jabsco loo questions

laika said:
I appreciate the undeniably good theory but surely a couple of litres won't fill the bowl so except at the bottom, is it going to be more effective than a wipe over? And "cheap vinegar" isn't really that cheap. Perhaps my view is coloured by not having a car to drive out to vinegarmart on the out-of-town industrial estate and then not having any spare locker space to store a barrel of it. It's not much less than 80p a litre in the normal stores I have access to
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.... also works well diluted with water. Good results even at 5 - 1 ratio.
Just offering good honest advice. Whatever is decided, this would be low risk solution.
 
johnalison said:
I often find that the squeak settles and goes away after a while. For many years we have cruised Baltic, and back via the Dutch canals. Our loo can be guaranteed to start squeaking as soon as we get to the less saline Baltic or Dutch fresh water but for the squeak to disappear as soon as good healthy North Sea water is pumped through. My theory is that the particulates and plankton provide lubrication. For the OP, I would say that a quick dose of olive oil will establish that it is the pump, and a better solution can then be applied as required.
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interesting as we are in a brackish water marina only seeing salt intake around HWs. Anyway loo is sitting with bowl full of 500ml white vinegr and normal outside water, will leave that loo overnight and see. Have ordered some Harpic with limescsale remover too for our next grocery delivery if that vinegar mix fails but will use it with great care.
 
vyv_cox said:
Hydrochloric acid as sold in Spain, France, Italy and Greece is intended for direct use in domestic drains and bought by millions of housewives. It is sometimes labelled as being about 30%, but this is the dilution of the concentrated acid, which is itself 37% HCl dissolved in water.
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Care is needed, Vyv, as that's not always the case. Hydrochloric acid intended for use in swimming pools, widely sold in many Med countries, is truly >30%. It's powerful stuff which visibly fumes when the cap's taken off. Typically sold in 5l plastic bottles which are not red, although large parts of the label may be.
 
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Update. Leaving vinegar very diluted in overnight has clean a lot of scale off but not all and the squealing is unchanged even after squirting neat vinegar under the rim. squeals seem to come from centre back by the seat hinges where most of the flush water exits and corresponds to the up stroke of the pump which I believe is water 'in' stroke. will try 'Harpic with limescale remover' next and maybe try to inject some in via the infeed pipe from pump to bowl to get it into the porcelain channels.
 
macd said:
Care is needed, Vyv, as that's not always the case. Hydrochloric acid intended for use in swimming pools, widely sold in many Med countries, is truly >30%. It's powerful stuff which visibly fumes when the cap's taken off. Typically sold in 5l plastic bottles which are not red, although large parts of the label may be.
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But not sold in supermarkets in my experience, whereas the dilute stuff is. I guess you would need to search around a bit to buy it that strong.

This one bought in Leros. It says 20% but I make that near enough 8% w/w.
 
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Pleased you’ve tried the vinegar trick. Remember the neater it is the more effective it becomes. It also has no effect on other components.
 
Re. The squeak. The instructions say to open and grease the piston with synthetic grease annually. It really works.

Vinegar probably does the most damage (rough on the rubber parts) per unit of scale removed of any common chemical (based on testing). HCl, lactic acid (CLR), and phosphoric acid are all good choices for Jabsco.
 
thinwater said:
Re. The squeak. The instructions say to open and grease the piston with synthetic grease annually. It really works.

Vinegar probably does the most damage (rough on the rubber parts) per unit of scale removed of any common chemical (based on testing). HCl, lactic acid (CLR), and phosphoric acid are all good choices for Jabsco.
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Piston squeak I understand and have greased many a plunger over the years but this is a definite 'squeal' not a 'squeak'. it appears to emanate from the rim dead centre rear of bowl, maybe a bit of captive grass weed acting as a reed. or restricted passageway in porcelain bowl itself from limescale?
 
Using bicarbonate of soda an alkali with an acid might not achieve much as they will neutralise each other. Years ago I had weed and scale right through the cooler matrix of a Volvo Penta plate heat exchanger block from a TMD40 engine. Brick cleaner removed the scale but left the weed, so after much flushing I then used a strong solution of caustic soda. Job done.
 
