Keel rust, worth the effort?

[TreeMan24]

Hello everyone,

I recently went to have a look at a restoration project, the interior has already been restored by the seller however the hull and deck require hours of work. The deck work to me seems very do-able as it's just flakey paint and general issues you would find with a small yacht that has been left to stand outside unattended.
However my issue is with one of the keels and skeg, please see the pictures below and just reply with your opinion. Someone has already told me that there may be some rust coming through the fibre glass.

One image is of the skeg(obviously) and the other is a close up of my concerned keel.

Thank you in advance.
ST

 

[neilf39]

Keel would need the fibreglass grinding back around those cracks to see what water penetration there is. If water has got in and it is an encapsulated iron keel then when it rusts it expands and can break through the fibreglass. If its made of pellets rather than solid these can then fall out. Is there any movement on that skeg if pushed side to side? That crack is a bit suspicious. Again would need to be ground back to see if superficial or whether it will need some major work. It may all be superficial but you won't know without taking it back to check. Think i would have fixed the hull before working on the interior.

 

[TreeMan24]

Keel would need the fibreglass grinding back around those cracks to see what water penetration there is. If water has got in and it is an encapsulated iron keel then when it rusts it expands and can break through the fibreglass. If its made of pellets rather than solid these can then fall out. Is there any movement on that skeg if pushed side to side? That crack is a bit suspicious. Again would need to be ground back to see if superficial or whether it will need some major work. It may all be superficial but you won't know without taking it back to check. Think i would have fixed the hull before working on the interior.

There slight movement in the skeg if I grab it with both hands and put a bit of effort into it, having limited knowledge on the matter I wasn't sure if a bit of play was normal. Thanks for your reply ?

 

[V1701]

Hi & welcome to the forum,

If you haven't got to also buy an engine, rigging, sails, instruments, bunk cushions, etc. and most of the work is investment of time as opposed to money and you have the time and skills (these can be learned as you go along though and none of it is rocket science) to do the work yourself then it might be a viable proposition. Don't buy it just because you think it's cheap or a bargain, the work will take significantly longer than you think and don't forget to factor in storage costs. If you tell us what boat it is someone may be able to better advise on the repairs. I wonder if the owner would be willing for you to drill a hole at the bottom of the keel and the skeg to see if any water drains out...

 

[TreeMan24]

Hi & welcome to the forum,

If you haven't got to also buy an engine, rigging, sails, instruments, bunk cushions, etc. and most of the work is investment of time as opposed to money and you have the time and skills (these can be learned as you go along though and none of it is rocket science) to do the work yourself then it might be a viable proposition. Don't buy it just because you think it's cheap or a bargain, the work will take significantly longer than you think and don't forget to factor in storage costs. If you tell us what boat it is someone may be able to better advise on the repairs. I wonder if the owner would be willing for you to drill a hole at the bottom of the keel and the skeg to see if any water drains out...

Hi,
I believe the boat is a Hurley Signet S20?
She doesn't come with an engine so yes that would be the single biggest cost of putting her back in the water. I am confident that i could carry out the work that she needs, apart from the issues that I've raised in my post.
If it's just case of sanding back the fibreglass and grinding out the rust, that's a manageable task...but nothing is ever that simple haha
Thanks ??

 

[duncan99210]

This is a link to some pictures of the Signet 20 on the Hurley Owners website (free to access), so you can look and see if your project boat is in fact a Signet. Link is Hurley Owners Association Signet 20 Gallery
Lots of information and help available both on the website and on the linked FB page. I

 

[TreeMan24]

This is a link to some pictures of the Signet 20 on the Hurley Owners website (free to access), so you can look and see if your project boat is in fact a Signet. Link is Hurley Owners Association Signet 20 Gallery
Lots of information and help available both on the website and on the linked FB page. I

Thank you Duncan.
She's definitely a Hurley Signet.

 

[peteK]

The trailer may be worth more than the boat.

 

[vyv_cox]

There slight movement in the skeg if I grab it with both hands and put a bit of effort into it, having limited knowledge on the matter I wasn't sure if a bit of play was normal. Thanks for your reply ?

There should be absolutely no movement in the skeg. It should be a fairly simple job to unbolt it from inside, clean up and re-bed on a good sealant.

 

[V1701]

I don't mean anyone any disrespect but boats in such and better condition than that are being given away, not many but they are. Don't pay much for it if you do go ahead, no more than a few hundred quid and if the owner feels insulted because he's put some work in that's his choice (and as neilf39 said it's odd to have sorted the interior when there are structural issues needing attention). Do you know how old/what condition the sails and rigging are in?

