Is vacuum infused hulls the next big trend?

[Hugin]

.... and I'm not only thinking for the expensive brands/models. The cheaper brands/models are getting aboard too it seems.

GreenLine is already using it for all their relatively inexpensive models.

Recently I read that Galeon in Poland is preparing a 30ft flybridge with vacuum infused hull and also has a hardtop based on the same hull in the pipeline.

Today I stumbled on the new Beneteau Gran Turismo 35..... so far available only in the US and Brazil it seems, no mentioning on their European website. It's a slightly bigger boat than the GT 34, but with vacuum infused hull it's 300kg lighter.

Bavaria will soon introduce its new 360 Sport in three versions, open/hardtop/coupé.... but no mentioning of vacuum infusion hull in the press release. So, seems to be the exception but yet to be confirmed if it will have the traditional and heavier hull.

Anyone knows if other boat builders are joining the club or running away?

 

[MrB]

It has been around for years.:ambivalence:

 

[burgundyben]

One day the frozen snot brigade will build a hull as light and tough as my 50 year old hot moulded timber hull.

 

[PowerYachtBlog]

Vacuum Infusion has been around since the eighties, and was invented by Scrimp.

Some US builders and Italian builders that I know of have been using Scrimp since the nineties.
The Scrimp system does not save you much in weight and resin (about 10% less max) but does deliver a better resin mix in all the hull and less error prone to the latest systems.
OTOH the latest system by DIAB can make you save about 40% in resin and reduce hull weight by 20-30%.

The problem with resin infusion remains resin starvation in some areas of the hull are easier to happen if one worker is in early morning party mode.
Resin starvation is no joke since it compromises hull structural integrity, equaling to hull de-lamination problems. That is a big concern IMO.

Both Princess and Fairline have jumped resin infusion method. Princess started by switching new models since 2010 and is using the DIAB system.
Fairline started with the 48 series models and now should go on with the new 75 Targa.

Sunseeker have been using infusion (DIAB) for topsides since about decade I think, and some minor parts. As far as I know they have not yet switched to hull infusion.

Azimut started switching to DIAB since 2008.
Pershing and Franchini (more a sail boat builder) have been using Scrimp since 1998/99.

 

[oldgit]

In the early 80′s Lotus Cars used a similar process for car body parts ?

 

[rafiki_]

In the early 80′s Lotus Cars used a similar process for car body parts ?

Lotus? Loads of trouble, usually serious!

 

[Hugin]

It has been around for years.:ambivalence:

I´m not saying it's a new invention, but it is new (at least to me) that the low end of the price range uses it too. GreenLine, Galeon and Beneteau all build boats on a tight budget.

 

[halcyon]

I´m not saying it's a new invention, but it is new (at least to me) that the low end of the price range uses it too. GreenLine, Galeon and Beneteau all build boats on a tight budget.

Seline introduced it 10/15 years ago, built a new plant at Hartlebury that was fully air-conditioned, did not help though, they went bust.

Brian

 

[Hugin]

Seline introduced it 10/15 years ago, built a new plant at Hartlebury that was fully air-conditioned, did not help though, they went bust.

Brian

Sealine was not exactly known for cheap boats the last years as independent builder. Maybe a modernized and affordable S28 with vacuum infusion hull would have served the market and the company better.
How do you get the 1st time new boat buyers if the cheapest boat in the line-up is 300K? I know Princess and Fairline went down the same route.... abandoned smaller boats completely - I would not be surprised if this strategy one day will be regretted by at least one of the 3 big (adding Sunseeker to the group)

 

[[2068]]

Maybe a modernized and affordable S28 with vacuum infusion hull would have served the market and the company better.

That was the S29, but for whatever reasons, it wasn't a massive seller, nor money spinner. The SC35 sold better.

 

[Momac]

S29s seems quite rare. Can't say I have seen one in the flesh. I have seen a few SC29's around. They are very nice boats.
We have skipped that size and just traded in our S23 for a F33. (After being determined to get a S34 and saying we didn't want a flybridge !).

So is our F33 Vacuum infused?


.

 

[oldgit]

How do you get the 1st time new boat buyers if the cheapest boat in the line-up is 300K? I know Princess and Fairline went down the same route.... abandoned smaller boats completely -

A much trodden path on these forums.
Simply not a big enough market to benefit from economies of scale?
They can probably actually make a profit on the larger boats.
Chum was on a Fairline cruise round the Balerics a month ago, a fair proportion of the 15 odd boats taking part were brand spanking new Fairline Targas ,inc a couple of biggies.

