Lassoing a pontoon cleat

[BelleSerene]

I often come in to berth either single-handed or with a non-sailing crew. I either lasso a cleat, or use a brilliant releasable metal clip on a warp at the end of a stick to lock on to the pontoon cleat, and sort out the other lines at leisure.

Taking the Thames riverboat a few times recently, I've noticed the crew doing a lasso of the pontoon cleat, from much more distance than I can, and getting it right almost every time. Something to do with how you hold the loop with the first part of the bight, and then flick it outwards to keep the loop open when it falls towards the cleat.

OK, how's it done?

This is not about the order of warps, midships cleats etc, nor about the devices for grabbing cleats and buoys at a distance. Simply, how do you best lasso a pontoon cleat?

 

[pvb]

It's easier with a fairly thick rope. I use a loop of about 20mm rope, about 3m long, attached to a midships cleat. Approach pontoon, drop loop over cleat at end of pontoon, then motor gently against it as a spring line. Can position boat easily, pop autopilot on to hold position, step off and secure other lines.

 

[Seajet]

If you approach the pontoon closely - to the cockpit - you can drop a loop of line over the cleat / bollard.

With most modern boats this will require a slow speed last minute steer away from the pontoon, to bring the stern closer in.

I know you don't want to hear it, but a midships or even forward line dropped over said bollard / cleat with engine slow ahead and rudder secured to push the stern into the pontoon gives one all the time in the world to tie up properly.

 

[Elessar]

OK there are 2 ways.

assuming right handed.

method 1 - goes the furthest, quickest to set up but needs more accuracy. My wife can lassoo quite reliably 12 ft away if needed.

get the rope coiled up, using your full arm length of both arms to set the loop size.
On the loose end, undo 1 loop so you have a metre or so of uncoiled rope. Hold the end in your left hand, out to the left of your body.
Hold the coil in your right hand, and with it in front of your eyeline move your hand towards you and away from you to get the whole coil swinging at its resonant frequency. When ready, thrust forward towards the cleat/bollard/mooring buoy and let go of the coil at the far end of the stroke.

method 2 - fiddlier to set up, but throws a wider loop - very hard to miss at distances up to about 8 ft.
Again get the rope coiled up using the full lenght of both arms for loop length.
Split the coil into 2 equal halves. Hold the one with the tail in your left hand and the other in your right.
It is important that there is only 1 strand of rope joining the 2 coils. This is the fiddly bit and you might need to adjust the coils to get this right. Release 1 loop from the coil to give some slack between the 2 coils.
Put the loose end of the rope under your left thumb. Put your 2 hands with the 2 coils tight to your chest.
Explode your arms outwards and upwards, and at the last instant let go of both coils. Don't let go of the tail.
If you find it hard to not let go of the tail, stand on it with your left foot instead of holding it.

All easier to demonstrate than describe. And even easier to do once practised.

Once secured use sejet's motor ahead idea. Works equally well from a stern cleat if the pontoon is long enough, just have the helm pointing away from the pontoon to push the stern out.

 

[eastlaked]

Loop on a stick

My favourite method is not to leave things to chance (or my bad throwing), but to use a "loop on a stick". Its easy to place the loop over the pontoon cleat (or take it off). I get the cleat first time, every time.

I have a length of white plastic conduit pipe (its stiffer than the white plastic water/waste pipe) from the DIY store. The mooring line goes through the conduit pipe and has a bowline on the end. - a loop on a stick.

I improved it by threading about 1 ft of an old bilge pump hose (the clear pipe with reinforcing mesh) to keep the loop of the bowline
open. It also acts to reduce wear and chaffing.

I cut the length of the conduit pipe so that if I thread the tail end of the mooring warp though the mid-ships cleat and back to the genoa winch, when the slack is taken up, my boat is in the correct position on the finger pontoon. ie the pipe goes from pontoon cleat to midships cleat. Using this I can single handed depart and return my 35ft yacht to the marina berth.

David.

