Lagoon 52 thoughts/comments

[Neeves]

Unless you like sailing in 20 knots+ wind and their accompanying seas I'd look at a large overlapping genny. If you like sailing to windward in confined spaces, in big winds, then a self tacker is ideal - but cats enjoy sailing off the wind and a self tacker is a waste of space. I'd look at a furling genny and inner forestay with self tacker. You will need a decent prodder, bowsprit (which might mean extra reinforcing for the kicker wires to hold it down) for the screacher, code Zero. You are really loading it up with kit and you will need to maximise sail plan (and larger engines?) to drive it.

You need controls out on deck, these are beamy yachts and you cannot see one side from the other, so coming alongside is best achieved by standing on that side - in the open.

I don't know how big the freshwater tanks are but dishwashers, washing machines and 8 people, can, use an awful lot of water and water makers are not unobtrusive.

You will have oodles of roof space, seems a shame to run a gen set.

Jonathan

 

[dunedin]

Many thanks for the constructive feed back (especially on marina cost's.. ouch !!!)

I now believe I am being a tad over ambitious with the 52, there were a number of reasons for my initial choice mainly around living space and extra equipment spec's.

Those of you who are familiar with Lagoon realise the basic offering is aimed at the charter market but they do offer a number of upgrades that enable prospective owners a chance to add that individual touch to their craft. (What the hell is a comfort pack !!!).

Based on the above we have decided to look again at the model range and at the 450F 4 cabin in particular.

Very rough tech spec..

Upgrade sail spec (to include Code 0 and/or kite)
Self tacking jib if possible
watermaker at least 175 lph as in med capacity reduced.
Increase in fuel capacity
Generator (I really dislike solar panels)
Aircon
Raymarine not B&G nav gear
Helm and engine controls at nav station in main cabin
Washer/dryer
Dishwasher
Dive compressor

Not all the above may be possible but if you don't ask you don't get.

Andy

p.s. Any other thoughts on spec much appreciated

Would really like a hydraulic Hi/Lo platform for tender storage, davits can be a pain in the whatsit

Sorry, but I hope you never park near me. Sounds like a spec for a shore apartment not a yacht, and will use so much power that the generator will be on full time.
Not a welcome neighbour. But perhaps not untypical these days in the med

 

[Third mate]

I'm not suggesting the Lagoon is not good - but having swapped, quite quickly from a 52 to a 45 - why not other builders?

Just interested.

Jonathan

Hi Jonathan,

You may not believe this but I was won over by the styling (yes I can hear the fugly crowd laughing even here in sunny Norfolk)

Andy

 

[Third mate]

Out of interest, where will you be sailing your new Lagoon? And where do you think that you may be purchasing?

Hi Garold,

Initially the Med, Sardinia way. UK purchase

Andy

 

[Neeves]

Hi Jonathan,

You may not believe this but I was won over by the styling (yes I can hear the fugly crowd laughing even here in sunny Norfolk)

Andy

Not a problem, everyone to their own. It would not do if we were all the same.

Are you doing La Grande Motte?

We have a Lightwave 38 and looked at the Lightwave 45. We sail as a couple and when we have people on board we find they are totally unreliable (no offence - but that's a problem of guests who are not sailors). So the 45 was simply too big for 2 - so we stuck with what we have. We try to do about 2,000 - 3,000nm per annum

Jonathan

 

[Third mate]

Sorry, but I hope you never park near me. Sounds like a spec for a shore apartment not a yacht, and will use so much power that the generator will be on full time.
Not a welcome neighbour. But perhaps not untypical these days in the med

Appreciate you comments having fallen victim to noise pollution myself. This makes me very careful when and where I do my concord impression :listening_headphone:listening_headphone

Andy

 

[RupertW]

Sorry, but I hope you never park near me. Sounds like a spec for a shore apartment not a yacht, and will use so much power that the generator will be on full time.
Not a welcome neighbour. But perhaps not untypical these days in the med

+1 So often you come into a lovely anchorage and then after dark you realise all those bright lights are staying on, and the inky water reflecting the starts has a big turquoise stain from their under-hull lighting, and of course their quiet (to them) generator is very noisy to you and will be needed all night as the 20 degree C night breeze through the hatches is something they will never feel as their hatches are clamped hard to keep the aircon recirculating their post-meal smells all night.