Robin said:
perhaps coca cola would do the trick.a swell as be a deserved disposal route.
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I tried that and it did nothing.
Spirits of salts I used to clean up some anodes and from that experience would not use it in a indoor environment as it is very aggressive and the fumes given off could cause serious injury.

Harpic is based on Hydrochloric acid and it does soften limescale.
 
superheat6k said:
Using bicarbonate of soda an alkali with an acid might not achieve much as they will neutralise each other. Years ago I had weed and scale right through the cooler matrix of a Volvo Penta plate heat exchanger block from a TMD40 engine. Brick cleaner removed the scale but left the weed, so after much flushing I then used a strong solution of caustic soda. Job done.
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the bicarb plus vinegar trick was from a u tube 'solution' and it's merit comes from the extreme effervescence that results from the mix, Quite amazing on a galley sink drain which had seen little use as it was the drainer sink and we prefer to use a bowl for washing dishes(dumped directly overboard after use not down boat drains) and main sink for draining dishes, leaving an infill cover in place for extra worktop space on the 'drainer'.infils are 'granite' and a veritable PITA to
move around albeit pretty looking.
 
MartynG said:
I tried that and it did nothing.
Spirits of salts I used to clean up some anodes and from that experience would not use it in a indoor environment as it is very aggressive and the fumes given off could cause serious injury.

Harpic is based on Hydrochloric acid and it does soften limescale.
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Presumably the acid was reacting with the zinc, in which case the gas given off would be hydrogen. When reacting with limescale the gas is carbon dioxide. People all over the world clean their drains with hydrochloric acid, without injury.
 
vyv_cox said:
Presumably the acid was reacting with the zinc, in which case the gas given off would be hydrogen. When reacting with limescale the gas is carbon dioxide. People all over the world clean their drains with hydrochloric acid, without injury.
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Tried hydrochloric in one of our heads, never again. Lots of bubbling, foul smell and joker valve turned inside out. Magic sponge will clean lime scale from bowl and old cooking oil stops the pump squeaking.
 
Graham376 said:
Tried hydrochloric in one of our heads, never again. Lots of bubbling, foul smell and joker valve turned inside out. .
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Be very careful using hydrochloric acid in your heads

This is what happened to the pump on my Lavic after using HCI

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There is something unusual going on here. This has the look of stress corrosion cracking, not usually seen with chlorides in plastic. I suspect either an unusual plastic, stronger acid than is usually used, or some other factor such as solvents. I have been using HCl with various toilets from Jabsco and RM for years and never seen anything like this.
 
vyv_cox said:
There is something unusual going on here. This has the look of stress corrosion cracking, not usually seen with chlorides in plastic. I suspect either an unusual plastic, stronger acid than is usually used, or some other factor such as solvents. I have been using HCl with various toilets from Jabsco and RM for years and never seen anything like this.
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The acid I used is sold here as pool acid to adjust the PH of pool water to compensate for the chlorine used to sanitise the pool water so could be quite strong.

I understand the plastic that is used is polypropylene which is quite inert as I understand.

My view is that the CO2 produced build up too much pressure and the head pipe became blocked and the inlet non return valve was held closed by the pressure.

The pump worked perfectly before I used the HCI so I don't think there was any preexisting stress cracks buy there could have been.
 
Rogershaw said:
The acid I used is sold here as pool acid to adjust the PH of pool water to compensate for the chlorine used to sanitise the pool water so could be quite strong.
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As I suggested in post #24, pool acid should be used with particular care. It's usually 30% concentrated or greater, which is hefty stuff considering the highest possible practical concentration for hydrochloric acid is only 38%. Concentrations over 22% or so produce acidic mists which are highly corrosive and dangerous, especially when in confined spaces, and particularly to the respiratory tract.

It's a world away from the stuff bought in red bottles in supermarkets.
 
macd said:
As I suggested in post #24, pool acid should be used with particular care. It's usually 30% concentrated or greater, which is hefty stuff considering the highest possible practical concentration for hydrochloric acid is only 38%. Concentrations over 22% or so produce acidic mists which are highly corrosive and dangerous, especially when in confined spaces, and particularly to the respiratory tract.

It's a world away from the stuff bought in red bottles in supermarkets.
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I agree just showing what can happen if you are not careful.
 
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