Jim Shead boat listing

Minutes of the Meeting held on Thursday 19th May, Benson Parish Hall, Benson


21/11 Present
John Dalton (IWA) - Chairman
Margherita Davidson (Chairman RUG 1&2)
Robert Heavens (Osney Marina Club)
Tim & Linda Mountain (Benson Marina Moorers)
Bob Mainwaring (EA Benson Lock Keeper)
Helen Page (EA Area Navigation Team Leader)
Jed Ramsey (EA Technical Officer)
Rodney Davis (Upper Thames Motor Yacht Club)
Alan Woolford (Chairman, RYA Thames Valley)
Graham Paterson (NABO)
Philip Sachse (Oxford Ditch CC / ATYC)
Trevor Tate (RTS)
Alan Dawe (Cholsey PC)
Sue Cooper (IWA Oxfordshire)
David Eatwell (ATYC)
John Griffin (Crowmarsh Parish Council)
Pete Eldridge (Benson Community Association)
 
Yippee I am famous...........H,mm....Wonder if my right to privacy has been invaded etc etc ...........must get my team of crack lawyers involved straight away .........got to be worth a couple of Mill.....whats Cherie Blair up to at the moment.
 
Would that boat be the famous Harpagon (London)? What a very kind gentlemen to give the Three Men in a Boat a tow. and credit where credit is due the nice man's name appears in the credits at the end!!


LOL!!!
 
Moxon said:
Now that's hilarious!
Click to expand...


Sh....this is top secret...but now I know

The name of the boat
Where it lives
What type of boat it is
Who the owner is and more importantly exactly who to wave at when we pass by

Well only me and........... the odd 2 million other people who watched the programme on BBC :):):)
 
Those of you who have been on here for a while may well remember a poster/member named BERYL, she was always complaining about Jim Shead's site and would never admit to understanding that there really wasn't anything on there that infringed her privacy. Strangely she claimed she lived in South Stoke, ie Byron's parish and was really quite abusive to Byron particularly. Benson isn't a million miles away from South Stoke. Just a thought! :)
 
SailorBill said:
Well done. I'm sure you feel proud of yourself for your 'achievement' of walking all over someone's wish for privacy.

What the hell is wrong with some people here? It doesn't matter if you agree or disagree with an individual's wish for privacy. What matters is that we all have freedom of choice and some people, for a variety of reasons, choose to guard their privacy. Some of you want to take away that individual freedom of choice and attack those who argue for it. What kind of society does that remind you of?
Click to expand...

Yes, I am delighted.

Mr Mountain's details were already out there on the internet, but unnoticed because most people had never heard of him to even care what information was out there.

The information that appears on Jim's site doesn't impinge on his privacy at all, and in any case his wish for privacy appears to have deserted him when the opportunity to appear on the TV presented itself.

I am delighted that Jim took up my offer of putting him in touch with the ORG who provided him with pro-bono legal assistance, and I am delighted that a useful resource is back.

People can choose to guard their privacy in many ways, and the very best of luck to them. What they cannot choose to do is to lie about the copyright status of information in order to have it removed.
 
Brayman said:
Those of you who have been on here for a while may well remember a poster/member named BERYL, she was always complaining about Jim Shead's site and would never admit to understanding that there really wasn't anything on there that infringed her privacy. Strangely she claimed she lived in South Stoke, ie Byron's parish and was really quite abusive to Byron particularly. Benson isn't a million miles away from South Stoke. Just a thought! :)
Click to expand...

Presumably had a sex change then:D
 
Hi everybody!

I'm new to this forum but thought, although it is a little late in day to reply to you all, I should, as people have been asking who started the 'for or against Jim Shead's boat listing site' furore!

I found this thread after having been the one to open the can of worms on www.canalworld.net. (Please type this in your address bar as I have problems with attaching links to websites!) about the reason why Jim Shead's Boat List and website has subsequently been shut down.

I had used Jim's website before to research boats and had looked at other pages on his site which I found to be both informative and very useful. Recently a friend of mine, who has a narrow boat, wanted to know who had built his!, and I thought I know I will check with Jim Shead's List and see if I can find anything out. I found his site to be down.

The next day 4th of Feb I decided to see if anyone had posted why on canalworld.net only to be told that his Domain Name needed renewing in April.

This did not answer my question, so I went back on the web as I knew his site could be up one day then down the next.