But I love Lagoons as much as I dislike Robertson and Caine cats (sail like they are made from concrete). A roughish out of season Atlantic crossing made me a Lagoon convert but that was a 2002 model so I don't know how much their characteristics have changed since then. V twitchy to sail but impressive (for me) speeds at up to 15 knots briefly broad reaching and 6 knots plus beating for a 410. Looked after us in some big winds and waves.

 

[tcm]

Having spent time on one this models smaller sister was very impressed with the cruising performance of the set back main which seems to have made a dramatic improvement in sailing ability,

I am now overwhelmed with the urge to purchase a 52.

Don't want this to turn into a cat verses mono as I have happy memories of mono's both on the east coast and transat, but life at 20 degrees is a no no for SWMBO.

The most important thing is that this will be a family cruising machine kept well away from mud plugging under grey skies off the east coast of England. Blue sky and sunshine only


regards

Andy

I think buying a big cruising cat is an excellent idea - but i would only do it if planning to live on the thing for months at a time. I did this for a few years and a cat was the right choice. But unless you use the thing for (around) six weeks a year, you'd be much better off chartering, which would mean you could have one in the med in summer, and one in the caribbean for winter. I did the med-carib run twice a year to catch that nicer weather, meaning that about now I would be getting ready to cross back to the med setting out sometime May or early June.

I don't think I would buy a new Lagoon, nor perhaps not any new catamaran - nearly new offerings from buyers having second thoughts should have been de-snagged, or at least the problems are right there waiting to be found/fixed. A new boat is not the quite-lovely experience of a new car - you have to get the snag list, wait for the dealer guy to come and so on and on and on.

If you can buy a new 52, you could look at a nearly-new Privilege 51(?), and yeah, I'm biased cos i had a 495, the previous model. The downside is that the massive interior space of the Lagoon 52 (enhanced by vertical forward windows) is compromised by the slanted windows on the priv. But if you get the right owners version then the owners cabin is seven metres wide - the whole front half of the boat. It achieves this with the "nacelle" design which it has favoured since the 70's - and middle "hull" which adds massive strength between the two hulls, extends forward to support the forestay and is extra forward buoyancy when sailing fast downwind - even in 5m seas where instantaneous speeds can reach over 20knots, the boat never ducks the bows with that huge extra buoyancy.

But otherwise, of course, if you have the money then the Lagoon 52 would be totally fabulous. The spec is fine - the potentially massive power usage isn't invariably something for others to grumble about - we all want quiet anchorages to stay quiet at night.

 

[Jamesuk]

Based on the above we have decided to look again at the model range and at the 450F 4 cabin in particular.
Very rough tech spec..
Upgrade sail spec (to include Code 0 and/or kite) Check out Furlstrum from Elvstrom also there EPEX Sails.
Self tacking jib if possible (nothing "self-tacking" about a cat, you will need to back it to get through the tack)
watermaker at least 175 lph as in med capacity reduced. (250 minimum, you will need an uprated pump and hose pipe to wash the boat think "Fire engine".
Increase in fuel capacity GOOD PLAN
Generator (I really dislike solar panels) YES at least 15KvA (For all those AC units)
Aircon (Always on so get the gen set to work AC and watermaker and battery chargers unless you have always on Genset power)
Raymarine not B&G nav gear (ACU 400 with control units) A65 throughout are nice. Furuno FA-150 Transponder) Thrane and Thrane Sat phone and TV system KVH system Football on the boat so 50 inch LED TV)
Helm and engine controls at nav station in main cabin (Get the wireless controls for parking)
Washer/dryer nothing else but Miele 30k miles and a hurricane Cat 1 still going strong
Dishwasher - really? you will need a cheese fridge and "another freezer" just for the ice trays. Icemakers on boats are small and awful)
Dive compressor - hummm if you are doing "lots of diving" like a charter boat then yes. if Not carry plenty of cylinders and just refill them when you can. IF you must have one go for bauer from Browns in Florida lol (Well you are buying a million + boat ;-)

