I knew this job was not going to be simple

G

gary3029

Well-Known Member
Joined
22 Jul 2005
Messages
251
Location
Poole Dorset
Visit site
Having discussed on the forum about replacing my keel box or not, I went with the majority and decided to replace the keel box. Old one out...had to basically destroy it to get it out. What do I find below it...6 keel bolt holes (3 per side) Removed the wooden plugs and it was not a pretty site. Three of the bolt head are past there sell by date so the shafts must have shot it. Got one of the yard guys to look and he advised I pull all six bolts with a view of replacing them which seems like sound advice. He has advised for me to replace them with silicon bronze bolts which will be VERY expensive. Very quickly this relatively simple job for me is turning into a labour intensive, expensive job. What other metal would be suitable as keel bolts in iroko/iron? Any tips on replacing old keel bolts?
 
[ QUOTE ]
Having discussed on the forum about replacing my keel box or not, I went with the majority and decided to replace the keel box. Old one out...had to basically destroy it to get it out. What do I find below it...6 keel bolt holes (3 per side) Removed the wooden plugs and it was not a pretty site. Three of the bolt head are past there sell by date so the shafts must have shot it. Got one of the yard guys to look and he advised I pull all six bolts with a view of replacing them which seems like sound advice. He has advised for me to replace them with silicon bronze bolts which will be VERY expensive. Very quickly this relatively simple job for me is turning into a labour intensive, expensive job. What other metal would be suitable as keel bolts in iroko/iron? Any tips on replacing old keel bolts?

[/ QUOTE ]

Have a look at this, also look at keel bolt replacement.

http://achilles24.users.btopenworld.com/keelbolts.htm

What he has to say, has been proven by umpteen years in service, for these boats, my advice would be pay heed and do likewise. /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif
 
[ QUOTE ]
What other metal would be suitable as keel bolts in iroko/iron?

[/ QUOTE ]Monel 400 - used extensively offshore for bolting on subsea installations.
--------------------
hammer.thumb.gif
"Artificial intelligence is no match for natural stupidity"
sailroom <span style="color:red">The place to auction your previously loved boatie bits</span>
 
Silicone Bronze - expensive? Yes, but not all that much more than A3 stainless, surely. Suggest you look a bit further than the swindlerys. If you are ever up at the Hamble try Foulkes Chandlery barge for example.

Not trying to worry you, but if these six are shot - and this is probably why your keelbox has failed in the first place - but are there any more that need attention further along the keel?

Si Bronze is the best material to use if you dont want to do have to do this again in the longer term.
 
I did exactly the same as Force 10 advises in the Achilles 24 link but my boat designer (David Feltham) told me to use high tensile steel.

Unless there is a serious design fault, in my opinion it is best to use the same materials as originally fitted. Take a bolt along to a local engineering firm to confirm what it is made of and buy the same again. The parts should be cheap especially if it is studding. In that case you can buy a length and cut it yourself. Leave enough extra thread showing to allow an additional nut on top to jam on the one below to allow removal at a future date.

Although my nuts were badly corroded, the studding below the nuts was in pristine condition so you may be pleasantly surprised. Replace then one at a time so there is no keel movement as you do it. I wouldn't take them all out at the same time.

I don't know the Finesse well but check there are no more bolts fore and aft of the six you have found as these (if any) will also need replacing.
 
I've found Anglia Stainless to be the cheapest by far for Silicon Bronze, as well as being extremely helpful. No problem with small orders either.
 
Its an iron keel,no? Not sure I would use anything other than iron for the new bolts.Have you contacted the builder and owners association for a suitable source.
The trick with getting them out is to drill/chisel the nuts off if badly corroded,and then use a very large 16/32lb sledgehammer and a steel drift of the same or very slightly smaller diammeter to the bolt-hold the drift vertically in a wooden support exactly over each head and then..one good whack is far better than 2 light ones...
Cheer up,you will be very competent at boat repairs and will know 100% that the boat is sound where-its-important once you have done this job and any subsequent surveyor will like it too!
 
[ QUOTE ]
Its an iron keel,no? Not sure I would use anything other than iron for the new bolts.Have you contacted the builder and owners association for a suitable source.
The trick with getting them out is to drill/chisel the nuts off if badly corroded,and then use a very large 16/32lb sledgehammer and a steel drift of the same or very slightly smaller diammeter to the bolt-hold the drift vertically in a wooden support exactly over each head and then..one good whack is far better than 2 light ones...
Cheer up,you will be very competent at boat repairs and will know 100% that the boat is sound where-its-important once you have done this job and any subsequent surveyor will like it too!