On the positive side it's a small boat, I wouldn't be overly concerned about going at it with a grinder and doing some filling/fibreglassing, it's probably been out of the water some time so the hull will likely be about as dry as it can be. Neither are you going to see the repairs once it's done which means the finish doesn't have to be perfect so if you can get it somewhere you can work on it what else are you gonna do during lockdown? Good luck...

 

[TreeMan24]

I don't mean anyone any disrespect but boats in such and better condition than that are being given away, not many but they are. Don't pay much for it if you do go ahead, no more than a few hundred quid and if the owner feels insulted because he's put some work in that's his choice (and as neilf39 said it's odd to have sorted the interior when there are structural issues needing attention). Do you know how old/what condition the sails and rigging are in?

On the positive side it's a small boat, I wouldn't be overly concerned about going at it with a grinder and doing some filling/fibreglassing, it's probably been out of the water some time so the hull will likely be about as dry as it can be. Neither are you going to see the repairs once it's done which means the finish doesn't have to be perfect so if you can get it somewhere you can work on it what else are you gonna do during lockdown? Good luck...

Thanks!
I know what you mean, I have seen this type of boat advertised for around the 1k mark but what attracts me about this particular is that it's 20 minutes from and less distance away from the Marina/boat yards. So I'm just testing the water and seeing what people think about it.
The rigging surprisingly is in great condition, no rust, dents or splits etc. And the sails are white clean, which can't be said for the exterior of the boat lol.

 

[upcountry2]

Don’t want to rain on your parade but unless it is free and even then I would think twice, walk away.
as has been said trailer worth more than boat.
boats like this now have negative value.

 

[TreeMan24]

Don’t want to rain on your parade but unless it is free and even then I would think twice, walk away.
as has been said trailer worth more than boat.
boats like this now have negative value.

You're not the first person to have said that ? definitely won't be playing with that toy then.
Thanks.

 

[chriss999]

It depends on what you want. If this is your ‘ideal’ boat, you would enjoy doing the work and are not bothered by the amount of time you need to put in, then maybe go for it.
But if you want a cheap and good boat with relatively little work, then you will almost certainly find better.
Personally I’d look around.
What sort of sailing are you going to do? How many berths? Etc

 

[TreeMan24]

It depends on what you want. If this is your ‘ideal’ boat, you would enjoy doing the work and are not bothered by the amount of time you need to put in, then maybe go for it.
But if you want a cheap and good boat with relatively little work, then you will almost certainly find better.
Personally I’d look around.
What sort of sailing are you going to do? How many berths? Etc

I'm not overly convinced it will be a cheap project.
I'd be looking at weekend cruising, so short coastal passages with the odd night sail too.
With that in mind it's only the lady and I so a boat with V-berth and two, maybe even one aft berth should be ample for us. Nothing more than 23 feet, to keep costs down and still be large enough below.
The fella wants 550 for it, I've seen plenty for that money, or a little more that could be sailed away.. only difference is that they aren't conveniently down the road.

 

[Crazy-Diamond]

If you want to spend time and money on a project, this is ideal. If you actually want to go sailing anytime soon and not spend many thousands of pounds and countless days and days and weeks and weeks, this is NOT the right purchase. But a boat that works, floats and sails. It will be cheaper and quicker by many times than this.

 

[TreeMan24]

If you want to spend time and money on a project, this is ideal. If you actually want to go sailing anytime soon and not spend many thousands of pounds and countless days and days and weeks and weeks, this is NOT the right purchase. But a boat that works, floats and sails. It will be cheaper and quicker by many times than this.

Thanks man ??

 

[chriss999]

An important issue is where you will he sailing. If you can narrow down your likely sailing grounds you can then look at boats in marinas and boatyards locally. Boat transport is v expensive as a proportion of a small boat value, unless a trailer/sailer.

Mine is a kingfisher 20 which cost me about £400 some years ago to transport overland, trailer and 4x4 hire. Put the cost towards the cost of a boat if you don’t have to transport her.
If my boat magically disappeared I’d probably look for a Sadler 25 or 26.

 

[TreeMan24]

An important issue is where you will he sailing. If you can narrow down your likely sailing grounds you can then look at boats in marinas and boatyards locally. Boat transport is v expensive as a proportion of a small boat value, unless a trailer/sailer.

Mine is a kingfisher 20 which cost me about £400 some years ago to transport overland, trailer and 4x4 hire. Put the cost towards the cost of a boat if you don’t have to transport her.
If my boat magically disappeared I’d probably look for a Sadler 25 or 26.

Hi Chris,
That's a very valid point. If she was to be moved, she won't have to go far here 9n the coastline of South Wales, there are plenty of places she could be kept. The most local Marina is probably about 15 minutes away.

 

[Biggles Wader]

The boat is worthless so you are essentially buying the trailer with a project sat on it. Is the trailer in good nick?