To my surprise, on his boat list page I found this statement:- "The web hosting company for this web site, 123-reg, have ordered that two entries be deleted from the Boat Listing following a complaint by Tim Mountain that the entries infringed his copyright. 123-reg have not upheld this complaint but they have still insisted that the items be removed before they would reinstate my website. Reluctantly I have withdrawn all my boat listing rather than just removing the two items because firstly the list would no longer reflect the true situation at the time the data was captured and secondly giving special treatment to boat owners who make spurious complaints would encourage more to follow suit.

I am taking legal advice on this matter and hope to restore the Boat Listing as soon as possible."

FURTHER INFORMATION ON THE HISTORY OF THE BOAT LISTING


"The Boat Listing contains individual records of around 90,000 boats, past and present,. These records have been supplied annually since 2005 by British Waterways and the Environment Agency (EA) under the Freedom of Information Act. The Broads Authority is now also suppling data. My website is the only public source of this data. Some Thames boaters challenged my rights to this data so in 2006 the EA only sent me a truncated version of their records. I appealed to the Information Commissioner's Office (ICO) and in September 2006 the ICO ruled against EA, who have supplied the data annually ever since."

I posted this on the canal forum under 'chloe' in order to help explain why Jim Shead’s website was down and thus opened a can of worms.

Like Magnette I too wondered who this Tim Mountain was and found through Google a thread that led to this very website and a statement written, 2005, on this forum by the said Tim Mountain, which shocked me and riled me! Sadly, when I tried to find it again on your forum it had disappeared!!!

Next, on the canal forum somebody else wrote "have you seen this:- "

"Imprtant Info Re your boat

by*Commodore*» Thu Oct 06, 2005 1:43 pm

I received this email from a boat owner on the Thames:*


A few weeks ago I discovered that an Idiot (these are his own words, used by*
him, describing himself, on his web site) has obtained information of over*
40,000 boats from both the Environment Agency and British Waterways. He has*
published this information on his web site. Although I resent giving*
publicity to 'this idiot', I would ask that you take a look at*
www.jim-shead.co.uk*and then follow the link to 'The Boat Listing'. If you*
own a boat registered with either the EA or BW, then full details about your*
boat are published for all to see. In most cases, with an EA registration,*
the location of your boat will also be shown. I totally object to the*
details of my boat being published on the Internet by this idiot. Publishing*
details in this way constitutes a serious security risk. It is interesting*
to note that Jim Shead does not publish his address or phone numbers on his*
web site! I contacted Jim Shead, via e-mail and asked him to remove the*
details of my boat from his web site and he has refused.*

If, like me, you are unhappy about 'this idiot' (his words), please e-mail*
him with your objection, to*M62@jim-shead.com*or his other e-mail address is*
me@jim-shead.com*

Please also send your objection to*julia.simpson@environment-agency.gov.uk*
or British Waterways at*enquiries.hq@britishwaterways.co.uk*

If you are unhappy about your details being published then please let me*
know via the e-mail link below and I will keep you updated on steps we can*
take to resolve this situation. If you support 'the idiot', then I am sure*
that he would also like to hear from you with your support. This information*
has been sent out to contacts that I have and in turn it may have been*passed on to you by one or more of your concerned friends. Please be assured*
that unless you contact me with your offer of help, no details will be held*
by us.*

protestagainst.theidiot@ntlworld.com*

PLEASE PASS THIS ON TO AS MANY BOAT OWNERS AS YOU CAN.
Idiot
by Tim Mountain » Sat Oct 08, 2005 5:27 pm

I have all the idiot's details. Home address phone numbers etc. Please email me via the main email address if you need details.
protestagainst.theidiot@ntlworld.com

Tim Mountain

The Idiot by Tim Mountain » Sat Oct 08, 2005 5:36 pm

The idiot has now posted a boaters poll on his web site I have included a link for you below which goes to the poll and not directly to his site. As you will see the voting options are very one sided. I think that the only people who might vote 'Very useful' would be someone who would use the information for illegal gain! Please go to the poll and make your vote.

Please also email the EA with your complaint / comments. If you would like to contact me with support for an action group, then please do so via
protestagainst.theidiot@ntlworld.com.

The link to use for voting is http://www.pollhead.com/?p=1131&msg=pro ... ee+this%21
or vote via his websiteTim Mountain


Tender by Tim Mountain » Thu Oct 27, 2005 11:14 pm

If you have a tender for your boat and it is registered with the EA then this to is shown (along with it's engine if applicable) on the idiots site.
Tim Mountain

Commodore*


I did not think what I originally posted would lead to a character assination or witch hunt of Tim Mountain and for this I apologise to you Tim but I cannot apologise to you for what you have lead me and others to think of you and what has come out of my innocent post!!

