Keel/Rudder design

coopec

coopec

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This thread was inspired by TernV1's comment "The OP's boat is heavy with a primitive unbalanced rudder." I have no argument with that but I wouldn't have used the word "primitive" - maybe "old fashioned"?

I believe the modern day production yachts are good for Coastal Cruising, sitting in a marina and club racing but definitely not for Blue Water Cruising.

I think this guy put it put it in a nutshell:

The boat is inspired by Kraken Yachts’ chairman, Dick Beaumont, 65, a veteran ocean sailor with 225,000 nautical miles under his keel. He wanted a safe blue water yacht for his retirement, but to his dismay discovered that all the major blue water yacht brands were compromised by having bolt-on keels and/ or unprotected blade rudders.
The world’s ‘safest’ blue water yacht launched - MySailing.com.au

Any comments?
 
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Baggywrinkle said:
Well he's trying to sell a yacht with a skeg hung rudder isn't he? ???
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Definitely AND definitely not bolt on fin keels.
But most skeg mounted rudders are not balanced ???

I'm not sure that I understand your comment?

Okay Okay!! I'm with you now! (Didn't think of that!) ? ?
 
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My friends 38’ Jeanneau, “Qui Donne une Merde?” was attacked by a giant squid in the southern ocean a year ago. The hideous leviathan had its huge tentacles wrapped around the stricken AWB in a vice-like grip and despite my mate’s best efforts with his Plastimo extendable boat hook, the ship was being pulled to its death. When the terrifying monster of the deep ripped off the vessel’s pathetically weak spade rudder (complete with it’s ridiculously under-spec’ed shaft) my mate saw his chance. Yanking the rudder from the awful beast, he wielded it like a giant fibreglass scimitar and started hacking away at the ghastly cephalopod’s tentacles, one by one. He even managed to save the tip from one of the tentacles to plug the whole in the hull left by the rudder shaft, and the ship was saved. To this day he maintains that had the rudder been a skeg-mounted one it would not have been so easily wrenched from the boat, and all would have been lost.
 
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coopec said:
This thread was inspired by TernV1's comment "The OP's boat is heavy with a primitive unbalanced rudder." I have no argument with that but I wouldn't have used the word "primitive" - maybe "old fashioned"?

I believe the modern day production yachts are good for Coastal Cruising, sitting in a marina and club racing but definitely not for Blue Water Cruising.

I think this guy put it put it in a nutshell:

The boat is inspired by Kraken Yachts’ chairman, Dick Beaumont, 65, a veteran ocean sailor with 225,000 nautical miles under his keel. He wanted a safe blue water yacht for his retirement, but to his dismay discovered that all the major blue water yacht brands were compromised by having bolt-on keels and/ or unprotected blade rudders.
The world’s ‘safest’ blue water yacht launched - MySailing.com.au

Any comments?
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While your boat is sat on the grass, people with production AWBs are out there sailing the oceans.

I don't beleive simply ticking the 'encapsulated keel' box makes a yacht safer.
That big OYster which sank was a grp failure of the upper keel/ keel root.
 
Skylark said:
How about “bolox”
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Exactly! To be fair, perhaps in the wilds of Australia people haven't heard of the ARC, or the Oyster World Rally, or any of the countless other events in which people enjoy cruising in perfectly ordinary production boats.
 
How timely your post is!

I've been thinking a lot lately about rogue waves which for years and years were thought to be of mythical status. No one believed the stories of the ancient mariners. But of course now we know they are fact and NASA says they are quite common but typically only last a few seconds.

Rogue waves appear from nowhere, cause danger and disappear at once. They may occur at the surface of a relatively calm sea, reach not very high amplitudes, but be fatal for ships and crew due to their unexpectedness and abnormal features.
Rogue waves in the ocean - review and progress

But what about the stories of ancient mariners of giant sea creatures that attacked their boats. They were considered myths as well. Well maybe their stories are true?

I was going to start off a thread to see what others do when their boat is attacked by a sea monster;

 
pvb said:
Exactly! To be fair, perhaps in the wilds of Australia people haven't heard of the ARC, or the Oyster World Rally, or any of the countless other events in which people enjoy cruising in perfectly ordinary production boats.
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Fin keels are a problem because they keep falling off :rolleyes:
 
TernVI said:
While your boat is sat on the grass, people with production AWBs are out there sailing the oceans.

I don't beleive simply ticking the 'encapsulated keel' box makes a yacht safer.
That big OYster which sank was a grp failure of the upper keel/ keel root.
Click to expand...

Tell us about the big OYster which sank. Are you referring to Cheeki Rafiki ?
 
coopec said:
Tell us about the big OYster which sank. Are you referring to Cheeki Rafiki ?
Click to expand...
Lots of boats built in the 1970s and 1980s have encapsulated ballast, where the keel is part of the hull moulding. The GRP fin contains steel punchings (the pellet of steel that is left after punching out the centre of a washer) and no bolts or studs. I’ve found these to be very strong and you only need to ensure the GRP casing is not compromised, leaving the punchings open to potential rusting.
7 checks after grounding a yacht
 
coopec said:
Tell us about the big OYster which sank. Are you referring to Cheeki Rafiki ?
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CheekI Rafiki was a bavaria or similar.
The large oyster was new and as a result of poor build quality the whole matrix ripped out of the hull whilst the keel was still bolted to the matrix.

Wouldn't it be fair to say an awb is capable of ocean sailing but a full keeled boat when the going gets tough will handle a lot better, have superior directional stability and a lot more of a comfortable ride?
 
pvb said:
Exactly! To be fair, perhaps in the wilds of Australia people haven't heard of the ARC, or the Oyster World Rally, or any of the countless other events in which people enjoy cruising in perfectly ordinary production boats.
Click to expand...

Maybe they go on these rallies so they have company when the rudder falls off:) Joking apart, I would rather have a balanced skeg mounted rudder but see no problem with bolt on keels as long as they're not high aspect.
 
Rappey said:
CheekI Rafiki was a bavaria or similar.
The large oyster was new and as a result of poor build quality the whole matrix ripped out of the hull whilst the keel was still bolted to the matrix.

Wouldn't it be fair to say an awb is capable of ocean sailing but a full keeled boat when the going gets tough will handle a lot better, have superior directional stability and a lot more of a comfortable ride?
Click to expand...

A young couple are trying to repair (I think) a Beneteau yacht that lost its' keel and everyone seems to think that was poor workmanship by Beneteau. They are posting their progress on YouTube and I've just been trying to find it but can't (there's that many accounts of keels falling off). But there's a few here anyway where keels have fallen off:

https://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=Benteau+keel+fell+off

When I find the link I will post it
 
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