Jabasco pump shaft still leaking

[stu9000]

Hi

I tried greasing it with Vaseline but it came off within about 10 pulls.
I also chucked some olive oil down the pan (forgot the white vinegar) and the action is quite smooth now.
But water still leaks from the base of the shaft.

I wondered how unclean it might be as the joker valve probably isnt a perfect one way system and the waste goes through the same cylinder.
Perhaps not the biggest risk to health and not much "dirtier" than the river water, but I would like to stop the leak if I can.
Any suggestions?

 

[Javelin]

Have spent way too many hours trying to fix this problem on numerous boats so now I just buy a replacement pump for £60 and fit.
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/like/221261005062?limghlpsr=true&hlpv=2&ops=true&viphx=1&hlpht=true&lpid=108&chn=ps&device=c&rlsatarget=&adtype=pla&crdt=0&ff3=1&ff11=ICEP3.0.0-L&ff12=67&ff13=80&ff14=108&ff19=0

 

[Heckler]

Hi

I tried greasing it with Vaseline but it came off within about 10 pulls.
I also chucked some olive oil down the pan (forgot the white vinegar) and the action is quite smooth now.
But water still leaks from the base of the shaft.

I wondered how unclean it might be as the joker valve probably isnt a perfect one way system and the waste goes through the same cylinder.
Perhaps not the biggest risk to health and not much "dirtier" than the river water, but I would like to stop the leak if I can.
Any suggestions?

I have found that the slightest bit of carbonate in the joker valve causes a leak. i used to physically remove it and clean but now, with serious acid available in the supermkt in Portugal, I pump some through and it does the biz!
S

 

[VicS]

Hi

I tried greasing it with Vaseline but it came off within about 10 pulls.
I also chucked some olive oil down the pan (forgot the white vinegar) and the action is quite smooth now.
But water still leaks from the base of the shaft.

I wondered how unclean it might be as the joker valve probably isnt a perfect one way system and the waste goes through the same cylinder.
Perhaps not the biggest risk to health and not much "dirtier" than the river water, but I would like to stop the leak if I can.
Any suggestions?

It should only be "clean" water leaking from the top of the pump. The chamber below the piston handles the effluent while the chamber above pumps the incoming flushing water.

The replacement seal assembly is available but it is generally suggested that you replace the whole pump assembly with a modern "twist and lock" one. Then, if you wish, service the old one to keep as a complete spare assembly


Go to the jabscoshop website for more details and exploded diagram etc

 

[theoldsalt]

The shaft seal needs to be replaced. If the pump hasn't been serviced for some time buy a service kit. If the pump is really old buy a new pump; they do not cost much more than the service kit so this is normally the preferred recommendation.

 

[stu9000]

Thanks all, a replacement pump is the way to go!
Looks like an easy fit too.

Why the twist and lock though?

 

[Cloven]

Thanks all, a replacement pump is the way to go!
Looks like an easy fit too.

Why the twist and lock though?

Gives an added measure of security against backflow if users forget to leave the lever in the back in the correct position. If the pump handle is locked, the backflow pressure cannot lift the pump handle.

FWIW I have given up trying to service these pumps, mega hassle as the parts in France are stupidly expensive. As you have sussed, just get a new pump. Last time round as I needed seat hinges as well and as I was fitting new pipes, I just bought a complete new toilet for under £100.

 

[VicS]

Gives an added measure of security against backflow if users forget to leave the lever in the back in the correct position. If the pump handle is locked, the backflow pressure cannot lift the pump handle.

.

Surely it only prevents back flow via the discharge. It does nothing to the flush water inlet control does it ?

 

[gregcope]

Having had a similar issue...

I remove the whole top, only to find that you can replace the pump handle shaft seal - comes with the larger plastic fitting.

However, having split the pump and rebuilt it, it leaked. Really annoying as I spent a good few hours resolving the above, and was faced with a non-working flush rather than a leaky one.

Replaced the whole lot with a complete Pump assembly, in about 5 minutes. I shall be ordering another spare of these - yes might be £20 more than a service kit, but I value my time ...

https://www.marinesuperstore.com/item/99197841/jabsco-pump-assembly-3000

 

[Cloven]

Surely it only prevents back flow via the discharge. It does nothing to the flush water inlet control does it ?

Sorry, I just assumed that was how it worked. On my previous non Twist 'n Lock pump, on occasions I found the pump handle raised and just assumed that this was water pressure that was doing this. Not fully conversant with the internal operation of the pump where the water was coming from I don't know.

 

[VicS]

Sorry, I just assumed that was how it worked. On my previous non Twist 'n Lock pump, on occasions I found the pump handle raised and just assumed that this was water pressure that was doing this. Not fully conversant with the internal operation of the pump where the water was coming from I don't know.

