Life raft v Epirb

[Tranona]

Had just the same discussion last week on our boat in Corfu. Dinghy had sprung a leak which started the discussion "what if". Opened the locker and looked at my 8 man ocean spec raft - shiny white box! end of conversation. As far as I know there have been no reported cases of a Greek charter yacht (which mine used to be) foundering or a liferaft being used. Good money though, for some. Liferafts and servicing costs are roughly 50% higher than in UK!

Suggest you get SWMBO to read the reports and then she will tell you to never get her into a situation where you need a liferaft. Incidentally there are virtually no examples of mum and dad plus 2.4 being involved in a liferaft incident - indeed virtually all are predominately male, usually very experienced or even professional and doing things most of us would never dream of doing!

Interesting about EPIRB usage (again I have one). I expect there is some data available on usage and efficacy, probably from MCGA, but they have not gone out of their way to publicise it.

 

[fisherman]

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Bit of a myth that an EPIRB means instant rescue. By the time the CG have done their checking that it's not a false alarm, it can be an hour or so before the shout is called.

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I've been making this point over and over quite a few times.
In vain it would seem /forums/images/graemlins/frown.gif

Given the number of false alarms (in particular in summer) even a response time of one hour is quite optimistic.

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So have I. Ask the CG how many satellite hits they need, and how long this can take. 01326317575.

I am always in phone signal, and carry my phone in a waterproof case clipped to my collar, whether this is better than a handheld, and whether it would help me if I'm overboard is debatable. Probably not.
Liferaft every time, you can't afford to be in the water at all.

 

[Tranona]

Before you place your faith in a liferaft, suggest you read all the MAIB and MCIB reports including those related to fishing boats. Then you may not want ever to get anywhere near a liferaft in conditions where it may be needed.

 

[VictorII]

I think you might refrase the question into: what is the best safety device? Then my bet would be decent weather forecast equipment. My next investment will be precisely this, and I don't have a liferaft nor Epirb. Having read Fastnet Force 10 I believe it's the only technology which would have made a difference had it happened these days.

But when forced to choose the OP's options, I hire a LR for every longish crossing (above 60 NM) so a liferaft it would be.

 

[fisherman]

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Before you place your faith in a liferaft, suggest you read all the MAIB and MCIB reports including those related to fishing boats. Then you may not want ever to get anywhere near a liferaft in conditions where it may be needed.

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So do I jump in the sea?

Of course no one wants to be in a raft in poor conditions, but unexpected sinkings, and fires, do occur, and given the time I spend at sea more likely to happen to the likes of me.
I am well aware of the downside of survival in a raft, a couple of friends did the course at the Robert Gordon institute. They had to right a twelve man raft in a pool with cold, waves, and dark laid on. One, fifty years old, smoker, drinker non-swimmer, but he did it in the end. Both fishermen/lifeboatmen, never been seasick. Next day they were put in a raft off Anstruther in fine weather, all were seasick within minutes.
The majority of merchant seamen that died in WW2 died of exposure through not having enclosed rafts. Know where I'd sooner be, along with the dozen or so I know who would not have survived without the raft, including three that spent forty hours adrift in the channel in very poor conditions.

 

[Tranona]

I have also done the course at RGI about 30 years ago and it convinced me never to get in a situation when I might need a liferaft.

If you do as I suggest and read the reports of the incidents you will discover that liferafts are very poor at achieving their objective. This is not a criticism of designers - just the difficulty of meeting conflicting requirements in extreme conditions. The only really successful use of rafts by Yotties (and there have only been 3 in recent years) have been planned abandon ship situations. Collisions are usually catastrophic and there is no time to deploy a raft, sudden structural failures are also usually catastrophic and in the three recent cases one liferaft failed to inflate, one was only deployed after great difficulty (and one crew died) and the crew of the last sat on the upturned hull and were rescued by helicopter summoned by a mobile phone. In all cases where a raft was deployed in severe weather conditions there were problems of capsizing or difficulty in boarding.

The situation is different for professional seamen such as fisherman. Firstly they go out in conditions when Yotties would stay at home, secondly and more importantly they use boats which capsize relatively easily compared with a yacht. Accidents are more common and liferafts potentially more effective because they can be mounted on deck with a hydrostatic release - but every year fishermen die through being washed overboard or trapped below in a capsize. But this is not the world of the Yottie.

 

[alec]

One further thing that may be worth mentioning are Survival Suits.

I was watching on one of the Discovery type channels where there was a tragic case of some North American fisherman deaths due to a sinking. This was in cold waters.

However, the one survivor managed to don a survival suit and was picked up.

I do hire a liferaft when crossing the North Sea but that is only if I have crew which I think is fair enough.

I have a survival suit but it took me about 4 minutes to get into it and that was in the living room.

 

[wotayottie]

There's no answer to the question. You wont get far calling for help with a liferaft and you wont float for long using the epirb for bouyancy.

You cant take it with you when you've been lost at sea so put your hand in your pocket.