Lazy guy of Twinners

[ifoxwell]

or course that should read lazy guy OR twinners ... sorry

Looking for peoples thoughts on....

SunFast 32 that has the option of using a lazy guy or single sheet system with twinners for the kite?

What would you use and why

Thanks

Ian

 

[yoda]

Lazy guy because gybing the spinnaker will be easier with a lazy guy to use.

Yoda

 

[ifoxwell]

Lazy guy because gybing the spinnaker will be easier with a lazy guy to use.

Yoda

Is it really though... certainly in lighter winds its just all more rope and with the twinners pulled in hard you could almost sail it downwind with out the pole.

Granted the loads are much smaller but you don't see dinghy's making use of a lazy guy so how much of the perceived ease of gybing is just compensating for poor technique.

I'm just playing devils advocate hear... I don't have much experience with yacht kites (coming from a dinghy back ground) and although the yacht kites I have used have both had a lazy guy system I was never that taken by it.

Ian

 

[Stork_III]

This old thread gives a good explanation. http://www.ybw.com/forums/showthread.php?276572-Spinnaker-sheets-amp-guys-vs-sheets-only

 

[yoda]

Is it really though... certainly in lighter winds its just all more rope and with the twinners pulled in hard you could almost sail it downwind with out the pole.

Granted the loads are much smaller but you don't see dinghy's making use of a lazy guy so how much of the perceived ease of gybing is just compensating for poor technique.


I'm just playing devils advocate hear... I don't have much experience with yacht kites (coming from a dinghy back ground) and although the yacht kites I have used have both had a lazy guy system I was never that taken by it.

Ian

The loads on a yacht spinnaker are much larger than a dinghy. In anything but very light wind the pole becomes very hard work at some point if you don't have a lazy guy. I have been there to often with a spinnaker taking charge of the p
E while i try to get the other end back onto the mast. If very light you can drop the lazy guys but very difficult to put them back on if the wind gets up.

Yoda

 

[lpdsn]

or course that should read lazy guy OR twinners ... sorry

Looking for peoples thoughts on....

SunFast 32 that has the option of using a lazy guy or single sheet system with twinners for the kite?

What would you use and why

Thanks

Ian

Twinners are not just to turn a sheet into a guy or v.v. You would normally adjust them on the working sheet as you rotate the kite. You would also use them to strap the spinnaker down when flying it in heavy weather. So it is not an either or question.

Apart from that, whether you just have a couple of sheets with twinners or four lines is closely tied up with your arrangements for gybing the pole. Generally on smaller boats you do an end-for-end gybe and you just need two sheet. On larger boats, you would have one end of the pole fixed to the mast and would dip it under the forestay to gybe, in which case you'd need two guys as well as the two sheets used to fly the kite in the meantime.

At 32 feet I would be inclined just to have the two sheets with twinners.

That said, we have an end-for-end pole with two guys and two sheets, but that's because we also fly an asymmetric from the same pole with a tack line through the jaws and we require two guys to brace the pole firmly enough.

On the other hand, when cruising on my own boat with a cruising chute I just use one sheet and no twinner. It's not worth the hassle of another sheet as I have no intention of gybing with the chute up - although in extremis I could attach another sheet.

So the answer really depends upon what do you intend to do with the boat and how experienced are you with spinnakers?

 

[lpdsn]

I don't have much experience with yacht kites (coming from a dinghy back ground) and although the yacht kites I have used have both had a lazy guy system I was never that taken by it.

Ian

Apologies, didn't see that bit till afterwards. If you're not intending to race, get a bowsprit and a cruising chute (actually IRC favours bowsprits and asymmetrics anyway). You could even consider a snuffer.

I always tell dinghy sailors to be beware of the increase in forces in a yacht as it can really take them by surprise. That's already been mentioned by other posters, but a bit of extra stress on it does no harm and might even save a finger or two.

 

[mrming]

...get a bowsprit and a cruising chute (actually IRC favours bowsprits and asymmetrics anyway).

Not true. IRC doesn't distinguish between symmetric and asymmetric kites. There are two main factors in how spinnakers affect the rating:

1) Length of the pole - poles longer than J (e.g. a bowsprit) are considered oversize and carry a penalty.

2) Area of largest kite (doesn't matter if it's a sym or asym).

I've just finished optimising my boat for IRC and I found it best to reduce my bowsprit by 2/3. My asym is much larger than my conventional kite so that is the spinnaker I am rated for.

In terms of the OP's original question, you tend to see lazy sheets and guys appear on racing boats around the 30' mark as the loads become greater. This depends on whether you are masthead or fractional and the resulting size of the kite obviously.

 

[micha571]

On our 33footer we use just sheets with twinners. Easy handling. Spin size is around 75 square meters. It's a fractional chute, might be different with the bigger loads involved with a masthead chute.

 

[vyv_cox]

Masthead spinnaker on 34 ft boat, two on board. I do all the foredeck work and would be hard pressed without a lazy sheet/guy system, although this is partly because we have a babystay that complicates gybing somewhat.

 

[onesea]

Lazy guy because gybing the spinnaker will be easier with a lazy guy to use.

Yoda

I always thought it was cause you have a lazy guy and sheet (IE one not being used), when flying the kite...

Would be amazed if it was considered a lazy way of doing things easier yes but lazy hmmm...