MD22 (Perkins Prima) lost litres of oil through filter seal

[Yngmar]

Wife had me chasing down an odd diesel smell. After inspecting the tank in vain, I opened the engine room door and found a big puddle of oil on the floor - outside the engine bilge, which is odd to begin with.

Dipstick is well below the minimum mark, with just 1 mm at the bottom of the stick. There must be at least 1-2 litres in the bilge, maybe more. The last motoring was nothing unusual, we came across the bay to re-anchor, maybe half an hour of engine time, no high rpm, nothing unusual. We did not get an engine alarm and nothing seemed off at that point. Coolant level is fine.

Looking all around the engine, the leak appears pretty obviously from the oil filter, specifically where it is sealed onto the housing. I haven't removed the filter yet, the rubber seal appears intact from visual inspection but may not be.

The last oil change was a bit over 100 hours ago, the filter changed with it at that point. It looks like a genuine Volvo filter, but it was sourced from eBay Italy, so may be a fake with no bypass valve, I will check when I remove it. The filter was spun on hand tight and this isn't my first oil change, plus it worked fine the first 100 hours. The engine hasn't made much trouble before apart from a stuck PCV breather valve, which has since been fixed (and the oil did not leave that way, that was the first thing I checked).

We're at anchor sittin out a Mistral, we have spare filters and enough oil to refill and would like to get the engine able to run again sooner rather than later in case of another bout of lousy weather.

I would now remove the filter, inspect the housing for damage, then replace with new filter and oil. All I can think of is either the seal failed or the filter is blocked and did not have a bypass valve or it didnt' work (but blocked with what?)

Any clever suggestions as to what might have caused this and anything else I should be checking?

 

[Boater Sam]

The filter bypass only opens if the filter is blocked.
If the filter has burst or blown the rubber ring out then the pressure release valve in the engine is stuck closed leading to high oil pressure.

 

[Yngmar]

Update, because I thought I'd ask for insights first and then start fiddling with things, I hadn't checked the filter yet. As soon as I touched it, I noticed it was very loose. Not enough to run out standing, but likely enough to squeeze past the seal with the engine running. I look in the engine room every time we run the watermaker, which was last two days ago. So I'm gussing it loosened itself after that and oozed out most of the oil.

If that's all it was, I'll be a happy puppy. Wife already a bit upset from the last bout of scary weather, even though we got away easy down in Sardinia.

Going to replace the filter anyways and if we have enough empty plastic bottles, the oil as well, otherwise I'll have to just top up. Then take a peek in the old filter. New one definitely has the bypass valve.

Sam, thanks, didn't think of that, but I assumed I would get an engine alarm if the oil pressure was high enough to open the relief valve?

 

[Beneteau381]

Update, because I thought I'd ask for insights first and then start fiddling with things, I hadn't checked the filter yet. As soon as I touched it, I noticed it was very loose. Not enough to run out standing, but likely enough to squeeze past the seal with the engine running. I look in the engine room every time we run the watermaker, which was last two days ago. So I'm gussing it loosened itself after that and oozed out most of the oil.

If that's all it was, I'll be a happy puppy. Wife already a bit upset from the last bout of scary weather, even though we got away easy down in Sardinia.

Going to replace the filter anyways and if we have enough empty plastic bottles, the oil as well, otherwise I'll have to just top up. Then take a peek in the old filter. New one definitely has the bypass valve.

Sam, thanks, didn't think of that, but I assumed I would get an engine alarm if the oil pressure was high enough to open the relief valve?

You have probably found the issue, loose oil filter, surprised you didnt get a low oil pressure warning. Just a headsup, I helped P4E with their development of a new oil pump for this engine. I have one sitting by my pooter if ever you think you need, a few beer tokens will be needed though! ??
Also, years ago i had a ford v6 in a Scimiter, it started bursting oil filters, the max pressure regulating valve was stuck, if you had anything like this going on itis very obvious

 

[Yngmar]

Looks like it! I've swapped the filter, topped up the oil (almost 2 litres, but I spilled some more while doing a flying filter swap), ran the engine for a bit in neutral at various rpm. So far the oil has been staying on the inside. So fingers crossed, that's all it was. I used both hands and some oomph to "hand tighten" the filter this time.

Odd the thing would stay put for 100+ hours and then decide to come lose. We had a storm the previous day and got knocked around a bit, but nothing that should impress the engine with all its vibrations going on anyways. Perhaps it just slowly came lose a degree at a time and picked this opportunity to ooze out the oil.

Also find it odd with there was no alarm with that much oil missing. We only ran it a short time, so perhaps the filter losened then and with the oil now warm, it oozed out after the engine was off. Then stopped as it cooled and became more viscous. The alarm tone and lights work. I think that's probably how it must've happened. So I guess it was lucky we noticed before starting it again! Must compliment wife on her nose.

Tossed a few adult diapers into the engine room bilge to soak it up and got an epic cleanup to look forward to tomorrow.