Princess, Fairline and S/S have totally gone for the bigger end of a traditional market...and managed to survive,via various holding companies who thought it worthwhile to keep them afloat.
Sealine did stick with a range of boat sizes and also innovative designs,but when it came to finding a little funding,no one could see a business case to keep them going.
Personally think that folks are no longer interested to buy a small basic boat but demand all the bells and whistles adorning their larger bretheren and the resulting price tag. Suspect by the time you've ticked your leccy winch, war game nav system,Corinth tops and Lumishores your price on a 7M boat has just doubled.

 

[[2068]]

So is our F33 Vacuum infused?

Nope.

 

[Hugin]

They can probably actually make a profit on the larger boats.

I'm sure they can for the time being. It's not an acute problem as long as the path of natural upgrades are still intact, but in the long term all these below-35ft Princesses, Fairlines and Sunseekers now circulating on the used boat market will be withdrawn as they age and their appeal therefore diminish. These boat builders will IMHO not be able to sustain the upgrade path without the smaller boats.

Then we will have a market where people enter the motor boating world in a Benetau Antares outboard for 60K, upgrade midway to a Jeanneau NC11 and eventually end up investing part of their retirement funds in a Prestige 500. Or rather their contemporary successors, of course. Where are PrinFairSeekers in this picture? I don't think people who have been driving a string of better and better Skoda-VW-Audi cars over their life are suddenly jumping into a Jaguar.... not even if they could afford to.

A bit of a topic drift though.

 

[jfm]

I'm sure they can for the time being. It's not an acute problem as long as the path of natural upgrades are still intact, but in the long term all these below-35ft Princesses, Fairlines and Sunseekers now circulating on the used boat market will be withdrawn as they age and their appeal therefore diminish. These boat builders will IMHO not be able to sustain the upgrade path without the smaller boats.

Then we will have a market where people enter the motor boating world in a Benetau Antares outboard for 60K, upgrade midway to a Jeanneau NC11 and eventually end up investing part of their retirement funds in a Prestige 500. Or rather their contemporary successors, of course. Where are PrinFairSeekers in this picture? I don't think people who have been driving a string of better and better Skoda-VW-Audi cars over their life are suddenly jumping into a Jaguar.... not even if they could afford to.

A bit of a topic drift though.

I think you make quite a lot of assumptions there about brand loyalty and the need for the start small-upgrade-buy bigger cycle. Loads of buyers of these 50-60 foot boats that you think are too big for entry level boat are sold to first time buyers. My first boat was a 42 footer; EME's on this forum was a new F Targa 50, TCM's was a new Targa 48, and so on. If I'd had more children and not had time for the 42 I'd still have bought my next boat, 58, and it would have been my first boat, so I didn't buy 58 because I had bought 42 before it. I think lots of people are like that and might be on an upgrade cycle through several boats but the later boats aren't bought because the earlier ones were. When FairPrinSeek analyse their customers they have loads who work in their 30s then have a budget of £0.5mill to several £mill in their mid 40s or whenever. Many other strong brands (off top of my head, Ferretti's 8 or so brands, Mangusta, Leopard, Canados, Oyster, Gunfleet and 100 others) operate in the smaller end of the market, and indeed neither do Bentley, Ferrari or Lamborghini, or Breitling, or whatever. It's actually Jenneau/Beneteau who are out on that limb and of course most of the buyers I'm referring to who enter at 50 feet will buy quality not low price so Jeanneau group won't float their boat anyway. Bit thread drifty as you say though!

 

[gjgm]

Personally think that folks are no longer interested to buy a small basic boat but demand all the bells and whistles adorning their larger bretheren and the resulting price tag. Suspect by the time you've ticked your leccy winch, war game nav system,Corinth tops and Lumishores your price on a 7M boat has just doubled.

Having just been through many marinas in northern Brittany, I can assure you that the French still love their "cheapo" fishing boats (preferably by a French builder of course!). I suspect there is a reasonable amount of brand loyalty, but that maybe because your present builder makes a larger version of all the things that you like about your current boat, assuming you ended up with a boat you like! I don't think that loyalty is in any way absolute (no pun) if only because your cruising grounds, crew numbers,maybe physical needs change. Still, I do think most people "like" some brands more than others, and peoples' fortunes rise and fall.