Insurance without a survey

ghostlymoron said:
I've been with JGW who usually accept an owners condition report. I would thoroughly recommend them as I've made a couple of claims and they've paid up. You never find out if your insurer is any good till you make a claim!
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I insure with GJW and can thoroughly recommend them, having had a claim sorted very fairly.
They do ask for a survey however and when I suggested that my boatyard could give an assurance they declined. They said that they needed a survey from someone with qualifications and Professional Indemnity cover. Presumably if a claim is found to be caused by a defect in the boat they could go after the surveyor. [in my case Dom Buckley, recommend him]
If you "self certify" I suppose they have a case to claim that you said the boat is in good condition so any defects are not covered.
 
This was a PS on the e-mail from Craftinsure:-

PS One of the reasons that insurers usually insist on a qualified surveyor (usually YDSA or RINA) as opposed to a boatyard is that they will have Professional Indemnity insurance and so if they miss something important they will be insured against the potential consequences. Whilst trying to be helpful, boatyards can leave themselves quite exposed if they provide condition reports.
 
FWIW, I self surveyed my first boat. I am not a qualified surveyor, but had an old survey & a lot of commonsense to work with. The old survey gave me a structure & style to mimic plus I was able to check out previous "caveats" to see if they had been sorted, deteriorated or not changed.

I suppose it would be a risk if there was a major failure, but there wasn't. I did after a couple of years have a slavage claim after she came off her mooring in a nasty NW/ly wind over tide gale on an exposed mooring. Claim paid in full & company (& me) delighted she was salvaged & not a loss.
 
Nasty, beware !

I know someone who insured without a survey, he's a practical, engineer type.

As soon as he put the boat on a drying mooring one of the twin keels pushed up into the hull and sank her.

It turned out to be a bodged repair by the previous owner which he hadn't spotted.

Last I heard the insurers were refusing to pay up, 'pre-existing condition'.
 
SpottyDog5 said:
A survey could also give some piece of mind, after all its not only value of the boat at stake here, but loved ones too...
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Absolutely.
And a Third Party Claim (if caused by a failure on your boat) could prove disasterously expensive if your own insurers fail to cough-up.
As has been reported at least once recently, on this forum.
 
charles_reed said:
I think the OP amongst others is confused about why the insurers ask for a survey on first accepting a risk.
It's to confirm the value of the boat they're insuring first and foremost.
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This also applies at later renewals, not just on initial policy. We've been with Towergate for 10 years but this is the first survey they've demanded, at 25 years old.

I expected our surveyor to haggle over insured value which is higher than some boats of the same model are now selling for. He pointed out that the insured value wasn't just what other boats are selling for, it's what it would cost to replace my boat with one of the same age, in the same condition and level of equipment. I gave him an inventory split into two - what had been replaced under routine maintenance/breakage and, what had been added since purchase to increase the value. Current insured value was accepted by him (hopefully to be confirmed by insurers), despite the drop in market prices.
 
GrahamM376 said:
This also applies at later renewals, not just on initial policy. We've been with Towergate for 10 years but this is the first survey they've demanded, at 25 years old.

I expected our surveyor to haggle over insured value which is higher than some boats of the same model are now selling for. He pointed out that the insured value wasn't just what other boats are selling for, it's what it would cost to replace my boat with one of the same age, in the same condition and level of equipment. I gave him an inventory split into two - what had been replaced under routine maintenance/breakage and, what had been added since purchase to increase the value. Current insured value was accepted by him (hopefully to be confirmed by insurers), despite the drop in market prices.
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I'd look at changing insurers at your next renewal. I was with Towergate until recently. Had to make a claim back in the summer. It took them about 6 months to settle the claim, and what they paid was significantly less than what it cost to sort out. Having originally agreed values, when it came to a claim, they suddenly changed their minds and told me the values were less than what was originally agreed.
 
timmeo said:
I'd look at changing insurers at your next renewal. I was with Towergate until recently. Had to make a claim back in the summer. It took them about 6 months to settle the claim, and what they paid was significantly less than what it cost to sort out. Having originally agreed values, when it came to a claim, they suddenly changed their minds and told me the values were less than what was originally agreed.
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Sorry to hear that but, my experience was totally different.

Originally, I was going to go after the uninsured guy who hit us and it was Towergate who advised not to bother and to put a claim in against our insurance.

I also quoted for repairs, undercutting the other 2 quotes and got the job repairing my own boat, around 3,000 euro with yard costs. Towergate paid out in full with no quibble and the legal assistance reimbursed uninsured losses such as excess, legal fees etc. No loss of NCB as we were on home mooring.
 
I used to think that surveys were a waste of money. Much like a consultancy - paying someone to tell you something you already knew. However, having just had a surveyor find a major structural fault in a six year old production boat, I've changed my mind: saved me a heap of expense and heart ache. I didn't hesitate to ask him to survey my latest pride and joy and consider it money well spent. (In case anyone is looking for a surveyor, I would certainly recommend Rob Bingham. Extremely competent and a nice bloke to boot.)

Turned out that GJW didn't want to see the survey report: 1994 is too young. They are also not worried about the age of the standing rigging. Mind you, they wouldn't pay out if the mast fell down due to a rigging failure. Also charged a very reasonable premium.
 
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