How to connect Sterling to Generator B+

[Boh999]

Hi!

I am mounting the Sterling to my Volvo Penta 2003B year 1993 engine.

Great Sterling manual:
https://cdn.shopify.com/s/files/1/06...B12130.pdf?477

Alternator B+ goes to house bank +. I will move it to Sterling Alternator IN according to manual.

Generator scheme:
https://www.startmotor.se/prodimg/5a/87/0000000026b6875a.jpg


Problem is, there is another cable from B+ on the Alternator to another electrical gadget on the engine:
https://drive.google.com/file/d/0Byb...VVWFZoVEk/view

Arrow points to the gadget.


The Volvo Penta 2003B manual:
http://www.ballad.no/InstruksojnsbokVP2002.pdf

Page 17 has an image, but it's not exactly like my engine. The connection scheme at page 20, I got model "B". Volvo's electrical schemes requires you to be Professor of Electrical Systems or something, unfortunately...

From that gadget goes a cable to house bank +.

To my understanding the Alternator B+ is connected to house bank + with two cables, one of them via the gadget. With alternators though, things can be strange and counter-intuitive?

Should I connect the cable from the gadget to the Alternator IN, or should it, against common sense, go the the house bank +? (Thereby shortcircuiting the Sterling?).

Thanks,

 

[VicS]

Two of your links don't work
I cannot see a Sterling manual .............. what Sterling device are you fitting ? An advanced alternator regulator or an Alternator to battery charger

The link to the picture of "the gadget" does not work;

The wiring diagram in the Volvo Penta manual is straightforward enough,

Is your "gadget" perhaps a VSR or a diode splitter .... I assume you have separate engine start and house batteries?

 

[Boh999]

Hi!

The Sterling Alternator to Battery charger.
https://cdn.shopify.com/s/files/1/06...B12130.pdf?477

I will source it with the alternator and an old Invac 30 A shore charger. I only have a large house bank, used for everything.

I have studied engine schemas:
https://www.google.se/url?sa=t&sour...d2jjRKHGuSBBBCXjw&sig2=RhXJIn1vuIYycTmlDfGe6A

It may be the starting/cranking motor that is being fed from B+.

Hard to tell as I got three cylinders on the starboard side of the engine. The topmost and largest is the heat exchanger for cooling the engine, not involved here.
The second below is where the cable goes in,
Additionally, there is a other cylinder below that one, more aft, slightly larger. This could be the cranking engine. Then I am clueless regarding the middle cylinder. Relay?

At page 14 in this engine manual - please have a look at the upper right engine labeled "2003/MS2B-R". I think it's mine, but with freshwater cooling retrofitted. Hence I got the big cylinder as in the engine labeled "2003T/MS2B-R".

Cheers

 

[BabaYaga]

Sounds to me as the 'gadget' is most likely the starter motor solenoid. I think you should remove the cable between this and the alternator B+. Check that the cable between alternator B+ and battery bank (to be rerouted to the AtoB charger) is thick enough.
As the AtoB charger is also a charge splitter, I would consider introducing a separate starter battery to the system.

 

[VicS]

Hi!

The Sterling Alternator to Battery charger.
https://cdn.shopify.com/s/files/1/06...B12130.pdf?477

I will source it with the alternator and an old Invac 30 A shore charger. I only have a large house bank, used for everything.

I have studied engine schemas:
https://www.google.se/url?sa=t&sour...d2jjRKHGuSBBBCXjw&sig2=RhXJIn1vuIYycTmlDfGe6A

It may be the starting/cranking motor that is being fed from B+.

Hard to tell as I got three cylinders on the starboard side of the engine. The topmost and largest is the heat exchanger for cooling the engine, not involved here.
The second below is where the cable goes in,
Additionally, there is a other cylinder below that one, more aft, slightly larger. This could be the cranking engine. Then I am clueless regarding the middle cylinder. Relay?

At page 14 in this engine manual - please have a look at the upper right engine labeled "2003/MS2B-R". I think it's mine, but with freshwater cooling retrofitted. Hence I got the big cylinder as in the engine labeled "2003T/MS2B-R".

