Might as well re-engine now I guess?

burgundyben said:
Have a careful look at John Deere marine engines.
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Not sure why he would want to do that when their smallest engine is 75hp - far more than he needs. There is plenty of choice in the 50-60hp range from Volvo, Beta, Yanmar, Nanni, Vetus etc that will be excellent replacements for his current engine.
 
My first reaction was to put myself firmly in the "fix the old one" camp, but reading on through the thread, I started to think that the labour involved in the repairs isn't very different from that involved in a replacement, so you're heading towards a good chunk of the cost of the new lump and you'll always be wondering when it's going to go crunch. (it probably never will if you look after it, but that's beside the point)

As lw395 says, IMHO, the time to change engine is when it starts to seriously impinge on use of the boat. When you get less use out of the boat because the engine is dodgy, then there is value in having a new one. It sounds to me as though you're at that stage so, assuming you can find the cash without too much pain, I'd go for the new lump. You'll never get your money back in cash terms, but if it keeps you adventurous for another 20 years, I'd say it's worth every penny!

There have been some discussions about an importer of Chinese engines that are significantly less expensive than the usual suspects and they seem to have a good rep.
 
Steve_N said:
It is a tricky one.

This is the beast by the way:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-ZKqsYM4EwQ
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It is, as you say, a fine decision.

That engine looks very clean and you would miss the sound of the old steamer. Any ideas about it's level of use or hours?
Eight thousand is a lot of money.

I would guess that Volvo might be worth £800/ £1000? So that is something.

I think I would replace it but I would not be happy with the decision.
 
The MD21b is a Peugeot automotive/tractor unit marinised by Volvo and well out of production but has a reputation for long life when used as a yacht auxiliary . Basic parts are getting very rare and were never that cheap so the engine has now reached the stage that whilst it is possible to keep it going you no longer feel fully confident in it . The only argument is how long you delay its replacement and at what point you have spent too much on the existing set up.
When the engine was fitted the choices were either fit a traditional purpose designed sea water cooled marine unit Volvo 17 or Bukh or Sabb equivalent or you could use a lightly loaded Peugeot or BMC or Perkins fresh water cooled marinised unit there was not that much in it cost wise and the MD21 was seen as the quality unit of that era
The current market is almost entirely dependant on high volume light tractor ,automotive or plant engines all of which are the same flywheel in the middle configuration so the range of choice is greater.
There is mention earlier in this post of reusing a sail drive but I am not sure that it actually applies in this case
There are several alternative engines that could be fitted in place and you will need to investigate which will be best suited to you but unless the transmission has been recently changed I would suggest changing the lot
 
Replace it with a modern engine of about 50 hp: it will be smaller, quieter, smoother and should be good for another 20+ years of reliability. You will be running it at efficient revs, and if you ever want to sell the boat and switch to smaller or bigger, it's very difficult to shift a boat with an old leaky-oily Volvo lump even if it runs fine. Every potential buyer will assume they need to spend £8-10K immediately on a replacement.
 
I replaced mine myself and its not quite a direct 'swap'. I ended up modifying engine mounts,new exhaust system,new flexible coupling,replacing fuel system,control panel obviously plus a few other bits like battery cables etc.
 
doug748 said:
Any ideas about it's level of use or hours?
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Not really. She'd had one previous owner who seemed to have used her mostly as a liveaboard in the Med. for most of the 20 years. I've receipts for a major top end overhaul including the machining of new valve guides and immediately prior to sale it had the injection pump reconditioned, I believe at the behest of the delivery skipper who was tasked with bringing her back to the UK for sale. That didn't go to plan and she ended up being put on a lorry in Portugal I think and hauled overland to Scotland - but that's a different story..

Now I come to think of it I pretty much factored in the cost of a new engine when I bought her so in some respects it's been paid for already, so I should probably just go for it. I'll get the yard to price up a Beta 50 - they are registered suppliers and have fitted a lot of Betas. It's a friendly family-run yard and we've been there for 7 or 8 years now. They have full engineering facilities and will I'm sure happily let me muck in and do as much of the work as I want. Plus all the various lifts would be part of the deal. The various gearbox and oil cooler options should hopefully allow me to keep my LH sterngear as is, just mating up to the existing Aquadrive, but I guess it won't be as simple as that in reality.

Looks like a project for this winter.
 
Steve

Reading between the lines of your posts I'd say you had already decided on a new engine and just wanted people to say you were doing the right thing. Maybe you have a missus like mine who'd say, "Why can't you repair it?" :D

If you've set your heart on a new engine, you won't be happy until you've got it. After all, it's only money!

Percy
 
I have finally bitten the bullet and I am replacing my 43 year old MD2B, and TBH I wish I had done so 5 years ago. Once you get to the stage where you know you will need to replace it within your ownership of the boat there is a lot to be said for doing it sooner rather than later - that way you get the benefit earlier for the same expenditure
 
jerrytug said:
I have a '70's MD3B, you can't get engines like that new, slow revving with a heavy flywheel, decompressors with knobs on, etc.
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In a word - Bukh

I am replacing my MD2B with a Bukh DV24. Okay it revs a bit higher but it has a heavy flywheel, flat torque curve, decompressor, starting handle and so on so I expect it to be better in every way.
 
Steve_N said:
I'm guessing at around £8000 for a replacement, possibly a bit less with lots of DIY, but this has always seemed too much to 'invest' but has been brought into focus by a £3400 quote to replace just the saloon and nav station upholstery.
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It seems you are certain on changing the engine and I would say it would make sense to get the benefit of the new engine. However I am concerned you could be spending too much on the new upholstry. For my boat I was quoted from £2500 upward depending on the fabric, but I am managing to get it all done with new foam for ............ £800! I did have to source the fabric and I found a remnant chenile at a quarter of the regular price and I will be making and fitting the buttons, but the £1700 saving makes me smile a lot. Even if I had to pay double that I would still have paid that as it saved me some money over what I had been quoted. It is difficult to get any reduction in price on a new engine, but you should be able to make a fairly large saving if you shop around.
 
Concerto said:
It seems you are certain on changing the engine and I would say it would make sense to get the benefit of the new engine. However I am concerned you could be spending too much on the new upholstry.
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Don't worry, that quote (£250/cushion!) was filed immediately in the bin but it did make £8000 for an engine seem more reasonable :-)
 
With the amount of work involved in fixing the old lump you could be looking at hefty labour bill. If that then uncovers other problems that are best fixed whilst it's out then your fix bill could go up substantially.

I would be inclined to shop around for something a little smaller than 60 horse and replace. IIRC old engines don't develop the full power anyway and if you're only using half of it then even a 40 may be enough. Take your time though to replace - think it through - identify any other changes that could more easily be made with engine out to make life simpler - e.g. better access to the engine for servicing if you're less flexible in 20 years time and then do it maybe next winter or the following one.
 
I have lost the link, but there was a thread about fitting a Chinese made diesel. I wonder if one of the Chinese engines might be a good replacement as they appeared to be low revving and solid engines a bit like the in the boat. As far as I can remember the price would leave quite a bit of change from £8,000.
 
I put a new engine into a 50 year boat. Nothing wrong with a new engine in an old boat, especially if you expect to keep her.

Budget a few £k for all the other stuff. Do the whole job, do it well, then enjoy years of simple maintainence.

My 14hp cost £3300 to buy and £3000 for all the other stuff from engine bed upwards, inc fitting.

I'd hope to get 20 years + trouble free service.
 
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