Thanks for the advice and offer of a new oil pump. Hopefully won't need it! ?

 

[ChromeDome]

You won't get an oil pressure alarm because the level is low. If it is so low the pump can't suck up enough to build pressure you will get a pressure alarm, but then it might too late for the engine

Oil level alarms are not common on old(ish) engines, I'm afraid.

I've seen a few cases where the seal from the old filter remained in place then the filter was removed. With the new filter screwed on one seal pushed the other out and a leak as described occurred.

 

[andsarkit]

I've seen a few cases where the seal from the old filter remained in place then the filter was removed. With the new filter screwed on one seal pushed the other out and a leak as described occurred.

This happened to me and with 2 seals in place the oil soon leaked out into the bilge. After about 20 minutes running the oil pressure alarm came on and I immediately stopped the engine. Luckily no harm was done and the engine has done many hundreds of trouble free hours since. Cleaning the deep bilge was a real PITA and was not done properly until I had the engine out the next year.
I now always check that the old filter is removed complete with the old seal.

 

[Zing]

I had something like that happen last season. Skipper put the filter on too loose. Ran the boat to the dock for haul out, no problem. Then 6 months on the hard filling the bilge up slowly with rain water (unseen). Launched without checking the bilge, started the engine. Soon after start up the low pressure buzzer went off, engine shut down and bilge inspected. 15 litres of oil in the bilge mixed with 100lts of rain water. The whole bilge sides, top to bottom coated with half dried oil. A full week to clean up. Messy isn’t quite the word.

 

[NormanS]

I had something like that happen last season. Skipper put the filter on too loose. Ran the boat to the dock for haul out, no problem. Then 6 months on the hard filling the bilge up slowly with rain water (unseen). Launched without checking the bilge, started the engine. Soon after start up the low pressure buzzer went off, engine shut down and bilge inspected. 15 litres of oil in the bilge mixed with 100lts of rain water. The whole bilge sides, top to bottom coated with half dried oil. A full week to clean up. Messy isn’t quite the word.

"Launched without checking the bilge". Nuff said. ?

 

[Zing]

"Launched without checking the bilge". Nuff said. ?

Maybe he did check. I don't know, just presumed no, but the yard doesn't allow pump outs on the hard and it is not easy to see it is oil in the deep bilge it is in.

 

[sailaboutvic]

@ymgmar I reckon all that wind you had must had roared throught the engine vent and untwisted the oil filter , ?
No really good you got it sorted .

 

[peter gibbs]

You won't get an oil pressure alarm because the level is low. If it is so low the pump can't suck up enough to build pressure you will get a pressure alarm, but then it might too late for the engine

Oil level alarms are not common on old(ish) engines, I'm afraid.

I've seen a few cases where the seal from the old filter remained in place then the filter was removed. With the new filter screwed on one seal pushed the other out and a leak as described occurred.

Looks like it! I've swapped the filter, topped up the oil (almost 2 litres, but I spilled some more while doing a flying filter swap), ran the engine for a bit in neutral at various rpm. So far the oil has been staying on the inside. So fingers crossed, that's all it was. I used both hands and some oomph to "hand tighten" the filter this time.

Odd the thing would stay put for 100+ hours and then decide to come lose. We had a storm the previous day and got knocked around a bit, but nothing that should impress the engine with all its vibrations going on anyways. Perhaps it just slowly came lose a degree at a time and picked this opportunity to ooze out the oil.

Also find it odd with there was no alarm with that much oil missing. We only ran it a short time, so perhaps the filter losened then and with the oil now warm, it oozed out after the engine was off. Then stopped as it cooled and became more viscous. The alarm tone and lights work. I think that's probably how it must've happened. So I guess it was lucky we noticed before starting it again! Must compliment wife on her nose.

Tossed a few adult diapers into the engine room bilge to soak it up and got an epic cleanup to look forward to tomorrow.

Thanks for the advice and offer of a new oil pump. Hopefully won't need it! ?

I have the same engine. Early on I was taught the worth of running a dry hand under each filter to check for early signs of fluid leakage, and doing it frequently. I commend this parctice. Fluids under even low pressure can so easily weep then. ......

 

[Yngmar]

Looks good. After tidying up the mess today, I ran the engine 40 minutes to make sure, then checked again after it cooled. No leaks, no drop in oil level. Going to check if the filter is on tight regularly now!

Now we've got a bucketload of oil soaked adult diapers (they worked really well by the way) and rags to dispose of. Already spotted a place for that when we were in Alghero, so it seems we're heading back there when the wind is right

 

[Supertramp]

I have the same engine. Early on I was taught the worth of running a dry hand under each filter to check for early signs of fluid leakage, and doing it frequently. I commend this parctice. Fluids under even low pressure can so easily weep then. ......

Well said. I do this under each filter, the gearbox and water pump as part of my engine checks. Takes seconds and spots problems early.