In the market for Centaur or Griffon. What are the benefits over a Bilge v Fin Keel

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thesaintlyone

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Oki really want more space/headroom than my Jouster affords and quite frankly more single handing ability which means Roller Furling Jib, Tiller controller of some description and inboard engine etc that I'm not prepared to invest into the Jouster
By the time I sell my car and the Jouster I should have around £5000 and I am looking at around 26ft.

Two boats I have seen currently on the market are a Fin Keeled Griffon and a Bilge Keel Centaur so questions are.

What are the practical benefits of Bilge over Fin Keel and considering most of my sailing is around the medway estuary how many places can I land a bilge keel for a picnic/bbq/overnighter explore during low tide.
Speed doesn't bother me at all.

One of the trips I would like to do in the future after gaining some more experience is cross the channel and take the canal system down to the med I know biscay is the normal way but have a desire to explore the many places along that way are either of these boats suitable for that undertaking.
(what is the general route for this???)

What in practical terms is the space benefits over the Griffon v Centaur????
 
The fin keeler will grip better, point better and probably handle a little better in a marina (if there's a bit of wind). It won't park on sand banks or beaches very well though :)

For French canals your draft is obviously a potential issue. But against that you have to consider that bilge keels can limit how close you can get to the side of some rivers and canals, depending on how sharply the banks slope.

Given what you've said, i suspect a bilge keel would suit you.
 
Was thinking more the Danube via Rotterdam to the Black Sea but that is for the future planning. What is the practice for parking on a beach low tide area. there are a couple of interesting looking spots that become exposed at low tide and are flattish I'm talking on purpose not by accidental grounding I.e stopping overnight.
 
Are the Griffon/centaur okay for channel crossings given good passage planning and say coast hopping along the french coast??? or am I gonna be limited.
 
thesaintlyone said:
Are the Griffon/centaur okay for channel crossings given good passage planning and say coast hopping along the french coast??? or am I gonna be limited.
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The limits will be your ability, not the boat. Those boats have been roaming around our coasts and across the other side for 30 years or more.

The Griffon is the Centaur's replacement and roomier, faster and arguably better looking. However one for under £5k will be well and truly knackered. For a functioning boat you will get a good Centaur with a modern engine for around your top budget. Don't worry about keel type unless you are on a drying mooring. Condition is far more important - but of course all Centaurs are bilge (the fin keel Chieften version sold very few) and most Griffons are bilge. The early Griffons had severe keel problems and should be inspected carefully to make sure they have been beefed up properly.

Look at dylanwinter's posts and his KTL videos to see what is possible with a Centaur in that price bracket.
 
thesaintlyone said:
What is the practice for parking on a beach low tide area. there are a couple of interesting looking spots that become exposed at low tide and are flattish I'm talking on purpose not by accidental grounding I.e stopping overnight.
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Not sure you'd want to park on the beach overnight, you'd float again before you woke up.

Basic idea is to wait until a while after high water, so the tide has fallen a bit. Gently motor up the beach until you run aground. This is better than anchoring and waiting for the tide to go down because you don't swing around on the anchor as the tide falls. Best make sure the next tide will be high enough to float you off or you will be there for longer than a night :)
 
The only reason im looking at the Griffon realistically speaking is cause of the fin keeler on apolloduck but most are out of budget.
 
PaulRainbow said:
Not sure you'd want to park on the beach overnight, you'd float again before you woke up.

Basic idea is to wait until a while after high water, so the tide has fallen a bit. Gently motor up the beach until you run aground. This is better than anchoring and waiting for the tide to go down because you don't swing around on the anchor as the tide falls. Best make sure the next tide will be high enough to float you off or you will be there for longer than a night :)
Click to expand...

No problem with overnighting. Once you've run aground, you can then set the kedge out the back (use the dinghy, unless the tide goes out sufficiently far), and carry the main anchor up the beach, so you'll stay more or less put when the tide comes back. We've sat like that for a couple of days on the beach at Bembridge. When you come to leave, carry the main anchor back and stow, and use the kedge to pull you off the beach as you float.

Oh, forgot to mention, hope that the boat settles reasonably level, and doesn't end up with one keel in a hole........
 
Check out ebay for Centaurs, often around 5k or less, try and get a mk2 - the rear mast shrouds are forward of the window, the mk1's have the stay over the window which can cause problems. Even look at a few before - especially before bidding, in fact this is essential. Often boats are on ebay which don't even get a bid ... and then get relisted. Make sure the engine is good or newish, spares are often difficult for the older Volvo Pentas.
 
I got caught out at Fionport, it had blown easterly all week and I anchored OK. The boat dried out but the minute the tide came in far enough for the boat to float the wind blew us beam on ashore. I had to go in the dingy and get the anchor and set it as a kedge to pull us off. It only took 5 mins to do but it was a pain. Of course the minute we got off the wind went back to the east!

 
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We make most of the bilge keels by visiting lots of drying harbours around the Solent but don't over look the ability to access shallow water that most yachts with fin keels can't.
 
aquaplane said:
I got caught out at Fionport, it had blown easterly all week and I anchored OK. The boat dried out but the minute the tide came in far enough for the boat to float the wind blew us beam on ashore. I had to go in the dingy and get the anchor and set it as a kedge to pull us off. It only took 5 mins to do but it was a pain. Of course the minute we got off the wind went back to the east!

Click to expand...

Nice looking Centaur Aquaplane - is she for sale?
 
PaulRainbow said:
Not sure you'd want to park on the beach overnight, you'd float again before you woke up.

Basic idea is to wait until a while after high water, so the tide has fallen a bit. Gently motor up the beach until you run aground. This is better than anchoring and waiting for the tide to go down because you don't swing around on the anchor as the tide falls.
Click to expand...

Simple answer to both of those is to lay out the kedge well astern as you approach the beach. Then carry the main anchor well up it. You're then secured between the two anchors and can go up and down as many times as you want. When it's time to leave, a bit of tension on the kedge warp will pull you off as soon as the boat floats.

Our previous boat anchored as described:

IMG_2494_zpsmfidlasg.jpg


(If you like, you can slack off the warp at low water to avoid decapitating passing children :) )

Pete
 
Fantastic places you can only stay in a bilgekeeler.

Herm harbour in the Channel Islands

Can't think of anywhere in or close to the Medway...
 
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