Johnson 3.3 rebuild / service manual help (please help!)

[Balbas]

Hello all,

I've got an old woodie wayfarer - 52 years old this year and on sail number 999. As the wife insists on having an 'emergency engine' but has banned me from using my beloved old seagull because of the risk of life & limb to the kids - no sense of adventure if you ask me, I survived my childhood messing about with exposed engine components! - a couple of years ago I bought a Johnson 3.3 2stroke - one of the old ones with direct drive.

Thing is, this year I've dragged it out of the shed and found that 'old faithful' started second or third pull, and seems to be running really well, but isn't pumping water. I've checked the impeller and also for obvious blockages in the tell tale. The impeller is fine and I can feel exhaust gas coming out of the tell tale (I've pulled the pipe off and put my finger over the spigot on the side of the powerhead itself), so that would seem to be free from blockages.

The problem then would appear to be a blockage either in the powerhead water jacket, or perhaps more likely in the water pipe from the leg.

Which is why I've found your forum. I've got no manual and can't seem to find one anywhere, but see that these motors have been discussed here before and there seems to be a lot of knowledge. I understand that it's the same engine as all of the other 3.3 engines (and the 2.5hp's) of that era, but still no joy in finding a service manual. I'm reasonably confident in stripping engines down and putting them back together again, but find a manual invaluable for finding the not very obvious recessed bolt that it's bound to have, or to have an idea of torque settings or whatever.

Of course I could junk it and buy something newer, but I hate junking stuff I can fix.

So... if anyone has a manual (or even an exploded diagram) or knows where I can get one, I would be very grateful. In the meantime I'll stick around - looks like a useful and friendly forum and when the kids are old enough for more than 'day sailing' I'll be upgrading to a yacht, so I'll keep my ears pinned back to see what gems of knowledge I can pick up.

Thanks in advance.

 

[seumask]

I have a similar Johnson engine, direct drive, 2 stroke 2.X hp,
The basics on mine are:
Water impellor located behind the prop, remove pin on prop and housing is bolted on over the prop shaft, impellor slides on to shaft, watch for pin parallel to shaft IIRC.
At the head end remove the plastic engine covers with the screws around the central seam left and Right halves, and a couple of bolts on each side tank and carb and most bits simply bolt on and are obvious.
To check water ways remove the cylinder head that has the spark plug in it. You'll soon see if there's a build up of salt.

Starting from scratch I would first with new fuel and oil see if you can get the engine to fire up, if so check water pumping, if not replace impellor.
If wont fire , spark plug first , then clean carb.
Good luck, you can get away with out the manual which I don't have!
Carry a new spark plug and replace the old one, don't know why but this is often the source of trouble.

 

[VicS]

Hello all,

I've got an old woodie wayfarer - 52 years old this year and on sail number 999. As the wife insists on having an 'emergency engine' but has banned me from using my beloved old seagull because of the risk of life & limb to the kids - no sense of adventure if you ask me, I survived my childhood messing about with exposed engine components! - a couple of years ago I bought a Johnson 3.3 2stroke - one of the old ones with direct drive.

Thing is, this year I've dragged it out of the shed and found that 'old faithful' started second or third pull, and seems to be running really well, but isn't pumping water. I've checked the impeller and also for obvious blockages in the tell tale. The impeller is fine and I can feel exhaust gas coming out of the tell tale (I've pulled the pipe off and put my finger over the spigot on the side of the powerhead itself), so that would seem to be free from blockages.

The problem then would appear to be a blockage either in the powerhead water jacket, or perhaps more likely in the water pipe from the leg.

Which is why I've found your forum. I've got no manual and can't seem to find one anywhere, but see that these motors have been discussed here before and there seems to be a lot of knowledge. I understand that it's the same engine as all of the other 3.3 engines (and the 2.5hp's) of that era, but still no joy in finding a service manual. I'm reasonably confident in stripping engines down and putting them back together again, but find a manual invaluable for finding the not very obvious recessed bolt that it's bound to have, or to have an idea of torque settings or whatever.

Of course I could junk it and buy something newer, but I hate junking stuff I can fix.

So... if anyone has a manual (or even an exploded diagram) or knows where I can get one, I would be very grateful. In the meantime I'll stick around - looks like a useful and friendly forum and when the kids are old enough for more than 'day sailing' I'll be upgrading to a yacht, so I'll keep my ears pinned back to see what gems of knowledge I can pick up.

Thanks in advance.

Exploded diagrams on the BRP parts website at http://epc.brp.com/Index.aspx?lang=E&s1=8c4f4538-6ab7-4cc0-a689-e09c5709c289
Or on one of the American dealers sites eg http://www.boats.net/parts/search/BRP/JOHNSON/parts.html

You will find a Seloc manual that covers your model on http://boatinfo.no/lib/library.html

Id go for the channel between the leg and the power head as the most likely to be blocked

 

[Balbas]

Thanks both, that's helpful information. It runs, just doesn't pump water - so hopefully will be an easy fix! Either way it'll keep me out of trouble this weekend.

