making a gas locker

[bobg]

The propane bottle on my Jag 25 is currently in the cockpit. Unsightly and in the way. I have plenty of locker space in the cockpit and would like to build a gas locker that is safe and sensible. Buying gas lockers seems a hugely expensive way of doing this. The Calor site (rightly, I suppose) says buy a proper gas locker. I have tried archive searching the site for gas locker, but nothing came up. Any advice out there on DIY gas locker building in the cockpit or links to previous threads?

Here is the funny pay-off line. I thought I solved the endless drain on my finances when I got divorced. Then I bought a yacht. /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif

 

[Simes]

Hi Bob,

Go to B&Q buy one of the "Gorilla" buckets that fits your gas bottle (Years ago when I did this I could not get a bucket big enough, so I changed to Campingaz). Use this as s female mould for an Epoxy and CSM top access locker, remember to form a flange over the top of the bucket. Make a cut out in your cockpit seat to take both the new locker and also a circular water proof locker lid. Bolt the two together with a little sealant. Drill a drain hole in the bottom, fit a hose tail and hose, lead this to a through the hull above the water line and you are done.

have fun

Simes

 

[Captain Coochie]

My gas locker looks like a small galvanised water tank with a hole in the bottom and an outlet at the waterline . The top is just a plywood seat top .

 

[Katouf]

Can I piggy back on this one? - I'd also be interested in any replies.

My Centaur installation (quite rightly) failed a surveyor's report and I couldn't afford the time or money to throw at it to get it done - so the bottle was temporarily removed and vacuum flasks used for day sailing.
I need to get the cooker operational again and had the idea of making a wooden box shaped to fit in the stern locker and sealed with resin/tape and fireproof paint. As long as the drain goes overboard (through the transom) and the regulator etc is inside the box, is this legal as far as Corgi regs allow? Or does the box have to be GRP or metal?

I don't really want to cut the side benches in the cockpit just to fit a made to measure locker at the rear of the quarter berth.

Alan

 

[Tisme]

I made one for my boat last year. The original would only hold one small cylinder and I wanted to fit two bigger cylinders.
I made it out of two layers of 10mm marine ply epoxied into place, vented to the outside world with half inch pipe. The door is sealed with neoprene. It's all fully gas tight (other than the vent!) and much better than the original.

When the boat was surveyed for insurance I asked the surveyor to NOT recommend that I get it Corgi inspected. He obliged and merely suggested that I fit a gas alarm.

I'm pleased with the finished result.

 

[Avocet]

I laid up several flat sheets of fibreglass on a mirror and then cut them into rectangles (and a square for the base) to make a locker that way. I just bonded them together with strips of fibreglass on the inside so that I didn't have to bother making a mould. The only "clever" bit was to glass in a nylon bush at the bottom and cut a round piece of fibreglass to make a turntable for the bottle to sit on. This has the advantage of keeping the bottom of the bottle out of the 1/8" of seawater that always seems to live in there and also, more importantly, allows me to hold the regulator still and spin the bottle round to screw it on. I've got a leak detector and the "T" piece that splits the gas into two branches for the cooker and the cabin heater inside the box too so that any leaking t pieces should (hopefully) vent to atmosphere. There are then just two lengths of pipe running out of the box.

 

[VicS]

I dont know whether you found this page on the calormarine site but it does describe what is needed. Other pages in the same section will tell you about vents, drains, regulators, pipework etc, the Calormarine site used to be very useful for the DIYer but now only carries the bare information. I guess that's because DIY gas installations are now frowned upon.

'fraid you'll have to use a french poodle or whatever they call them.

 

[Captain Coochie]

A cast weight lifting weight does a fine job of holding a gas bottle in place .

 

[Tisme]

AFAIK the problem with fitting a gas locker inside another locker is that if the gas locker is opened and gas can then escape into the main locker then Corgi Regs wouldn't allow it.

 

[marcusgillies]

Dont mean to harp on but your gas locker, what ever you decide to constuct it out of should be fire and gas resistant, check bss regs if you boat is to be used on inland water ways.
And dont always go by what calor say! iI know this sounds like a stupid comment but at a course run by corgi a few years ago were were told we had to but a vent in the lowest part of our boats to let any escaped gas vent out!!! (you can im sure work that one out for yourselves)
If in doubt seek prerfesional help (one who knows about boats)
Did you you know BSS examiners dont have to be corgi registered ( i think thats about to change though)

 

[Tisme]

FWIW in my view the whole of the Corgi "thing" has gone way over the top. There are far more accidents from other causes than gas and these have never had the degree of regulation which is gradually being imposed in this area.