It's the water pressure from the discharge, via a leaky joker valve, that causes the pump handle to rise and if the valve in the base lets by it'll flood back into the bowl as well. The twist and lock system prevents this happening. Although a vented anti-siphon loop in the discharge hose should prevent all but a hoseful of water seeping back into the bowl.

Its still necessary to have a vented anti-syphon loop and/or shut the inlet seacock if the top of toilet is below the waterline to prevent syphoning via the inlet.

The reason to set the flush/dry lever to flush is so that it does not permanently deform the little flap valve it operates only when the toilet is faily close to the waterline will it prevent syphoning.

 

[stu9000]

... set the flush/dry lever to flush is so that it does not permanently deform the little flap valve ...

Thanks.
Just to be clear, is your advice that I should leave the left/right switch to "flow" rather than "closed"?
I thought this switch was in place to protect against potential in flow.

S

 

[stu9000]

Got it!

I bought the full pump unit.
Im all for saving a few quid but I don't fancy messing about with bog water.
All I need to do now is work out how to undo the lower large diameter pipe without half a loop of dirty water pouring out all over the heads. Perhaps Ill dry her out for a tide. The joy of twin fins!

 

[VicS]

Thanks.
Just to be clear, is your advice that I should leave the left/right switch to "flow" rather than "closed"?
I thought this switch was in place to protect against potential in flow.

S

no, sorry for the confusion, you are right the valve should be left in the closed position.

If the toilet is below the heeled waterline though the hose normally supplied fitted between the pump and the bowl should be replaced by a vented loop. This will safeguard against syphoning, regardless of the position and correct functioning of the flush control valve, whenever the seacock is open.

 

[RichardS]

no, sorry for the confusion, you are right the valve should be left in the closed position.

Are you sure that you weren't right the first time Vic.

I used to leave the lever on the right / pump out / closed position as recommended by Jabsco but now I leave it in the left / pump in / open position as it does relieve the continuous pressure on the valve and spring, as you explained previously.

Richard

 

[vyv_cox]

All I need to do now is work out how to undo the lower large diameter pipe without half a loop of dirty water pouring out all over the heads. Perhaps Ill dry her out for a tide. The joy of twin fins!

I have worked out a technique for doing this with a plastic bag. Inspect the bag first for any holes or damage of course. In my case the joker valve housing is almost touching the toilet base timber so no other container will go beneath it. The bag catches the majority of water and can be eased out without spilling too much of it.

 

[stu9000]

Are you sure that you weren't right the first time Vic.

I used to leave the lever on the right / pump out / closed position as recommended by Jabsco but now I leave it in the left / pump in / open position as it does relieve the continuous pressure on the valve and spring, as you explained previously.

Richard

Ok... so, leaving on the right locks it off but puts long term pressure on the spring
Leaving it on the left (e.g. when not on board) leaves the system open to potential syphoning..?

 

[stu9000]

I have worked out a technique for doing this with a plastic bag. Inspect the bag first for any holes or damage of course. In my case the joker valve housing is almost touching the toilet base timber so no other container will go beneath it. The bag catches the majority of water and can be eased out without spilling too much of it.

Having looked at the pic, this makes perfect sense. perhaps a good rubble sack rather than a cheap supermarket bag tho!

 

[VicS]

Are you sure that you weren't right the first time Vic.

I used to leave the lever on the right / pump out / closed position as recommended by Jabsco but now I leave it in the left / pump in / open position as it does relieve the continuous pressure on the valve and spring, as you explained previously.Richard

Yes and no ! At first I was going along with suggestions that leaving it closed puts unnecessary pressure on the valve, valve etc but then I read rge instructions and realised theysaid it should be left in the closed position

Ok... so, leaving on the right locks it off but puts long term pressure on the spring
Leaving it on the left (e.g. when not on board) leaves the system open to potential syphoning..?

If toilet is correctly installed with a vented antisyphon loops it should not be necessary to rely on the flush control valve to prevent inflow but it would be wise to close the seacocks when leaving the boat anyway.

Leaving the flush control valve shut may be a convenient method of closing off the inlet while you are on board, freeing you from the choree of closing the seacocks after every use. The "twist and lock" pump will do for the outlet what the flush control valve does for the inlet.

If you don't have correctly installed antisyphon loops (and the toilet is below the water line) the use of these two devices to stop inflow and back-flow becomes more important, although the real solution is to fit the antisyphon loops as described in the installation instructions.

 

[stu9000]

Thanks. I do close the seacocks when not on board. It is a good point. Perhaps I will leave the switch in the left "open" position in this situation.
There is no vented anti syphon at the top of the loop so I will close the switch and lock the pump when on board. I don't suppose my Jaguar 27's heads are more than an an inch or two below the waterline but I don't fancy testing out whether syphoning is likely.