Hybrid anchor rode

zoidberg

zoidberg

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I intend to ship one, or perhaps two, FX-16 Fortress anchors and an S80/15kg Spade anchor. There's 30m. of 6.6mm Grade 80 chain, plus another 2 lengths of 10m. of the same, which is rated at 4.5 tons min break strength - with links and shackles to match.

Of course, I want to provide 3 x 60m. rope rode to complement the anchors/chain parts of the system. I don't expect this rope to match the chain for break load, but what ought I aim for?
The 27' boat displaces about 3.5 tons.
 
You have not mentioned which sort of rope you are going to use, how you are going to use the anchors, what the vessel draws, windlass? etc etc.

If you might anchor in locations where abrasion of the rope option of the rode might be a concern you could consider Dyneema, the downside being it floats and has no elasticity. You could then use the thinnest that you can handle (assuming, as above, no windlass). You might then want a snubber. With 30m of chain you will only deploy the 60m of, say, Dyneema under extreme circumstances and floating roe will be the least of your worries. Normally you might only deploy 10/20m and the chain will 'sink' the dyneema

With 30m of chain, to which you could add 10m or 2 x 10m of the same chain and if you draw a metre (so a multihull) or lifting keel then you don't need any textile at all. Your problem might be finding devices to join the chains to each other without compromising strength ( G100 x 6mm hammerlocks come to mind). I appreciate the 10m lengths are to allow you to deploy more than 1 anchor - but multiple anchors would not normally be common place.

This raises the next question - if you use 12mm or 14mm 'rope' how are you going to join it to the chain, again hammerlocks come to mind, or Omega links. Attaching 14mm to 6.6mm chain links might be a big ask.

The hammerlocks and Omega links will not normally be galvanised but will be painted or powder coated. They will eventually rust and look unsightly - so buy spares - they are not expensive and when grotty - throw them out, or grit blast and paint. If you have a friendly galvaniser have them galvanise (the hammerlocks or Omega links) and accept you will degrade strength by about 30% (so go for G100, or G120 components). The connectors have some very small components - you might need to galvanise them in a little wire basket, make one up from chicken wire or a finer mesh (2 flour/sugar sieves wired together) - been there, done this. I suspect the Omega links might not fit, the jaw might be too small - try before you buy.

I note you have mentioned shackles and connectors - have you tried them? Do they fit the chain

There are a number of options defined by:

Can you handle the size of rope comfortably, or even uncomfortably.

Can you attach the rope sensibly to the 6.6mm link.

10mm nylon seems the best compromise, but 8mm Dyneema might work - I think 14mm might be too big to attach.

Jonathan
 
I would be looking at elastic climbing rope, either 10 or 12mm, depending on whether you are using a warping drum (or gypsy) or heaving in by hand. I cannot imagine heaving in anything thinner by hand. Climbing rope of the elastic type would provide all the snubbing that you would ever want, without having to rig anything else. They can be supplied complete with eyes for connection to your chain. I would never use a floating line for anchoring, for obvious reasons.
 
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I have 5m of 6mm chain and 20m of 12mm 3 strand nylon on an FX7. Smaller boat and the rode is way over spec’d. I use a 1/2te bow shackle on the rope end of the chain and cow hitch the spliced eye of the rope onto the shackle. The anchor is connected via a caribiner. Far from conventional, but it does mean the anchor warp doubles as a long mooring line. 12mm is the smallest rope I would find comfortable hauling on. I deploy and recover from the cockpit.
 
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NormanS said:
I would be looking at elastic climbing rope, either 10 or 12mm, depending on whether you are using a warping drum (or gypsy) or heaving in by hand. I cannot imagine heaving in anything thinner by hand. Climbing rope of the elastic type would provide all the snubbing that you would ever want, without having to rig anything else. They can be supplied complete with eyes for connection to your chain. I would never use a floating line for anchoring, for obvious reasons.
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Elastic climbing rope would function as a spring, certainly not as a snubber. On reaching the end of the stretch the vessel would surge forward again and you'd bound around the anchorage as the wind caught the bow becoming a menace to others near you and threatening the set of your anchor. There's very good reasons why Chandlers sell dedicated anchoring material and not climbing rope.
 
Steamkettle said:
Elastic climbing rope would function as a spring, certainly not as a snubber. On reaching the end of the stretch the vessel would surge forward again and you'd bound around the anchorage as the wind caught the bow becoming a menace to others near you and threatening the set of your anchor. There's very good reasons why Chandlers sell dedicated anchoring material and not climbing rope.
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Perhaps you are confused by my terminology. I used the descriptive word "elastic" to differentiate the type of climbing rope. There are two basic types, one stretchy and one not. The stretchy (elastic) type will behave in the same way as stretchy nylon, as used by many for snubbing purposes.
Any anchoring system benefits from some elasticity, whether by the catenary of the chain, or by an elastic snubber. It doesn't normally lead to boats 'bounding around the anchorage'.
 