[/ QUOTE ]

I'm with with you on that one, except to say that I don't believe that Iron Bolts would be man enough for the job? (not sure that you really meant Iron?) That's why I gave him the link about mild steel ones. If you haven't had a look at the link, have a squint, very interesting to see how good the mild steel bolts were after they had been cleaned up, in comparison to the new studding.

Stainless steel is ok, but in my opinion, only if you can keep the water away from it, when used in conjunction with a dissimilar metal?

I may be wrong in my thinking, but I would really only be comfortable with silicon bronze hanging onto a lead keel?

Here is what I would do in if I was in the situation that the original poster finds himself in................

As has been already stated, deal with one bolt at a time, when I had got the old bolt out, I would make a thread cleaner out of a suitable length of studding. This is simply a piece of studding with slots hacksawed in x 3 equidistant around it's diameter. I would then run this down the threads in the keel, (dry, no lubricant) I would then run down with some good water proof grease. I would then make up a new keel bolt smear it in same good waterproof grease and fix it in position. It is very unlikely that the threads in the keel are beyond redemption, but if they are, simply drill 'em out and use a suitable tap, to fit new size studding / bolts.
 
I am not sure about yellow metal and ferrous metals together in this way. I have always understood that one should use galvanised mild steel to fasten an iron keel and yellow metal of some sort such as silicone bronze or gunmetal/monel etc for fixing a lead keel.

I dont have a copy of the galvanic table but I think silicone bronze and steel are at opposide ends to one another?

I would do a little more research before you committ yourself.

If silicone bronze is OK in this application then all you need to do is by plain rod and nuts. Then any small machine shop or mate with a lathe or a set of thread dies can cut the thread.

The last time I needed silicone bronze I used a company called Combwich Marine who used to advertise regularly in Classic Boat and PBO

As always, if you think I can help further please PM me.

Mike
 
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
It is very unlikely that the threads in the keel are beyond redemption, but if they are, simply drill 'em out and use a suitable tap, to fit new size studding / bolts.

[/ QUOTE ]

Is it possible then that the keel has been threaded for the bolts?? If this is the usual practice how do you hammer a bolt out?
 
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
It is very unlikely that the threads in the keel are beyond redemption, but if they are, simply drill 'em out and use a suitable tap, to fit new size studding / bolts.

[/ QUOTE ]

Is it possible then that the keel has been threaded for the bolts?? If this is the usual practice how do you hammer a bolt out?

[/ QUOTE ]

Hammer a bolt out? Not sure what you are asking me? Try again? /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif
 
Does the keel bolt thread into the keel or does it pass through with no thread in the keel. If it is threaded then be a nightmare if impossible to remove
 
Never seen or heard of threading the bolts into the ballast stub, for the very good reasons you mention. But theres a first time for everything!

Traditionally wrought iron was regarded as the best for keel bolts in wood, but virtually impossible to get hold of now, I am told.
 
[ QUOTE ]
Does the keel bolt thread into the keel or does it pass through with no thread in the keel. If it is threaded then be a nightmare if impossible to remove

[/ QUOTE ]

I think I may have got a bit confused? I was assuming that you were refering to the bolts that are holding the iron ballast keel to the boat??? Doesn't the drop / swing keel sit inside an Iron/Steel ballast keel on your boat? I assumed that the bolts which hold this keel onto the boat, were the bolts to which you were refering, and if they are, the iron / steel keel will almost certainly be tapped / threaded to accept them.

If I have it all bassackwards, I apologise, obviously got confused somewhere along the line? /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif /forums/images/graemlins/confused.gif
 
I've just had silicon bronze bolts made by colin frake in Faversham. Just bought the rod from a metal stockists and then gave him the dimensions. worked out cheaper than buying them off the shelf. I hopefully won't have to worry about them for 30yrs or more. Mild steel ones, even gavanised, will be a worry in 10 yrs and even iff you don't still own the boat, will detract from any sale value. I removed mild steel ones from my keel, that had been hot tar dipped and were in remarkably good shape. If you are going to put back mild steel try this. heat up the keel bolts until red hot and then plunge them into pitch. good luck, my keel gave me hours of headache!!
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Share this page

Top