p.s. Any other thoughts on spec much appreciated

Too many, Inventica Yacht Spot 4G and a back up with another SIM card Data is important, VHF speakers, Trilense radar reflector, Convection oven, electric hobs, filters system for filling water tanks, fuel transfer pump, printer, wine sellar, mozzie blinds for hatches, Meteoman, echomax, jobouy, lots of TV's, installations that can easily be changed when the boat is struck by lightning, charging station for batteries,. fusion stereo, speakers on the first set of spreaders (for the people on the nets at the front), Copercoat on the hull so you can just clean the hull yourself with all your dive gear, anyway best get back to the varnishing. Oh if you can have the boat interior like a Hallberg Rassy you may feel you want an old black Labrador too oh and some cool paintings of America's cup Catamarans around the boat. - Bow thrusters and stern thruster, Dynamic GPS for the vessel oh and carpet in some areas, and in all other aeras, silicone floor (we had it on an Oyster 655, drop something and it protects the floor)

Would really like a hydraulic Hi/Lo platform for tender storage, davits can be a pain in the whatsit

 

[Jamesuk]

I wonder if you can get this installed. You wont need the bow thruster then I don't think

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6K7fssEG420

 

[Neeves]

The Volvo IPS, in the Youtube, are quite extraordinary - all controlled from a little box. Any kid adept at video games would take to it like a duck to water. I've only seen them on pretty powerful engines - maybe too big even for a 52' cat.

For a 52' cat the alternative would be decent crew and you can then dispense with the dishwasher as well

Jonathan

 

[RichardS]

I wonder if you can get this installed. You wont need the bow thruster then I don't think

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6K7fssEG420

I'm not sure that those swivelling saildrives would be an advantage on a cat as we can literally turn 360 degrees on the spot anyway. I do it all the time and it's not unusual for monohull owners to be seen getting ready to fend off as they assume that I'm going to move ahead whilst I simply turn 180 and motor off in the opposite direction.

Richard

 

[Neeves]

The Volvo IPS allows the operator to move the vessel sideways. Twin engines on a cat allow the operator to turn on the spot but not move the vessel sideways (against the wind) in a totally controlled and predictable manner. They effectively replace a bow (and stern) thruster. I can only think they are inordinately expensive.

Jonathan

 

[RichardS]

The Volvo IPS allows the operator to move the vessel sideways. Twin engines on a cat allow the operator to turn on the spot but not move the vessel sideways (against the wind) in a totally controlled and predictable manner.

Jonathan

Having watched the video, I'm not convinced about that and I think they are still relying on some breeze to move sideways, just as I do.

I would need to see a technical demonstration rather than marketing fuzz.

Richard

 

[Third mate]

I reckon they would be a bit much on a 45' cat

 

[Neeves]

Having watched the video, I'm not convinced about that and I think they are still relying on some breeze to move sideways, just as I do.

I would need to see a technical demonstration rather than marketing fuzz.

Richard

I think they are certainly OTT for a 45' cat.

I've been on board a rather large MoBo, 60', and watched the system in operation - it allows the operator control well beyond what is possible with 2 engines whose orientation is limited to forward or astern. Maybe I'm easily impressed but I could not berth our cat with ease with which the yacht I was on was manouvred. But then our yacht does not weigh in at 40t, consume obscene amounts of fuel

Jonathan

 

[noelex]

Andy congratulations on the impending purchase. You only live once .

Lagoon owners seem to universally love their boats which is a great sign.

If you can afford this size boat with well designed systems I don't think there will be too many handling problems.

The one caution I would voice is that with your specs it will be a complex boat with a lot to go wrong. There is nothing worse than delaying cruising in paradise to fix problems.