I realised this was the (2005) thread I had read on your forum bit did not comment further as others picked up on what he had said and the rest is history!

I have also read the Rug 3 minutes October 10TH 2012 "Concern was expressed about a website run by Jim Shead which published a variety of data about boats on the river including some obtained under FOI, which should not be used for commercial purposes. NMS confirmed that they were aware of the website and were looking into it. Tim Mountain complained that intelligence he had given about unlicensed boats had not been acted on; he felt that patrol boats sent out for other purposes could have followed it up. NMS emphasised that registration policing had to be done in a targeted way. He agreed that performance in the past had not always been adequate; the enforcement team was new and was getting up to speed.
and acknowledge his reply to the witch hunt on this forum but feel it is what is written above and what has transpired that has caused so much upset, not perhaps what was said at the meeting. in reply to an EA spokesperson.

Chloe
 
Hi Everybody!

Update to Chloe's post

Any way I gather that things have progressed as they always do past and present.

On Feb 4th in Towpath Talk Battle to restore boat listingPublished: 11:36AM Feb 4th, 2013
By: Web editor
UPDATE: February 6: Jim contacted us to say his whole site has now been closed and he has not been given the option to take any action to restore it.

He writes: " I would like to thank all those people who have emailed me in support of the boat listing. Also the Thames Forum at http://www.ybw.com/ has a supportive thread on the matter."


UPDATE: Jim's site was suspended again on Tuesday February 5, he believes because of the wording of the explanation. He has agreed to remove the offending words if granted access to do so.

INTERNET users seeking Jim Shead’s listing of around 90,000 boats, past and present, have been unable to access the page following a dispute about copyright infringement.

Jim told Towpath Talk that he had reluctantly withdrawn all his listing following an order by web hosting company 123-reg that two entries be deleted.

The listing contains information from navigation authorities which has been obtained under the Freedom of Information Act and, as such, is in the public domain.

He is currently taking legal advice on the matter but says it could be a long battle and has posted an explanation on his website at http://www.jim-shead.com/waterways/boatreg.php?bn=

Press release from Jim Shead issued 14th Feb:
The disappearing Boat Listing

123-reg, the web hosting company for Jim Shead's web site, have ordered that two entries be deleted from the Boat Listing following a complaint by Tim Mountain that the entries infringed his copyright. 123-reg have not upheld this complaint but they did still insist that the items be removed before they would reinstate the website at www.jim-shead.com. Reluctantly Jim withdrew all the boat listing rather than just removing the two items as he considered that the list would no longer reflect the true situation at the time the data was captured and secondly that giving special treatment to boat owners who make spurious complaints would encourage others to follow suit.

Unfortunately when he placed this explanation on his website Tim Mountain complained again and this time 123-reg closed the whole website.

One of the Boat Listing users suggested we should get in touch with the Open Rights Group who raised the matter with its legal panel. McEvedys Solicitors & Attorneys Ltd agreed to assist us pro bono and with their help we have contacted the hosting company challenging the subsistence of any copyright in craft registration data and Mr. Mountain's claim to be its author. We await further developments.

Further Information on the history of the Boat Listing

The Boat Listing contains individual records of around 90,000 boats, past and present,. These records have been supplied annually since 2005 by British Waterways and the Environment Agency (EA) under the Freedom of Information Act. The Broads Authority is now also supplying data. Jim Shead's website is the only public source of this data.

I beleive his whole site not just the boat listing will be up and ruuning shortly, if it's not already.

We won!
 
I wonder if anyone objected to the late lamented Lloyds Register of Yachts which gave a whole mass of information about each boat and the owners name. This was updated annually. True it only carried information on vessels that were Part 1 registered but in the days of Yore nearly everyone was part 1 registered. Today these old books are a valuable archive resource.
 
Last edited:
Good result.- my Thames boat is there and I have no issues with this whatsoever

Having read the thread and Tim Mountain's communication then I find that the way in which he refers to Jim Shead to be most objectionable and unwarranted.

What an idiot Tim Mountain is.
 
I think it should be recognised that the list is by no means accurate or reliable in its detail. Both my previous and current boats are listed with the same name even though the EA were notified, and acknowledged the change, and the list shows Last registration recorded on 28-May-2011 which was some 8 months after I sold it.
 
Very much enjoyed that clip of Three men in a boat being towed by that nice friendly Thames boat owner,whos name escapes me at the moment......was it Mr Underhill ? .
Apologies to JRR Tolkien. :)
 
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