How old is your lifejacket?

How old is your lifejacket?

  • Less than five years old

    Votes: 41 32.5%

  • Between five and ten years old

    Votes: 38 30.2%

  • Between ten and fifteen years old

    Votes: 34 27.0%

  • Between fifteen and twenty years old

    Votes: 8 6.3%

  • More than 20 years old

    Votes: 5 4.0%
  • Total voters
    126
Babylon said:
For what its worth, my personal and very comfortable Crewsaver is about 10 years old, but failed to hold its pressure for more than a few minutes when I decided to replace the whole Hanmer auto inflate a month ago!
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Are you sure the new Hammar unit was properly reseated in its hole? It's quite common to get it slightly misaligned, resulting in a leak at about the rate you describe. Would be unfortunate if you binned a good jacket if that was the cause; if so, taking the inflator out and putting it back in correctly would have sealed it.

This also shows the importance of doing the inflation test after changing any parts (as you did), not before!

Pete
 
Foolish Muse said:
The life jacket I use while sailing (and I don't use it often because as a singlehander I am always tied to my boat with a harness and teather) is the same life jacket that I used while whitewater kayaking 20 years ago. A couple of weeks ago, when I was working as race committee, I put it on for the first time in 5 years and I didn't give the slightest thought to whether it will keep me alive if I fall off the boat. It has gotten me through many hundreds of kayak rolls in white water and has taken me safely through many floats through foaming rapids. It doesn't have any cylinders that need servicing. It just works, today as well as it did the day it was new. It cost 1/5th the amount of an inflatable lifejacket and it is half the weight. I really really can't see the appeal of an inflatable PFD.
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I am with you on the tethers.......

But lets just say the tether does not do its job and you have been knocked unconscious.

How do you guarantee you dont end up being towed along face down in the water in your PFD or " Bouyancy aid"?

A risk you may accept?
 
prv said:
Are you sure the new Hammar unit was properly reseated in its hole? It's quite common to get it slightly misaligned, resulting in a leak at about the rate you describe. Would be unfortunate if you binned a good jacket if that was the cause; if so, taking the inflator out and putting it back in correctly would have sealed it.

This also shows the importance of doing the inflation test after changing any parts (as you did), not before!

Pete
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Good point, but the leak occurred when I fired the original factory-fitted Hammar, for which I'd bought the expensive new replacement! In previous years I'd done the 24 hour test by manual inflation, with no leaks.

I think I'll do a full check and repair (then re-check) this winter before condemning my old bladder.
 
TSB240 said:
But lets just say the tether does not do its job and you have been knocked unconscious.
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I tend to assume that someone who enters the water unconscious, and remains so, is highly likely to drown anyway. Even in a correctly-fitting and correctly-operating lifejacket, your mouth is very close to the water and even the smallest waves will be washing down an unprotected throat. If you were initially conscious, fitted a sprayhood, and later passed out, then you might have a better chance.

Pete
 
We bought five automatic Crewsaver life jackets in 1987. They served us well for 20 years or so. Eventually the gas bottles rusted, or they failed to retain air when inflated. We still have two which were serviced and pronounced fit for use by Crewsaver a couple of years ago. We bought new ones then, and the Crewsavers are for visitors.
 
ChrisRayner said:
We bought five automatic Crewsaver life jackets in 1987. They served us well for 20 years or so. Eventually the gas bottles rusted, or they failed to retain air when inflated. We still have two which were serviced and pronounced fit for use by Crewsaver a couple of years ago. We bought new ones then, and the Crewsavers are for visitors.
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Surely you give the new ones to guests and wear the 20 odd year old ones yourself ?
 
With regards to using only a tether when singlehanded rather than a life jacket: in my book I interviewed a Mini skipper who fell overboard and his jacket inflated as he was dragged by hiis tether. He was basically unable to move at all so used his knife to puncture the air bags. Even after that he still had extreme difficulty climbing back under the lifelines. It was because of this interview that I now recommend Spectra rather than wire lifelines. The spectra could be cut if necessary. You can read this interview in the published version of the singlehanded tips book.

I sail with only a tether virtually 100% of the time, even on days with light winds. There is no reason why I wouldn't rely on it fully, even more than a life jacket.