 

[Balbas]

I'll complete this in case anyone else is searching for info. I stripped the leg off the powerhead yesterday afternoon and it was clear that the waterways were blocked. A quick scrape around with a pick and I was satisfied that the head was free of gunge. If I poured my patented salt dissolving solution (vinegar) in one side, it flowed out of the other, and ran out of the telltale absolutely fine.

The leg was a bit worse. I took the pick to the waterways again and got them clear, but it was pretty clear that the pipe up from the impeller was blocked. So again the salt dissolving solution was deployed and it was given a stiff rodding (matron!) with some garden wire. Vinegar now flows out of the impeller casing as quickly as I can pour it in the top.

So the final steps will be to source the leg-head gasket, bolt it all back together, chuck it in the wheelie bin test tank and run it up.

 

[Balbas]

Another question though - what fuel/oil mix should I be using? I used to know, but I've not used the motor for a couple of years and can't remember. I'm assuming 50:1. Would that be right, or should it be 25:1?

Its a '99 motor in case that makes a difference.

 

[VicS]

Another question though - what fuel/oil mix should I be using? I used to know, but I've not used the motor for a couple of years and can't remember. I'm assuming 50:1. Would that be right, or should it be 25:1?

Its a '99 motor in case that makes a difference.

50:1 is the recommended mix for all Johnson and Evinrude premix 2 strokes from 1964 onwards, including those produced in the late 1980s originally badged as 100:1.

Some small engines produced between 1964 and the mid 1970s, and which do not have needle bearings throughout, benefit from a little extra oil, however.

 

[Balbas]

50:1 is the recommended mix for all Johnson and Evinrude premix 2 strokes from 1964 onwards, including those produced in the late 1980s originally badged as 100:1.

Some small engines produced between 1964 and the mid 1970s, and which do not have needle bearings throughout, benefit from a little extra oil, however.

Thanks Vic. Gasket has now been ordered along with a new impeller. No doubt my 3yr old boy will want to help Daddy put it all back together again (otherwise known as getting in the way and asking questions at awkward times, whilst all the time being endearingly cute), so with a bit of luck and a following wind we'll be back on the water in time for the weekend.

As an aside I tried to fire up the old Seagull in the tank the other day and it wasn't having any of it. I can't be bothered to try to fix it, so that'll be going as scrap.

 

[VicS]

Thanks Vic. Gasket has now been ordered along with a new impeller. No doubt my 3yr old boy will want to help Daddy put it all back together again (otherwise known as getting in the way and asking questions at awkward times, whilst all the time being endearingly cute), so with a bit of luck and a following wind we'll be back on the water in time for the weekend.

As an aside I tried to fire up the old Seagull in the tank the other day and it wasn't having any of it. I can't be bothered to try to fix it, so that'll be going as scrap.

A intact Seagull is worth money. Someone will buy it and sort it out. It would be criminal to scrap it just because you are too lazy to fix it.

Advertise it on John Williams Saving old Seagulls forum http://www.saving-old-seagulls.co.uk/phpbb3/ Guaranteed then to find a caring new custodian

At the very least give it away in return for a small donation to charity.

 

[Balbas]

A intact Seagull is worth money. Someone will buy it and sort it out. It would be criminal to scrap it just because you are too lazy to fix it.

Advertise it on John Williams Saving old Seagulls forum http://www.saving-old-seagulls.co.uk/phpbb3/ Guaranteed then to find a caring new custodian

At the very least give it away in return for a small donation to charity.

Wilco. If anyone knows of someone who wants a currently non running longshaft seagull, drop me a PM. I won't be doing anything with it probably until mid August at the earliest anyway. Happy to give it away for the price of postage.

 

[MoodySabre]

Saving Old Seagulls - the guy who runs it is in our marina. He has a green Morris 1000 van with brass portholes that form the O of the S O S!

 

[VicS]

Wilco. If anyone knows of someone who wants a currently non running longshaft seagull, drop me a PM. I won't be doing anything with it probably until mid August at the earliest anyway. Happy to give it away for the price of postage.

If you pblish any detail such as the model and serial number here the mods will declare it as advertising and expunge the post, but you could advertise it on the "for sale" board with complete details.

 

[VicS]

Saving Old Seagulls - the guy who runs it is in our marina. He has a green Morris 1000 van with brass portholes that form the O of the S O S!

Maddy the Minor http://www.saving-old-seagulls.co.uk/maddy_the_minor/maddy_the_minor.htm

But Nick Gates has gone one better