Cheers

The link to the Sterling manual still does not work but if its is aa alternator to battery charger then I think it is this:
http://sterling-power.com/collectio...cts/alternator-to-battery-chargers-up-to-130a
and the link to the manual is:
https://cdn.shopify.com/s/files/1/0658/7343/files/AB12130.pdf?477

The engine pictures show in one case the alternator , on the right, and the starter motor with the solenoid mounted on it. All the wires go to the solenoid.
In the picture of the 2003T there is also the heat exchanger which partly obscures the starter motor . The solenoid is still clearly visible below the heat exchanger.

The A to B charger should be very simple to install.

• Disconnect and remove the wire between the alternator (B+) and the solenoid.
• Connect a wire from B+ to the terminal marked "Alternator input" on the A to B
• Connect another wire from Domestic battery output terminal of the A to B to the solenoid.
• Extend the short negative wire and connect it to the alternator B- terminal or to the battery negative connection on the engine.

The manual advises on the cable size to use for all the above.

 

[pvb]

• Disconnect and remove the wire between the alternator (B+) and the solenoid.
• Connect a wire from B+ to the terminal marked "Alternator input" on the A to B
• Connect another wire from Domestic battery output terminal of the A to B to the solenoid.
• Extend the short negative wire and connect it to the alternator B- terminal or to the battery negative connection on the engine.

Additionally, if it's found that the alternator isn't charging, an "ignition feed" wire will have to be added - details in the Sterling instructions.

 

[Boh999]

Hi!

I think I understand. Was a bit frigthened of these gadgets that I did not understand. From experience, best approach then is to replace cable by cable and never change anything.

So no need to worry I suppose, all power to the solenoid. I am putting a 35 mm2 cable between B+ and A to B Alternator IN.

I have a second battery bank, didn't want to introduce that complexity at this time. It is a windlass battery at the bow of the boat. I will connect that to the A to B starter output. Engine is cranked by the house bank.

If the worst happens, I can move the windlass battery aft and start use starting cables.

I'll go down to the boat, take better images, and try to comprehend what you've told me, looking at the current setup.

I beefed up the minus. Added another 35 mm2 cable of tinned copper, instead of replacing the original regular copper (I remade it a bit, made sure no copper is visible), to the house bank minus. I have put fat BlueSea BusBars at the house bank and remade the parallell coupling to be diagonally across the four GELs, using 35 mm2 tinned copper. It is rubber coated, not PVC.

Cheers

 

[Boh999]

Sounds to me as the 'gadget' is most likely the starter motor solenoid. I think you should remove the cable between this and the alternator B+. Check that the cable between alternator B+ and battery bank (to be rerouted to the AtoB charger) is thick enough.
As the AtoB charger is also a charge splitter, I would consider introducing a separate starter battery to the system.

The link to the Sterling manual still does not work but if its is aa alternator to battery charger then I think it is this:
http://sterling-power.com/collectio...cts/alternator-to-battery-chargers-up-to-130a
and the link to the manual is:
https://cdn.shopify.com/s/files/1/0658/7343/files/AB12130.pdf?477

The engine pictures show in one case the alternator , on the right, and the starter motor with the solenoid mounted on it. All the wires go to the solenoid.
In the picture of the 2003T there is also the heat exchanger which partly obscures the starter motor . The solenoid is still clearly visible below the heat exchanger.

The A to B charger should be very simple to install.

• Disconnect and remove the wire between the alternator (B+) and the solenoid.
• Connect a wire from B+ to the terminal marked "Alternator input" on the A to B
• Connect another wire from Domestic battery output terminal of the A to B to the solenoid.
• Extend the short negative wire and connect it to the alternator B- terminal or to the battery negative connection on the engine.

The manual advises on the cable size to use for all the above.

Additionally, if it's found that the alternator isn't charging, an "ignition feed" wire will have to be added - details in the Sterling instructions.

I tried to post/reply using Android tablet but when clicking the text field it deletes a post. Strange. Trying with Windows now.

Thank you all för your help. Better images:
https://drive.google.com/file/d/0Byb-0zc-Apk8bk1CZk1QVzBwbTA/view?usp=sharing
https://drive.google.com/file/d/0Byb-0zc-Apk8eFZrUXFhT3Q0U1k/view?usp=sharing
https://drive.google.com/file/d/0Byb-0zc-Apk8eXNrdWdfNldudTg/view?usp=sharing

As seen in the images, I am re-wiring, e.g. removed cable between Generator B+ and Solenoid. Solenoid fed from battery PLUS.