With regards to my old style, non-inflating life jacket (or buoyancy aid as you call it). What I find is that some people add the worst possible accident upon accident upon accident in their wildest dreams. Sure it is possible that I could fall over AND I could hit my head AND I could be knocked unconscious AND a jellyfish could sting me AND a shark could eat me. BUT, in more than 1,000 trips out, many in rough water and with minimal sleep, I have not fallen overboard even once. So if we assume the odds of falling over are very small, then we can assume the odds of hitting my head are even smaller and the odds of bein knocked unconscious smaller still. (I get hit by my boom at least a few times a year and it hasn't knocked me out yet). I want to protect myself against the major causes of death, not every possible cause. I'd guess that the odds of hitting my head in the shower are greater than hitting my head falling off my boat. In fact I have hit my head falling in the shower.

The reason that I favour a standard non-inflating buoyancy aid is exactly because of its simplicity. I know that it will work - every time. I don't have to maintain it or check the fittings or even look at it at all. I can pull it from my cabinet tomorrow or 5 years from now and I just know it will work. And even better, if I happen to fall overboard today, I can stick it below and put it on again tomorrow with no thought to re charging it.

I used my jacket for years while whitewater kayaking and I can have the greatest confidence that if it can save me from boiling rapids, it can save me from anything the ocean can throw at me.

One last point, two days ago Derek Hatfield, a singlehander with two circumnavigation including a pitchpole at Cape Horn, died at home at age 63. We're all gonna die some time. You can take reasonable precautions to protect yourself or you can spend your time worrying about every possible threat. I'd rather go sailing.
 
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I've just bought a new (to me) Moody 44 and not seen it since pre purchase inspection. There are a few LJ's on board that will be looked at very critically. I have 2 of the new style Crewsaver ones to go on board that never even made it to the old boat so brand new. My trusty Baltic which must be about 15 years old but serviced every year with cylinder, firing bits and light replaced according to date. Will probably carry on using this one myself. I will probably retire my trusty Seago from about 1990 which has also been serviced every year although rarely worn now. Then we have virtually new Crewsaver infant and child jackets. All jackets with light, hood, crotch straps.
 
Foolish Muse said:
I used my jacket for years while whitewater kayaking and I can have the greatest confidence that if it can save me from boiling rapids, it can save me from anything the ocean can throw at me.
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I understand where you are coming from, and I agree with many of your points (and as I said earlier I prefer a buoyancy aid in some situations, where the ability to swim is likely to outweigh other factors), but I disagree a buoyancy aid will do the same job as a lifejacket on an 'ocean' (i.e. the open sea). A lifejacket has hugely greater buoyancy than a buoyancy aid. You would not be able to roll your kayak with an inflated lifejacket on, as you would not be able to get your torso underwater. A buoyancy aid for white water kayaking has a significantly different job to do.

A lifejacket will help you survive in the water for many hours (if the cold doesnt get you first) by keeping you afloat much higher in the water than a buoyancy aid, and most can be, or are, fitted with a hood to keep the spray out of your airways, crutch straps to stop it riding up/you falling down through it (all real dangers in a sea situation), and a light to attract help and/or ward off craft endagering you. Most will also have an integral harness by which you can be lifted from the water, and which you can use to clip on with to try to avoid ending up in the water in the first place (as you recommend).

One used to be able to buy non-inflatable lifejackets, but they were very bulky. I do still have an old lifejacket which has foam buoyancy to buoyancy aid standards, and a supplementary air bladder, inflated by mouth, to bring the buoyancy up to lifejacket standards, but very much doubt they remain available.

I agree with you the desirability of clipping on with lines which are too short to allow you to fall in the water, but despite giving it a great deal of thought, can think of no way to arrange this on a small boat such as ours: there is too little width, and too many obstructions
in too short a length for it too be practicable.
 
Been reading this thread with interest
I am hoping to go to the Southampton BS 2016 if we get back to the the U.K. in time from The Canaries?
Our LJ's need replacing with over 15,000 Nm and at least 10 years use. I have been trying to look at the reviews in the Yachting Mags., but problems with the internet thinking, I am Spanish, means I keep on being thrown back to Amazon Spain!!
Because we are Blue Waters Cruising I would like the full kit. Spray Hoods, Crotch straps, Lights and attachment for PLB
I have seen a download for £6.95 from PBO dated May 2015, is it any good?
Any other recommendations or web links?
 
