Mirage 28 pre-purchase help - keel bolt issue

[calvong]

Hi all,

Posted a few days back on the Mirage as a first boat. Have agreed to purchase her but am negotiating on the price pending issues spotted during a pre-purchase check.

Below are pictures from the check. Got the outgoing owner to open all floor boards and storage areas to look at the hull.

These pictures are of the keel bolt housing closest to the bow. It looks like there is some water seepage and the bolt may be rusting within the GRP housing. When I push on the housing a drop or two of water forms where the rust mark breaks the housing. There is also a thin layer of water around the keel bolt housing but have been observing it for a few days as it's been raining and there is no active leak nor change in amount of water.

Think this shows that there is an issue with that particular keel bolt but is it something which may be critical?

Appreciate any views thanks.

 

[calvong]

A few more pics - the first is of the third keel bolt from bow. Housing seems ok but there's a thin layer of water around it. Might be residual from the pump. But will have to confirm

The second and third are from the roof above the quarter berth. There is a very localized area of sponge which is wet. No other water marks or dampness around. Might be from the pipe linking fresh water fill cap to tank.

Any advice from Mirage 28 owners on whether any of these issues are very worrying? Tks

 

[Keith 66]

I worked at Thames marine back in 1979-80. I dont think many fin keelers were built, they sometimes used to place paper cups over the bolts once they were torqued down & glass over them, this looks like your photos. On the bilge keelers the bolts were stainles steel studs screwed into the casting & i would suspect yours will have the same. Only way to check them is to cut the capping off & have a look.

 

[ghostlymoron]

I had a mirage 28 bilge keeler - lovely boat fast stable and roomy. I had a leak on the starboard side keel which was cured by dropping the keel and resealing the joint. There's some pictures on my photo bucket page. I'll put a link up when i'm at my computer. The bolts were fine. The cost was quite a bit.
Yours don't look rusty around the nuts so the water could be coming from somewhere else. You do need to investigate though although its not going to sink you.
If you've not paid for the boat, you should make a reduction for investigation and repair. What does your surveyor say?

 

[Laurie]

I'm no chemist, nor expert, but the idea of stainless in an anaerobic environment (glassed in/over, etc.) would worry me, as stainless eventually goes brittle in such an environment....doesn't it? Or have I got that wrong......?

 

[Tranona]

I'm no chemist, nor expert, but the idea of stainless in an anaerobic environment (glassed in/over, etc.) would worry me, as stainless eventually goes brittle in such an environment....doesn't it? Or have I got that wrong......?

Stainless is normally used in this application as usually the sealant used keeps moisture out. However if the sealant does fail water can get in and cause crevice corrosion. Probably would not see signs inside as in the photos, more likely to show as rust streaks weeping from the joint between the keel and hull. The advice to clean oof the tops of the nuts for inspection is sound.

 

[calvong]

Thanks all. Seems the way to go is to remove the GRP cap to inspect the stainless bolt. Anyone knows the best way to remove the cap?

 

[calvong]

Found one more issue w the boat which I'm very concerned about -

Noticed some wet streaks in the vinyl outer cover of a section in the bow v-berth, decided to investigate by removing all layers to expose the GRP hull. I found the entire section - from where the topside through deck bolts show, all the way down the length of the hull to where it meets the v-berth - damp and sour smelling. When I press on the section, some portions feel like there's a thin coat of clear sealant on it and is springy to touch; where as others seem fractured with shards of brittle material. Am really afraid it's a complete delamination of the section (approx 50cm by 80cm) am guessing due to leakage from the through deck bolts since the section is above-water? The only other possibility is that the sour smell / springy-brittle bits are due to the rotting from dampness of the glue / sealant used to hold the insulation foam to the hull? I'm really hoping it's not the former. A few more observations - when I tap on the hull it sounds like beyond this layer things are still solid and from the outside the GRP is smooth with no bumps.

Any ideas?

 

[KellysEye]

You've reached the point where I would walk away. It seems you didn't have a survey done before agreeing the purchase?

 

[calvong]

It's a bit of an unusual situation as the owner is overseas. Have placed a deposit on the boat and am looking to undertake the survey now.

 

[ianfr]

You've reached the point where I would walk away. It seems you didn't have a survey done before agreeing the purchase?

+1

Ian

 

[DoubleEnder]

No, too much that's too worrying. Water ingress in 3 places. Either negotiate a BIG price reduction and prepare to do a lot of investigation and remediation (or pay someone else to do that), or pull out. I'd do the latter. You don't need a survey, there's already plenty to justify either of those courses of action.