Cheers

 

[pvb]

Thank you all för your help. Better images:
https://drive.google.com/file/d/0Byb-0zc-Apk8bk1CZk1QVzBwbTA/view?usp=sharing
https://drive.google.com/file/d/0Byb-0zc-Apk8eFZrUXFhT3Q0U1k/view?usp=sharing
https://drive.google.com/file/d/0Byb-0zc-Apk8eXNrdWdfNldudTg/view?usp=sharing

As seen in the images, I am re-wiring, e.g. removed cable between Generator B+ and Solenoid. Solenoid fed from battery PLUS.

In your photo B, the lower cylinder (with the yellow label) is an earthing relay. The purpose of this is to isolate the engine from the battery negative except when starting. This was introduced as a safeguard against electrolytic corrosion. Your alternator should have an isolated return - in other words there should be a negative lead connected to it, going to the battery negative.

 

[Boh999]

In your photo B, the lower cylinder (with the yellow label) is an earthing relay. The purpose of this is to isolate the engine from the battery negative except when starting. This was introduced as a safeguard against electrolytic corrosion. Your alternator should have an isolated return - in other words there should be a negative lead connected to it, going to the battery negative.

Thanks! I heard that the 2003B is double-isolated, whereas the 2003 is not. This is good news I suppose? Meaning: leaving shore charger on in a marine is no problem? No need for zincsavers and galvanic isolators, as long as I am replacing the sacrificial anodes regularly?

To be crystal-clear, are we talking about this unit:
https://drive.google.com/file/d/0Byb-0zc-Apk8VGVHQ2ZuaC1OdXc/view?usp=sharing
?

The minus on the solenoid goes to battery MINUS. The B- on the Alternator did not, but I have retrofitted a wire between it and the battery MINUS. There was only a wire between B- on the Alternator and battery MINUS. I have kept this wire.

I did not change any setup from previous owner, except removing the PLUS wire between Alternator B+ and the Starter motor. And fitting Alternator B+ to Sterling A to B IN.

The engine was fully functional before.

 

[VicS]

Additionally, if it's found that the alternator isn't charging, an "ignition feed" wire will have to be added - details in the Sterling instructions.

I'd forgotten about that !

In your photo B, the lower cylinder (with the yellow label) is an earthing relay. The purpose of this is to isolate the engine from the battery negative except when starting. This was introduced as a safeguard against electrolytic corrosion. Your alternator should have an isolated return - in other words there should be a negative lead connected to it, going to the battery negative.

Thats right.

It is shown on the wiring diagram on page 19 of the manual linked to in post #1 http://www.ballad.no/InstruksojnsbokVP2002.pdf

The implication as far as installing the Sterling A to B charger is that the negative wire must be connected to B- on the alternator ( probably the best idea) or to the battery negative wire at this relay.

I think you will find that the alternator D- terminal is connected to the battery negative wire at the stud on this relay

Thanks! I heard that the 2003B is double-isolated, whereas the 2003 is not. This is good news I suppose? Meaning: leaving shore charger on in a marine is no problem? No need for zincsavers and galvanic isolators, as long as I am replacing the sacrificial anodes regularly?

To be crystal-clear, are we talking about this unit:
https://drive.google.com/file/d/0Byb-0zc-Apk8VGVHQ2ZuaC1OdXc/view?usp=sharing
?

The minus on the solenoid goes to battery MINUS. The B- on the Alternator did not, but I have retrofitted a wire between it and the battery MINUS. There was only a wire between B- on the Alternator and battery MINUS. I have kept this wire.

I did not change any setup from previous owner, except removing the PLUS wire between Alternator B+ and the Starter motor. And fitting Alternator B+ to Sterling A to B IN.

The engine was fully functional before.

You post appeared while I was typing the above.

Yes the thing you have marked is the earthing relay.

You may still need to fit a galvanic isolator if you leave the boat plugged into the shorepower supply because the shorepower earth may be connected to the anodes, although not to DC negative.

