marina damage

Grehan

Grehan

Well-Known Member
Joined
11 Jun 2001
Messages
3,729
Location
Inland France + Oxon.
www.french-waterways.com
What's the general situation?
Boat is left properly and safely tied up, then suffers storm related damage, possibly exacerbated (or even caused) by marina staff actions. For example altering mooring lines that then come undone.
Pretty impossible to prove, though and naturally wouldn't admit.
Does one have to rely on one's own insurer eg GJW, or do they and the marina's bat liability back and forth?
 
I would think you have just about zero chance of proving that the marina staff were responsible. That's what your insurance is for so you might as well claim on that - boat policies don't seem to have signficant NCDs so there really isn't much problem.
 
How can the marina staff be responsible for your boat???? If you say they had to adjust your warps was it because it was not secured properly in the first instance??? It never ceases to amaze me how people entrust their pride and joy by securing with crappy bits of string!!!

I will always use oversize warps in the marina and if the weather is expecred to blow hard or I am away for a prolonged period I will double up the warps and put every fender I own into use!!

Do not blame anyone else for your own incompetence!!!

paul.
 
Re: Dont sit on the fence

Where I am at the moment on the canal, I kept finding my mooring warps had been 'loosened'. I think the canal staff have a strange idea that mooring warps should be loose. A look down the pontoons see yachts dancing all over the place in the winds.

So, Bowlines now on every cleat on the pontoon, lead to the boat. Full boat cover now on so no hope of them 'fidling'.

It was quite a worry to have 12 tonnes of boat bouncing back and forth on incredibly slack lines.
 
Bit harsh there Paul, may be more to this than meets the eye, Like the visiting boat owner (Read WA*NKER) who decided that the external halliards on my prev' boat made too much noise despite being held as far off the mast as possible with a frapping line, His solution was to remove my midships spring, tie it to the halliards as far up the mast as possible then use the foredeck winch to haul them out from the mast tearing my new mainsail cover in the process and damaging the head board on the sail, the boat was luckily only left like this 2 days before I visited but the lack of springs meant she had sheared about a great deal damaging the topsides and almost chafing through her remaining lines. Mike.
 
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Bit harsh there Paul

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maybe I am but when it comes to making sure my little girl is safe and well in whatever the weather that comes I will do everything possible to ensure no damage is done.....why would the marina staff even think of moving a mooring unless they thought it was unsecure??????? I know here at Troon the marina staff understand boats and moorings far far better than many owners do looking at the bits of string used by owners most of the time to secure their vessel.........how much of a percentage of the vessel will a descent length of warp cost??? Another annoying thing is the amount of people that leave their sprayhoods up during the winter and are then suprised when the next time they visit the boat it has been destroyed.......I suggest folk remove as much windage as possible, sprayhoods,dodgers, headsail roller reefing!!

When the 90kt wind hits there can then be no excuses!!!

Paul

Paul.
 
[ QUOTE ]
How can the marina staff be responsible for your boat???? If you say they had to adjust your warps was it because it was not secured properly in the first instance??? It never ceases to amaze me how people entrust their pride and joy by securing with crappy bits of string!!!
I will always use oversize warps in the marina and if the weather is expecred to blow hard or I am away for a prolonged period I will double up the warps and put every fender I own into use!!
Do not blame anyone else for your own incompetence!!!
paul.

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Yes well, don't jump to hasty judgements my rude and aggressive friend, and read the original post. The lines were safe, secure, tied in a proper seamanlike fashion, and doubled, and well sized. Loads of fenders, too.
However, returning to the boat after a gale, these lines had been altered dramatically by some external agent (they could not have just 'come undone' - even in a blow - they had been properly tied). So much so that three out of four lines (no, four lines was not the total complement . . . ) were no longer attached to the boat. This external agent would almost certainly have been marina staff, but obviously one cannot be sure. The fenders too had been altered.
The effect of these changes, to a boat that was properly moored (just like the clever clogs here have advised) was that it became unsafely moored and suffered severe damage. In addition, what shall I say? - fittings - provided by the marina for the purpose of mooring to, also failed.

Perhaps you might now care to understand the original post, which was to ask about the relative (insurance) liabilities of owner and marina in the circumstances . . .
 
Just been on ours today and the stbd stancions are bent out, i reckon due to the marina staff moving boat next door..
 
Hard to say - the marina really need to have discretion to adjust warps in good faith without being sued. Anyway, if you can't show it's them, it's a bit academic.

There could be good reasons why the warps were adjusted - even if doubled. People mentioned keeping the warps tight,and that's ,y preference too, but if waves make it into the marina for any reason, the pontoon and yacht bucking not in perfect unison can put enormous pressure on cleats and the hull itself, pull the yacht even harder into the pontoon and do a lot of damage. So the balance between tight warps and loose ones can be a tricky one.

One possibility is that another yacht tied up near yours and for some reason wanted to use the cleats on your pontoon - if yours were doubled, they might have undone one set (very naughty, but it could happen) to make space for their own warps, then 'forgotten' to reattach them when they left.

Just one or two possible scenarios.
 
Yes. I had that happen to me on several occasions, kept wondering why every time I came back to the boat my stern lines had been untied -

Then one night was on boat, and discovered the guy at it.

It was the bu@@er in the next berth to me taking my stern lines off my cleat so he could lead his spring onto my dock cleat, cause when on his own dock cleat it chafed his fender line.
Needless to say words were spoken!! /forums/images/graemlins/mad.gif
 
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Do not blame anyone else for your own incompetence!!!
paul.

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How do you make that assumption from the original post? Are you clarvoyant? Or do you just jump in without knowing all the facts?
Some of the marina staff I've come across have been Saturday kids with absolutely no idea.
 
ok - latest news . . .
Marina manager reports he personally checked the boat during recent F11 and she was absolutely fine and safe (unlike some other boats) and more than properly tied up.
Looks like some kind of subsequent malicious damage - deliberate removal of critical lines from cleats.
Looks also like marina insurance will cover.

So nasty Mr Starboard can stick that right up his hawse hole. And I hope it hurts.
 
Well one would not like to comment too far without knowing the circumstances, however because my Marina/Boatyard only crane during the week, I had to get them to moor Merit for me. Sadly it was the week of the 18th July and the fact that they did it badly caused damage.

Now I am used to subrogating against third parties about six times a day, so perhaps I made it clearer than most that I was not going to stand for it, but Deacon's were brilliant and put right the damage as soon as it was pointed out to them which is quite enough for me.

Funnilly enough, on sunday I was wondering if my springs were quite right so I went for a walk around the pontoon and had a good look at how everyone else was moored and I was flaberghasted (sp?).
 
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