If safety really were the issue then the regulatory effort would be better spent elsewhere. The Corgi thing smells more of a closed shop being created to build a nice little earner for those who are registered.

 

[boatbuilder]

It is a totaly closed shop, because the insurance companies now want a Corgi cert. My local guy now charges £45 per hour and wont sell parts or spares to anyone outside the the freemasonary of corgi fitters.
When I pointed out that I can get parts on the web, cheaper than his old prices, I was told that if I installed them then I would be breaking the regs and he would condem even a new installation, because no corgi cert.
Drives me nuts, I've been doing gas for about 30 yrs with no accidents.
It will be electrics next, then maybe rigging, possibly laminating, etc etc

 

[bobg]

As Bob from Fleetwood who started this thread, I am tempted to say that regulations, regulations and more EU regulations on gas in boats fluffs over the bald fact that you are more likely to be killed by a giant squid from the Mariana Trench than an explosion from a Propane bottle carefully turned off at bottle source before tuck-up time. But as a newbie I await the gathering storm of angst. And of course, sound advice, which abounds on this wonderful info exchange garden bench.

 

[Phoenix of Hamble]

Mines fitted in the aft cockpit locker and is a plywood box made from 10mm ply, mounted inside the locker with a tight fitting lid and a rubber airtight seal.... its is then heavily painted inside and out with what appears to be a resin paint of some kind.....

The drain is from the bottom of the gas locker overboard...

Frankly this is good enough for me..... I'm pretty sure it wont leak, and if it gets to the stage where the box is at risk from fire, then its too bloody late to be on the boat anyway

Should add that a recent survey saw no problems with the installation....

 

[VicMallows]

Tisme and Boat builder. SPOT ON!

Anyway, AFAIK, Corgi (or any other dogs) do not make regulations. These are laid down in the GAS REGULATIONS (will look up the link if required). True, for domestic installations, you must comply with Building Regs, which will require an inspection by a 'suitably qualified person'. .... of course at a considerable cost.
CORGI is just a trade association protecting its own interests, but with the implied backing of government and insurance companies.

There is nothing yet regulating boat installations.....but of course your insurance company (house or boat) can require whatever it chooses.

Vic

 

[VicMallows]

Boatbuilder,

>>It will be electrics next, then maybe rigging, possibly laminating, etc etc<<

Sorry, but you're too late. I'm a Chartered Electrical Engineer, but am no longer allowed to install a light fitting in my bathroom unless I join a trade association. (OK, boats still exempt).

Strangely, my gas (house or boat) hasn't leaked either in 30yrs. In fact, if ever forced to have an inspection by a dog, would immediately do my own very thorough retest immediately afterwards.

(apologies to formurites who know my soapbox)

Vic

 

[pvb]

Apply a little common sense...

I'm assuming you're not suicidal, so you're probably going to be fairly sensible about using gas. Unless you want to go on inland waterways, the legal requirements aren't important. If you want to see what the BSS ask for, look here - you'll find it's all fairly simple common-sense stuff. You could easily make a gas locker with marine ply, with a layer of GRP over it. To meet the BSS requirements, it doesn't even need a lid, as long as it's gastight up to the top of the cylinder valve. Go ahead - you won't blow yourself up.

 

[mainmarine]

I used a large deep aluminium pressure cooker, without the lid, for a gas locker inside the lazarette, drilled an overboard drain in the bottom, a Camping Gaz bottle fits just right,

 

[Tisme]

I think that, in the interests of safety, we should make it clear that the practice of putting Gas cylinders in pressure cookers is not recomended. You should never heat gas cylinders up. /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif

 

[Gordonmc]

Agreed.

I had to rethink the gas installation in my elderly wooden boat which does not have a self draining cockpit and has nowhere I could build a gas locker draining above the waterline. Not that I want another hole in the hull in any case.

I bulled up on the regulations and, frankly, found them to be wanting in several regards. One was the requirement that regulators should be mounted on the boat with a length of flexible pipe from the bottle. What is the logic of introducing an element of high pressure pipework?

There is more likelyhood of gas leaking into the bilge from a fault in the low pressure side, junction, through-bulkhead or appliance, than in the bottle-regulator interface, so why the concentration in the regs on the structure of the gas locker?

My particular solution was to build a very well ventillated gas box which sits on the foredeck.