 

[Boh999]

Earthing relay? Not the solenoid? Ok if I put a wire between it and battery minus BusBar?

There is a minus wire from B- to the minus BusBar as well.

I rarely use shorepower, or should I say, will rarely. Fitting 400 W solar panels on an arch.

Cheers

 

[VicS]

Earthing relay? Not the solenoid? Ok if I put a wire between it and battery minus BusBar?

There is a minus wire from B- to the minus BusBar as well.

I rarely use shorepower, or should I say, will rarely. Fitting 400 W solar panels on an arch.

Cheers

Remove the wire between Alternator B+ and the solenoid

Connect B+ to the AB "IN"

Connect the AB "output to house battery" terminal to the solenoid terminal from which you just removed the alternator connection. The main battery positive connection should already be on there.

Connect the AB unit negative to alternator B-, or the battery negative connection on the earthing relay , or the battery negative busbar.

See the AB installation instructions for recommended wire size.

 

[Boh999]

Remove the wire between Alternator B+ and the solenoid

Done.

Connect B+ to the AB "IN"

Done.

Connect the AB "output to house battery" terminal to the solenoid terminal from which you just removed the alternator connection.

I might be confusing the Solenoid with the Earth Relay. Is the Solenoid a part of the start engine? Is it the unit inside the blue rectangle:
https://drive.google.com/file/d/0Byb-0zc-Apk8VGVHQ2ZuaC1OdXc/view?usp=sharing
?

Is the Earth Relay the unit inside the Red rectangle?

The main battery positive connection should already be on there.

If You mean the unit inside the Blue rectangle, yes it is so. How beefed up to go? It is currently a 16 mm2 original cable, I am considering keeping it and adding a 35 mm2, or will 16 or 25 mm2 suffice, please? I mean, it would get most its power from the batteries, right? I guess the Alternator is helping out once the engine starts revolving, which is why there was a cable between this point and the Alternator B+, right? And why You suggest connecting AB "output to house battery" to it, right?

Number 7 in image, encircled by blue line:
https://drive.google.com/file/d/0Byb-0zc-Apk8UUNPSXYtajdfWm8/view?usp=sharing

Why put the wire from the AB "output to house battery" terminal on the Solenoid rather than on the battery plus BusBar, please?

Connect the AB unit negative to alternator B-, or the battery negative connection on the earthing relay , or the battery negative busbar.

Much easier and shorter distance to the battery negative BusBar so will do so.

See the AB installation instructions for recommended wire size.

I am adhering as far as I know.

Finally, regarding the Earth Relay, I can put its minus wire to wherever I want on the minus side, right? All minus is interconnected in the boat, I think.

Thanks for the advice!

 

[VicS]

The solenoid is in the blue rectangle and the earthing relay is in the red rectangle.

The AB to battery connection can go to the battery positive busbar if that is shorter and more convenient.

The engine wiring diagram shows 10 mm² wire for the alternator positive output

I would use 15mm² or 20mm² wire for the AB unit positive connections if they are short. 25 or 30mm² if they are longer than about 1.5 m

I would use 8mm² to extend the negative connection

The other wiring can stay the same

 

[Boh999]

Many thanks, VicS and others!

How am I to know, in advance, if I need the ignition cable or not? Or is it by trial and error only, please?

Cheers

 

[pvb]

How am I to know, in advance, if I need the ignition cable or not? Or is it by trial and error only, please?

Check the Sterling instruction manual - it tells you to measure the voltage at the charger's input terminal.

 

[VicS]

Many thanks, VicS and others!

How am I to know, in advance, if I need the ignition cable or not? Or is it by trial and error only, please?

Cheers

Try it.

If the charge warning light illuminates when you switch the ignition on it will probably be OK without the connection.

 

[Boh999]

Ok, I'd like to be able to tell without starting the engine. Boat is on the hard.

 

[pvb]

That is why the manual does not simply tell you to measure the volts at the input terminal but rather suggests a trial and error method. In fact I dont think you ever will see 12 volts at the input terminal beacuse its blocked by diodes in the unit,

The Sterling manual is fairly clear about where to measure the voltage if the unit doesn't work! And as the input terminal is outside the charger, it's unlikely to be affected by any diodes in the unit.