Identifying a 23m

M

MichaelSR

New Member
Joined
3 Oct 2008
Messages
7
Location
Berkshire, UK
Visit site
I have a painting of a 23m from, I think, some time just before
WWII (Title: Racing with the cutters (23m class): Putting a headsail in stops (4)). I was wondering if there was any way of identifying her or if it the kind of thing you might have in your records? I was really wondering if she still existed.

I am aware that the following still exist but have no idea if there is enough information to enable identification:

ASTRA
CANDIDA
CAMBRIA
LULWORTH

& of the J-Class...
ENDEAVOUR I
SHAMROCK V
VELSHEDA

Cutters_small.jpg


There is a high resolution copy currently at:
http://www.steinbeck-reeves.uk.com/Cutters_internet.tif

Many thanks,

Michael
 
Sorted out now I think - really sorry.

In explanation, I have a .htaccess file which prevents unknown sites linking to pictures on my site (rather than web pages) as they are effectively stealing my bandwidth. So to get around that I had to allow actively allow ybw.com to link to my site. I had forgotten all about the restriction before my first post.

Michael
 
Thanks Maxi77 - that was my problem too. I am not sure where to start. I was actually wondering if someone had some photographs that might give it away. Maybe even know that/when the photograph was taken.
 
She looks a bit small to be a 23m. She's also a gaffer, which rules out Astra, Candida and Cambria and the J class. She ain't Lulworth cause she ain't got bulwarks. Personally I'd say she looks more like a 19m. Rather like Mariquita. A class which I believe has two survivors.

As there are only gaffers in the pic though that dates it to 1930 at the very, very latest. And going by the fact that the gaffer in the distance has a topsail spar above his topmast that would place it in the early 20's at the latest as it was about then that they were switching to taller, inline topmasts (marconi masts) which negated the need for a spar on the luff of the topsail.

Identification would be easy with either a hull colour or a sail number, alas without them it's pretty much impossible with that level of detail.
 
Woodlouse - thanks for the information. By far the most informative I have had from anyone!

It rather looks as though this is a lost cause unfortunately. However, as to the size of the boats, the title of the picture is "Racing with the cutters (23m class): Putting a headsail in stops (4)" - written on the back by the artist. I can only presume that he knew what he was sitting on board. Artist was born in 1858 and died in 1954 so the potential date range is enormous and your dates fall right in the middle of it. I will have another look at the back when we reframe it (due soon) and see if there are any other clues I have missed.

It would actually be rather nice to get my hands on 1, 2 and 3 (and maybe 5 etc.) if they still exist but I think that is a bit of a long shot.

Anyway, many thanks.

Michael.
 
The potential date range is a fair bit smaller than the lifespan of the Artist. The big class as seen in the painting only really came into existence with the building of Britannia and Valkyrie II in 1893, and in 1930 the J Class took over completely. So there you have a 40 year bracket. There was no racing during the First World War, and afterwards it wasn't until 1920 before it took off again. So there you have a 20 year gap between 1893 and 1913, and a ten year gap between 1920 and 1930. Bear in mind the rigs are not the late Marconi type then that gives you only approximately 25 possible years. Almost a quarter of the artists lifespan.

As for my point about it looking a bit small to be a 23 metre, I only say that from having sailed on Lulworth. Going by the scale of the crew the side decks look too narrow and the boom looks too low to be a boat of quite that size. I can only suggest that although the painting is titled "Racing with the cutters (23m class)" it doesn't necessarily mean that the artist needs to be on one to race with them.

As for getting your mitts on the other paintings, if you have the name of the artist then I'd say you have a chance. Even if he wasn't that well known there must still be records or a collection somewhere.
 
Fascinating bit of history - I must admit that I had not appreciated the changes to rig etc. I see what you mean re the size of the boat. It may, of course contain a large dose of artistic license.

The artist is Charles Murray Padday - reasonably well known. But most of his pictures that I have come across in auction records are quite unlike the one I have. He was a prolific illustrator and some of his picture are pretty outlandish and not at all of the same quality. It may of course be that they don't exist any more or are on somebody's wall, as was mine.

I will do some more research.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Share this page

Top