Knocked in the oggin!

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doug748

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From the Plymouth Herald, today:
"A fisherman is lucky to be alive after he was thrown overboard and dragged along the underside of a container ship"
He was picked up after about an hour in the water 30 miles form Start Point. His fishing boat had been in colision with the ship which was on passage from Antwerp to Italy. A second man was thown into the water but was recovered, uninjured, at the scene.
He was not wearing a lifejacket.
 
doug748 said:
From the Plymouth Herald, today:
"A fisherman is lucky to be alive after he was thrown overboard and dragged along the underside of a container ship"
He was picked up after about an hour in the water 30 miles form Start Point. His fishing boat had been in colision with the ship which was on passage from Antwerp to Italy. A second man was thown into the water but was recovered, uninjured, at the scene.
He was not wearing a lifejacket.
Click to expand...

And why would he? I doubt they were expecting to be run down & sunk by another vessel & the risk of falling overboard otherwise is extremely low.

It's a bit like saying a man was hit by a falling chimney pot & killed - he wasn't wearing a safety helmet!

A man was struck by lightning & wasn't wearing his Faraday cage.

Do you wear a seat belt on a bus or train?

More pertinent question is why was the fishing boat hit & sunk by the cargo ship?
 
Commercial ships tend to stick to routes ( I agree too rigidly & without proper lookout; I have observed coasters going past on a rigid - presumably autopilot - course with the wheelhouse doors open and no-one in sight on the bridge ! ) but why was the fishing boat in front, in what seems from the little info' available a predictable place for a collision ?!
 
Seajet said:
Commercial ships tend to stick to routes ( I agree too rigidly & without proper lookout; I have observed coasters going past on a rigid - presumably autopilot - course with the wheelhouse doors open and no-one in sight on the bridge ! ) but why was the fishing boat in front, in what seems from the little info' available a predictable place for a collision ?!
Click to expand...

Are you suggesting that certain strips of water should be reserved for commercial shipping so that they can run on autopilot & save money by not having qualified crew on watch? :confused:

That's a bit like reserving Studland Bay for seahorse bothering divers isn't it? :rolleyes:

And how do non-comercial craft cross these reserved shipping lanes? Will they be carried over them by redundant air-sea rescue helicopters with nowt to do? :cool:

Sorry, just taking your comment to its illogical conclusion. All ships are required to keep a look out - we should not accept the fact that many do not & simply to save costs.
 
I'm with Peter Nicholas on this one .....

"Once a harness comes aboard a boat, it seems foolhardy not to wear it, but it comes at a price. A harness interferes with one's natural and unconcious accomodation to a boat's movement, something acquired after a few days at sea. It makes one move awkwardly, stopping and starting to clip on and off every few feet. Harnesses have unquestionably saved people from going overboard, but they have also failed, come undone, broken, chafed through, and sent people to their deaths. An overreliance on them breeds an atrophy of the best of all devices to keep a sailor aboard: a fully developed horror of going overboard."

- Peter Nichols in A Voyage for Madmen
 
Baggywrinkle said:
"Once a harness comes aboard a boat, it seems foolhardy not to wear it, but it comes at a price. A harness interferes with one's natural and unconcious accomodation to a boat's movement, something acquired after a few days at sea. It makes one move awkwardly, stopping and starting to clip on and off every few feet. Harnesses have unquestionably saved people from going overboard, but they have also failed, come undone, broken, chafed through, and sent people to their deaths. An overreliance on them breeds an atrophy of the best of all devices to keep a sailor aboard: a fully developed horror of going overboard."

- Peter Nichols in A Voyage for Madmen
Click to expand...

A harness? On a fishing boat? I don't really think so, you'd end up over the side attached to the net I suspect. But I agree with the point on a yacht.

A L/J isn't actually that bad, when working on deck, but it does really have to be over everything (unless your name is Dylan) & that makes adding/ removing jackets, jumpers etc a real pain. So I can see why they aren't worn unless conditions are extreme.

But it does annoy me that journo's with absolutely no understanding of the issues trot out the same old daft platitudes.
 
Searush,

'it is illogical, Captain' ! I was trying to say ships follow routes so don't sit in the way of quite possibly badly - or not at all - commanded, BIG ships !

Sitting there is a stupid idea, but that doesn't mean I agree with the badly run ships...
 
Seajet said:
Searush,

'it is illogical, Captain' ! I was trying to say ships follow routes so don't sit in the way of quite possibly badly - or not at all - commanded, BIG ships !

Sitting there is a stupid idea, but that doesn't mean I agree with the badly run ships...
Click to expand...