OK there are 2 ways.

assuming right handed.

method 1 - goes the furthest, quickest to set up but needs more accuracy. My wife can lassoo quite reliably 12 ft away if needed.

get the rope coiled up, using your full arm length of both arms to set the loop size.
On the loose end, undo 1 loop so you have a metre or so of uncoiled rope. Hold the end in your left hand, out to the left of your body.
Hold the coil in your right hand, and with it in front of your eyeline move your hand towards you and away from you to get the whole coil swinging at its resonant frequency. When ready, thrust forward towards the cleat/bollard/mooring buoy and let go of the coil at the far end of the stroke.

method 2 - fiddlier to set up, but throws a wider loop - very hard to miss at distances up to about 8 ft.
Again get the rope coiled up using the full lenght of both arms for loop length.
Split the coil into 2 equal halves. Hold the one with the tail in your left hand and the other in your right.
It is important that there is only 1 strand of rope joining the 2 coils. This is the fiddly bit and you might need to adjust the coils to get this right. Release 1 loop from the coil to give some slack between the 2 coils.
Put the loose end of the rope under your left thumb. Put your 2 hands with the 2 coils tight to your chest.
Explode your arms outwards and upwards, and at the last instant let go of both coils. Don't let go of the tail.
If you find it hard to not let go of the tail, stand on it with your left foot instead of holding it.

All easier to demonstrate than describe. And even easier to do once practised.

Once secured use sejet's motor ahead idea. Works equally well from a stern cleat if the pontoon is long enough, just have the helm pointing away from the pontoon to push the stern out.

 

[Seajet]

Eh ?!

Springing On:

Rudder to push the stern away from the pontoon maybe to allow getting a forward line on - but the crew should always be at the widest part of the boat, usually amidships with the shrouds to hang onto, NOT right by the bow - but the idea, and it makes life much easier, is to put on a line from midships or forward then have the motor engaged in slow forward, with rudder pushing the stern INTO the pontoon, this keeps the boat static until proper berthing lines are attached.

The opposite, ' springing off ' is done when leaving from a tight spot, then the rudder is used to push the boats' stern out until she is perpendicular to the berth ( current allowing ), then the line is slipped, boat reverses into clear water, then forward gear, lines and fenders off, and normal service is resumed.

 

[BelleSerene]

I know you don't want to hear it, but a midships or even forward line dropped over said bollard / cleat with engine slow ahead and rudder secured to push the stern into the pontoon gives one all the time in the world to tie up properly.

Thanks. Happy to hear it! and the mooring method is fine - but my question is how to do that 'dropped over said bollard' bit. Easier on a 22' boat to be fair.

assuming right handed.

method 1 - goes the furthest, quickest to set up but needs more accuracy. My wife can lassoo quite reliably 12 ft away if needed.

get the rope coiled up, using your full arm length of both arms to set the loop size.
On the loose end, undo 1 loop so you have a metre or so of uncoiled rope. Hold the end in your left hand, out to the left of your body.
Hold the coil in your right hand, and with it in front of your eyeline move your hand towards you and away from you to get the whole coil swinging at its resonant frequency. When ready, thrust forward towards the cleat/bollard/mooring buoy and let go of the coil at the far end of the stroke.

method 2 - fiddlier to set up, but throws a wider loop - very hard to miss at distances up to about 8 ft.
Again get the rope coiled up using the full lenght of both arms for loop length.
Split the coil into 2 equal halves. Hold the one with the tail in your left hand and the other in your right.
It is important that there is only 1 strand of rope joining the 2 coils. This is the fiddly bit and you might need to adjust the coils to get this right. Release 1 loop from the coil to give some slack between the 2 coils.
Put the loose end of the rope under your left thumb. Put your 2 hands with the 2 coils tight to your chest.
Explode your arms outwards and upwards, and at the last instant let go of both coils. Don't let go of the tail.
If you find it hard to not let go of the tail, stand on it with your left foot instead of holding it.

All easier to demonstrate than describe. And even easier to do once practised.

This is brilliant stuff - thanks!

Can I clarify:

1 Do I get it that with both methods you have one end of the rope fast on board and you're throwing the bight (not a bowline in the end of the rope) round the pontoon cleat, hanging on to the 'tail' or 'loose end' in your hand?

2 When you say 'It is important that there is only 1 strand of rope joining the 2 coils. This is the fiddly bit and you might need to adjust the coils to get this right. Release 1 loop from the coil to give some slack between the 2 coils.' you're describing two equal coils with only a very short length between them, and then releasing one loop from between the two coils so there's a double-arm span of rope between the coil in your left hand and the one in your right, before you throw them apart?

For someone to record this on YouTube would be fantastic!

 

[lw395]

I imagine it's a lot to do with having the right weight and stiffness of rope, and many happy hours of practice.

 

[Sandyman]

Mooring lines are 18mm 3 strand nylon.

To make it easy for wifey (only two of us onboard) I took a meter length of 25mm hose then feed the line through it before making a back splice. East peasy she never fails to make the cleat.

 

[capnsensible]

Quite often, my wife docks the boat whilst I nip ashore with the lines.

Sometimes lassoo, depends on the mooring situation....always did when we were skipper/Hostess on bigger motorboats or you break yer legs.

