean instead of going to the Med next season. Issue being the boat we have now is ideal for the Med, as that was our plan, and will do the Caribbean but I am thinking we may need to look at another boat for this.

DTD

 

[t21]

Seems there are only issues if you loudly explain the situation to officialdom. So for example, you don't say "oh yes we've been here three years!" to authority types, however friendly, cos then they could helpfully arrange an invoice of hellish % of the boat. Legally-wise you should hop into other countries a bit. Illegally-wise you should keep your head down and not advertise the boat name too much on the web.

 

[sailaboutvic]

Seems there are only issues if you loudly explain the situation to officialdom. So for example, you don't say "oh yes we've been here three years!" to authority types, however friendly, cos then they could helpfully arrange an invoice of hellish % of the boat. Legally-wise you should hop into other countries a bit. Illegally-wise you should keep your head down and not advertise the boat name too much on the web.

Advertiseing the boat on the webs is a lot of people down falls In Many ways .
Last time we spend time in a marina in Spain was 2010 , one morning there where guys taken photos of all the boats including ours , we heard no more but a few did get a problem but it turned out the once that did where also living in apartment in Spain or running a business from their boats .

 

[davethedog]

:encouragement:

 

[PlanB]

And for the tax resident issue it's not 183 days in any 365, the year runs from 1 Jan to 31 Dec so you can do, say, Aug to Apr no problem. And it's you, not the boat.

 

[RupertW]

Don’t quite understand the logic of Carribbean and Brexit - we have just come from Med to Canaries and will go to the Carribbean in a years time, but don’t see Brexit as relevant to the situation.

We will just be tied to 90 days per 180 when we get back to the Med. but our boat can stay there indefinitely.

 

[steve yates]

so is this only 6 months of any 12 month period or is it no more than 6 months, ie, can you fly home, fly back a few days later and reset the clock on the 6 months?

 

[davethedog]

Don’t quite understand the logic of Carribbean and Brexit - we have just come from Med to Canaries and will go to the Carribbean in a years time, but don’t see Brexit as relevant to the situation.

We will just be tied to 90 days per 180 when we get back to the Med. but our boat can stay there indefinitely.

Forgot to mention, we have a dog with us too and that precludes us both going back for long periods to the Uk or leaving the boat.

 

[macd]

Don’t quite understand the logic of Carribbean and Brexit - we have just come from Med to Canaries and will go to the Carribbean in a years time, but don’t see Brexit as relevant to the situation.

We will just be tied to 90 days per 180 when we get back to the Med. but our boat can stay there indefinitely.

An obvious issue that might arise with an Atlantic circuit followed by remaining in the (EU) Med is that the Azores (along with Madeira, and the Canaries), are part of Schengen. So spending any significant time in the Azores on the return would subtract from your allowance in the European EU. A pity, since the Azores are well worth lingering amongst.

The French and, I think, Dutch possessions in the Caribbean have the same 90-in-180 limit as the rest of the EU but are NOT part of Schengen, so would not detract from your time in the European EU.

 

[webcraft]

+1 to trident, not likely to be a problem. Plus your screenshot said 180 days in a harbour with owner living onboard, so 6 months onboard without moving the boat - unlikely to happen or if it does, unlikely anyone will be bothered. Though new Las Palmas de Gran Canaria marina apparently has new rules forbidding you having a 'holiday home' moored up in their marina. >>

https://www.boe.es/boe/dias/2019/08/14/pdfs/BOE-A-2019-12065.pdf
– La utilización de las embarcaciones como vivienda habitual o vivienda para usodistinto de vivienda habitual, incluyendo la utilización de las embarcaciones para suexplotación con fines de alquiler vacacional, ya sea entre particulares o a través de lasplataformas electrónicas o empresas de cualquier tipo dedicadas a este tipo de actividad.

- The use of vessels as usual housing or housing for use
other than usual housing, including the use of boats for
exploitation for holiday rental purposes, either between individuals or through the
electronic platforms or companies of any kind dedicated to this type of activity.

Bad news re. Las Palmas and holiday boats, as we were thinking of doing exactly this - basing a (little, old) boat in the Canaries and subsidising marina fees wit occasional Airbnb rental.

Not surprised though - there are now dozens of boats doing this.

- W

 

[macd]

so is this only 6 months of any 12 month period or is it no more than 6 months, ie, can you fly home, fly back a few days later and reset the clock on the 6 months?

It's a rolling 90 days in 180. If at any time you have spent 90 days in the previous 180 in Schengen, you will become a pumpkin at the next stroke of midnight (better known as an illegal alien). Yes, it equates to a gross of six months in 12 months, but is not the same. The clock cannot be re-set on it, unlike the boat's clock under Temporary Importation.

 

[STILL AFLOAT]

Bad news re. Las Palmas and holiday boats, as we were thinking of doing exactly this - basing a (little, old) boat in the Canaries and subsidising marina fees wit occasional Airbnb rental.

Not surprised though - there are now dozens of boats doing this.

- W

Yes, Las Palmas Marina now has a dedicated desk, with a computer guy, going through all the websites, as it was getting rediculous, with people bringing both 3 & 4 boats of various lengths, even a 45 ft motorboat, that was leased out for photo shoots etc.
They were blocking a lot of the visitors moorings, and yes, had to move, when the ARC turned up.
However yes, a lot of complaints, of Air B&B guests, smoking dope, on the foredecks.
The locals complained, and the marina shut them down, threatening thousands of euros in fines, or confiscating the offending boats !
My boat, has been in the same berth, since 2006, never had a problem, but I do fly abroad, at least twice a year , so , no problem there.
Of course due to my travels, I never burdened myself with animals, perhaps thats why Ive had it so easy !

 

[STILL AFLOAT]

Forgot to mention, we have a dog with us too and that precludes us both going back for long periods to the Uk or leaving the boat.

Then you just might have to accept, that you are going to be taxed , in Spain !
Yes, The Canaries, are tax fee islands !
However that only applies to purchasing goods...... fuel...food.. electronics...etc.
Income tax in the Canaries, is exactly the same, as in Spain.