I knew that ;)

TBH, my own personal Coll regs say, right at the top, in bold letters

"Never get in a position where Col Regs need to apply"
 
doug748 said:
From the Plymouth Herald, today:
"A fisherman is lucky to be alive after he was thrown overboard and dragged along the underside of a container ship"
He was picked up after about an hour in the water 30 miles form Start Point. His fishing boat had been in colision with the ship which was on passage from Antwerp to Italy. A second man was thown into the water but was recovered, uninjured, at the scene.
He was not wearing a lifejacket.
Click to expand...


sounds like an attempt at keelhauling !
 
Searush said:
And why would he? I doubt they were expecting to be run down & sunk by another vessel & the risk of falling overboard otherwise is extremely low.

It's a bit like saying a man was hit by a falling chimney pot & killed - he wasn't wearing a safety helmet!

A man was struck by lightning & wasn't wearing his Faraday cage.

Do you wear a seat belt on a bus or train?

More pertinent question is why was the fishing boat hit & sunk by the cargo ship?
Click to expand...

"Do you wear a seat belt on a bus or train?"

On National Express coaches, its mandatory to wear a seatbelt.
Driver announces that it is a legal requirement to do so!
 
Searush said:
A harness? On a fishing boat? I don't really think so, you'd end up over the side attached to the net I suspect. But I agree with the point on a yacht.

A L/J isn't actually that bad, when working on deck, but it does really have to be over everything (unless your name is Dylan) & that makes adding/ removing jackets, jumpers etc a real pain. So I can see why they aren't worn unless conditions are extreme.

But it does annoy me that journo's with absolutely no understanding of the issues trot out the same old daft platitudes.
Click to expand...

Hear ! Hear !

And we are all bored to death at the attempts to tell us what to do all the time as if we were all children, honestly.

Harnesses for work on deck amd in the cockpit in rough weather. Lifejackets to deploy in a rubber boat and to come back, specially in the case of children and non swimmers, period.
 
Searush said:
And why would he? I doubt they were expecting to be run down & sunk by another vessel & the risk of falling overboard otherwise is extremely low.

It's a bit like saying a man was hit by a falling chimney pot & killed - he wasn't wearing a safety helmet!

A man was struck by lightning & wasn't wearing his Faraday cage.

Do you wear a seat belt on a bus or train?

More pertinent question is why was the fishing boat hit & sunk by the cargo ship?
Click to expand...


Heres the full report .

http://www.thisisplymouth.co.uk/new...ision-sea/article-3217984-detail/article.html

No mention of the fishing boat being hit bythe ship . More likely the fishing boat hit the ship . Fishing boat wasn't sunk in the incident . she is now berthed in Plymouth .
 
A L/J isn't actually that bad, when working on deck, but it does really have to be over everything (unless your name is Dylan) & that makes adding/ removing jackets, jumpers etc a real pain. So I can see why they aren't worn unless conditions are extreme.

To throw another comment into the old commercial fisherman/lifejacket rant, with many methods of fishing (such as netting) a lifejacket presents a signifigant catching hazard.
 
A lifejacket needn't present any hazard at all if one chooses the right one; and though it may require a move away from the beloved Guy Cotton smocks, ( which I agree are good stuff and hard wearing, BUT no insulation, no reflective strips, no chance if overboard ! ) - modern waterproofs at virtually all price levels have tabs to secure a lifejacket to the jacket, so one takes the kit off and on just as a waterproof top.

No doubt this would be seen as 'fairy' if one fishing boat crew member tried it; it is up to skipper / owners to provide 21st century ( actually 20th ) equipment and instill the doctrine; I note they are happy to spend mega-bucks on huge screen plotters etc...
 
The fisherman was extremely fortunate or more likely tenacious to stay afloat long enough to be picked up, especially without the aid of a LJ.
 
Seajet said:
A lifejacket needn't present any hazard at all if one chooses the right one; and though it may require a move away from the beloved Guy Cotton smocks, ( which I agree are good stuff and hard wearing, BUT no insulation, no reflective strips, no chance if overboard ! ) - modern waterproofs at virtually all price levels have tabs to secure a lifejacket to the jacket, so one takes the kit off and on just as a waterproof top.

No doubt this would be seen as 'fairy' if one fishing boat crew member tried it; it is up to skipper / owners to provide 21st century ( actually 20th ) equipment and instill the doctrine; I note they are happy to spend mega-bucks on huge screen plotters etc...
Click to expand...

FYI modern lifejackets no longer have the toggles to attach the lifejacket to oilies.

Also the statement 'He was not wearing a lifejacket' is not a criticism it's simply a statement.
Shorn
 
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