 

[Deleted member 36384]

..... For someone to record this on YouTube would be fantastic!

http://www.working-the-sails.com/mooring_rope_lines.html Its not U tube but move the cursor over the black, bold text and you will see a picture of a lad about to throw the split coil method.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ufZSHhGnmzM The single loop line throwing method. I would have kicked all shades of poop out of both of these blokes, they are too irritating for my patience.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?NR=1&v=1DFLYCRVRPw Throwing line competitions.

http://www.offshoresailing.com/sail...ips/coiling-a-line-properly-for-throwing.aspx A Sailing school video on how to coil and throw a line. Large and small coil method. This is the one you want to watch.

 

[johnphilip]

Now the challenge, how to lasso the awful mooring hoops welded to our finger berths as they were probably cheaper than cleats.

 

[Elessar]

This is brilliant stuff - thanks!

Can I clarify:

1 Do I get it that with both methods you have one end of the rope fast on board and you're throwing the bight (not a bowline in the end of the rope) round the pontoon cleat, hanging on to the 'tail' or 'loose end' in your hand?

2 When you say 'It is important that there is only 1 strand of rope joining the 2 coils. This is the fiddly bit and you might need to adjust the coils to get this right. Release 1 loop from the coil to give some slack between the 2 coils.' you're describing two equal coils with only a very short length between them, and then releasing one loop from between the two coils so there's a double-arm span of rope between the coil in your left hand and the one in your right, before you throw them apart?

For someone to record this on YouTube would be fantastic!

1 - yes
2 - yes again

 

[AMCD300]

Quite often, my wife docks the boat whilst I nip ashore...

...for a pint?

 

[Elessar]

Now the challenge, how to lasso the awful mooring hoops welded to our finger berths as they were probably cheaper than cleats.

you can't flippin dangerous things for that reason. Means someone has to get off before securing the boat, and I don't like that.
A french affection that is creeping over here.

 

[Elessar]

Eh ?!

Springing On:

Rudder to push the stern away from the pontoon maybe to allow getting a forward line on - but the crew should always be at the widest part of the boat, usually amidships with the shrouds to hang onto, NOT right by the bow - but the idea, and it makes life much easier, is to put on a line from midships or forward then have the motor engaged in slow forward, with rudder pushing the stern INTO the pontoon, this keeps the boat static until proper berthing lines are attached.

The opposite, ' springing off ' is done when leaving from a tight spot, then the rudder is used to push the boats' stern out until she is perpendicular to the berth ( current allowing ), then the line is slipped, boat reverses into clear water, then forward gear, lines and fenders off, and normal service is resumed.

Trust me I understand the difference between springing on and springing off.

You correctly described how to hold the boat parallel to the dock with a forward or midships line (rudder towards dock). If you use a stern line, you need to have the rudder pointing away from the dock for the boat to settle parallel to the dock. Exactly as I said the first time.

 

[Elessar]

I imagine it's a lot to do with having the right weight and stiffness of rope, and many happy hours of practice.

it's easier with a blanced rope rather than a 3 strand. ie octoplait or braided.
I teach people to do it reliably in less than 5 minutes. 3 throws is enough usually.

 

[pvb]

... but my question is how to do that 'dropped over said bollard' bit. Easier on a 22' boat to be fair.

I often single-hand my 35ft boat, and I would never try to throw a line to lasso a cleat. I don't think it's anywhere near predictable enough in a single-handed situation, and I hate cocking it up (especially with an audience!). As posted earlier, I attach a long loop of thickish rope to the midships cleat. Before entering a marina, I make sure that it's untangled and drape the loop end of it over the top lifeline. Then approach the pontoon, slow the boat right down, then go and stand on the side deck, pick up the loop of rope with both hands so that the loop is hanging down and with hands about 50cm apart just swing the rope outwards and drop the loop over the cleat. The weight of the rope keeps it in position. Motoring gently against it, and steering appropriately, secures the boat and aligns it with the pontoon. This method also copes with cross-winds. I can then attach the stern line in a similar way. Only then do I step off the boat with a bow line.

 

[BelleSerene]

1 - yes
2 - yes again

Thanks a million! Great advice.

 

[Seajet]

Here's a miraculous idea;

how about using a boat hook for those hard to lassooe jobs ?!

I've never had to lassoe anything in 40 odd years of sailing, but whenever I approach a pontoon I have the boat hook poised; and for the poster who seemed to think I ' only ' sail 22' boats, not so, I've owned a 30' and sailed many other larger boats ta very much; however " ye cannae change the laws of physics Captain ! " and good handling stays the same, including springing on.