IanScrim said:
I have seen a download for £6.95 from PBO dated May 2015, is it any good?
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Some blurb about modern lifejackets in general, which will probably be mostly covered by this thread as it grows, and then 150 words each on an assortment of 17 jackets.

IanScrim said:
Any other recommendations or web links?
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If you're after a basic type then they're all much of a muchness, but once you get into the more advanced models they do differ in fit, so I wouldn't buy a jacket without trying on several. A few years ago I went to Force 4 intending to definitely buy a Spinlock Deckvest, but then when I actually tried it on I didn't find it comfortable at all. I came away with a Kru Sport Pro which I'm very happy with - even more so after having tried it in the pool on a Sea Survival course last week. Other people's preference will be the other way round, or for something else entirely.

Pete
 
For some years I carried around a Mullion manual lifejacket, usually in my crew-bag, Earlier this year, and more by luck than good judgement, I was wearing it when I - in a rowing dinghy - was rammed by a cruiser and turned base over apex. The dinghy landed, inverted, on top of me. My legs were entangled in lifting strops. The 10-year old Mullion lifejacket saved my life. No question....
 
prv said:
I came away with a Kru Sport Pro which I'm very happy with - even more so after having tried it in the pool on a Sea Survival course last week. Other people's preference will be the other way round, or for something else entirely.

Pete
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I recently brought a Kru Pro, very happy with it too. Came with crotch straps and spray hood.
 
Depends what you mean by life Jackets. Are they actually type approved as life jackets by someone other than the manufacturer? Like eg the MCA. or the EU

I have 2 approved as PFD inflatables. (Mustang) I bought them 2 years ago for built in harness.
Which is intended purpose. Harness. Mustang does make fully USCG and CGC type approved SOLAS Life Jackets. At over 400 bucks apiece. I will stick with ordinary LJ.
I have more than enough US CG approved lifejackets. of undetermined age. which came with the boat. I binned a couple which had gotten damp and I suspect were a bit dodgy.
I have 4 older non inflatable adult PFD plus 3 or 4 Kids sise PFD.
I just bought 4 more nice new adult PFD.
I have 2 floater coats again type approved as PFD. not inflatable.
My favourite is my old Henri Lloyd Ocean Jacket with built in Harness Not approved by anyone but me I like it and it still keeps me warm and dry. Who knows I might even float.
The harness no doubt does not meet current fall protection standards but I just need to be sufficiently restrained to not fall off.

If guests are not happy with a PFD they have 2 other choices. BYOLJ or other boat.
 
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Uricanejack said:
Depends what you mean by life Jackets. Are they actually type approved as life jackets by someone other than the manufacturer? Like eg the MCA. or the EU
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Yes - they will all be approved to EN396 (or EN399 for the oversized 275 Newton types).

The whole "non-approved lifejacket" issue is a purely American thing, caused by their Coastguard until recently only allowing old-fashioned foam bricks to count towards their legal carriage requirements. So you had crappy legal lifejackets which nobody wore, and good lifejackets which weren't legal. I know many boats carried both.

No such nonsense here.

Pete
 
Until about 1980 my favourite lifejacket/buoyancy aid was ex-govt canvas/rubber Mae Wests, very comfortable, could wear just slightly inflated so not in the way, and if (when with dinghies/cats) you went swimming you could give the mouthpiece a couple of blows to top it up. It eventually got difficult to buy these, and had to switch to foam buoyancy aids.

I sailed cruising boats for years without any LJs at all (or guardwires on some boats) but these days have two types, basic manual gas inflation harness ones and top-spec, auto/sprayhood etc. If I do put one on it's to use the harness fitting and the lighter basic ones are much more comfortable so I tend to use them. In good weather/daylight I don't wear any LJ.

Our boat gets chartered and I test all LJs every year: typically two or three of the 8 supplied for charter get binned each year through very slight loss of pressure over 24 hours. And if you make a check mid-season it's a surprise if at least one has not had the gas bottle fired and repacked with an empty bottle. Who does that ........?
 
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