I can support NormanS comment. I used one of my old climbing ropes as a snubber, and it no more promoted boinging around than did the odd rubber device many of us attach to snubbing ropes or on anchor chain

All boats moved around mooring or anchorages in gusty condition. I wouldnt use climbing rope as anchor rode as slight stretch would increase wear in the underwater part in muddy water, and even 11mm is rather slight for any boat over 1 ton - but thats a different matter
 
An advantage of climbing rope is that it has a braided cover specifically designed to protect the inner core from abrasion. A disadvantage of climbing rope is that it is commonly only available in sizes 8mm upto about 12mm. You can source a kernmantle design with a braided outer cover of larger sizes, its used by the military (there maybe other uses), but you might need to buy a rather longer length than you actually need. I had some 14mm made for a large cat bridle.

This idea of nylon causing yachts to bounce about at anchor is proved to be a phurphy - it does not happen. When you straighten your catenary so that the rode 'looks' straight and the strong gust lessens you do not 'bounce' about an anchorage - why would you do so with nylon. There is as much, in fact identical, stored energy, in a straightened catenary as in a stretched length of nylon - same gust, same yacht etc. People have been using 3 strand nylon and retired climbing ropes as a snubber for over 40 years, Starzinger on the yacht Hawk for one, if there was a lot of bouncing about - it would be well documented and we would not have the popularity of use of climbing rope as a snubber. The big downside to catenary is that as the catenary straightens its ability to continue to accept energy reduces (to zero), nylon will continue to stretch until it fails. The other downside is - chain is heavy.

A reason chandlers do not sell climbing rope - its expensive. Its significantly cheaper to use your wits and find a source of retired climbing ropes - which are available for free or at worst some beer (from a climbing/rock climbing club members). Better to re-purpose retired climbing rope as a snubber or the textile portion of a mixed rode than send it to landfill fill where is will reside for 100's of years.

Another downside to climbing rope is that its difficult to knot, neatly. Any sailmaker will sew you an eye. You can sew one yourself, by hand, if you are patient. Climbing rope is also almost impossible to splice. I believe there are YouTube vids of splicing - I'm lazy and sew, or have sewn.

Jonathan
 
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B27 said:
30 years ago, fewer yachts had windlasses, more people raced.
A few metres of chain and a lot of nylon rope was entirely normal.
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Obviously we don’t have a windlass. We have been known to use the aft winch to recover the anchor if it’s breezy. Our anchor is launched from the front starboard beam, possibly to enable this.
 
B27 said:
30 years ago, fewer yachts had windlasses, more people raced.
A few metres of chain and a lot of nylon rope was entirely normal.
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I learned a fair bit by reading ( aka studying ) the writings of wily successful racers such as Adlard Coles. One trick of his I put to very good use was that of 'deep water kedging'. For this purpose he shipped a reel of piano wire and, in a light airs RORC race, this permitted him to kedge stationary while others around him were working their socks off, but sailing backwards thwarted by the strong foul tide.

I didn't have piano wire, but I did have a reel of a special 5mm cordage used for pulling fibre-optic cable through ducts - which was both lighter and far stronger than Coles' wire. We used this on a Farrier FX-9 to kedge just east of the Shambles Bank while multis twice our size appeared ahead through the murk, then slid astern, to disappear behind in the strengthening flood tidestream. We did much the same a dozen miles south of Start Point.... just a couple of the sneaky but legal tricks we used to win our class and series in the 2003 Fastnet.
 
zoidberg said:
I learned a fair bit by reading ( aka studying ) the writings of wily successful racers such as Adlard Coles. One trick of his I put to very good use was that of 'deep water kedging'. For this purpose he shipped a reel of piano wire and, in a light airs RORC race, this permitted him to kedge stationary while others around him were working their socks off, but sailing backwards thwarted by the strong foul tide.

I didn't have piano wire, but I did have a reel of a special 5mm cordage used for pulling fibre-optic cable through ducts - which was both lighter and far stronger than Coles' wire. We used this on a Farrier FX-9 to kedge just east of the Shambles Bank while multis twice our size appeared ahead through the murk, then slid astern, to disappear behind in the strengthening flood tidestream. We did much the same a dozen miles south of Start Point.... just a couple of the sneaky but legal tricks we used to win our class and series in the 2003 Fastnet.
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We do similar offshore racing these days using Dyneema - it's easy to deploy and enough to kedge in 30-40m in flat calm and an adverse tide weighs very little and is easy to stow
 
I would consider 12mm 3-strand nylon to be strong enough myself, as well as being super-simple to splice. Bristol Rope and Twine will sell you a 220m coil for an extremely modest price, which would give you your 3 x 60m plus a spare 40m which might come in handy one day.
 
zoidberg said:
:ROFLMAO:

I have a 32' x 19' x 9' polytunnel loaded to the gun'nels with 'spare 40m/60m/150m. etc. etc. which might come in handy one day.'

But thanks.....

:LOL:
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I have a substantial ex-RN boathook in my shed that was given to my great grandfather when he did someone a favour sometime around 1917. It's been handed down from father to son since then, in the confident expectation that it will come in handy one day.
 
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