How important is using the correct terminolgy.

glashen

glashen

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I've always taken the view that the important thing is to be understood, I can understand that language can exclude the uninformed, it can also include by making us feel we are part of some special group with our own special words. I do dislike it when nautical language is used to convey some sort of spurious superiority because someone has used the wrong word. It can of course be useful for clarity assuming everyone in the conversation does know what the terms mean.

Best story I heard about nautical language, was a skipper not good at remembering the right term for each sheet / rope / halyard getting heated and shouting pull the f****** rope in, no not that f****** rope, that f****** rope!

Suppose the message got through in the end.
 
glashen said:
I've always taken the view that the important thing is to be understood, I can understand that language can exclude the uninformed, it can also include by making us feel we are part of some special group with our own special words. I do dislike it when nautical language is used to convey some sort of spurious superiority because someone has used the wrong word. It can of course be useful for clarity assuming everyone in the conversation does know what the terms mean.

Best story I heard about nautical language, was a skipper not good at remembering the right term for each sheet / rope / halyard getting heated and shouting pull the f****** rope in, no not that f****** rope, that f****** rope!

Suppose the message got through in the end.
Click to expand...


A well traveled forumite uses
Up F****r
& Down F****r

a rough translation is spi, uphaul & downhaul
 
I like to use the correct terminology. When sailing with beginners I am careful to explain, though, preferably in good time before starting to do things.

I'd consider it rude to correct other people's language.

Did once have quite a lot of confusion though when sorting out jobs for morning cleaning on Stavros. The guy was asked to clean the heads, but couldn't understand why this needed to be done daily or involved disinfectant and rubber gloves. Turned out he thought he was going to clean all the shower heads :)

Pete
 
glashen said:
Best story I heard about nautical language, was a skipper not good at remembering the right term for each sheet / rope / halyard getting heated and shouting pull the f****** rope in, no not that f****** rope, that f****** rope!
Click to expand...

All our sheets/halyards have a different and distinctive colour.
They're always referred to by their colour.
Works for us and IMO leaves no room for error.
 
A well traveled forumite uses
Up F****r & Down F****r
Click to expand...

Only with asymmetrical spinnakers and code zeros to differentiate them from up-haul and downhauls used with regular spinnakers on boats that carry both.

You can get pre-printed labels for your clutches with Up F****r and Down F****r on them, so it's almost official terminology.
 
Like most engineers I have allsorts of technical words I use and list some examples below:

Thingi, thingibob, whatsyacallit, dooberry and my all time favorite twaddle (as taught by a crusty Scots chemical engineer at ICI Mond on Teeside).
 
Important I reckon. Things can go wrong very quickly and even quicker when a panic ensues due to misunderstandings. "Ease that sheet out please", whilst pointing clearly at the sheet in question, usually results in quick learning and less screw ups during the whole experience. Novices then go home pleased that they understand things and will be more welcome on any boat in future. Screaming "that f***** rope" enlightens nobody!
 
I think it is quite important, and can save confusion. Taking it at its most basic, "Port" or "Starboard", are definite, whereas "Left" or "Right" depend on which way the person is facing.
 
I think this is likely to be another ensigns etiquette type thread. I guess the language you use depends on who you're talking to. Some people like using the nautical terms, some people insist on it and some people really don't care much either way.

I like using the "correct" nautical terms but I don't get all upset if someone else doesn't.
 
I agree that there is probably an irreconcilable difference between traditionalists and those that prefer to branch out on their own.

Many types of jargon, as in sailing, medicine and many others have evolved over many years or centuries to provide a nationally or internationally-recognised set of terms to avoid ambiguity. Outsiders tend to see these terms as somehow exclusive in motivation but this is never how it originated.

I like to use the "correct" terms, partly because they were the ones I was taught, partly because the difference between "main halyard" and mainsheet" is more concise than any other terms, and partly from a sentimental pleasure from using words and phrases which our sailing ancestors were using several centuries ago. Like many crews, we use joke-phrases often, such as "the blunt end", where I think the joke is mainly on ourselves.
 
Whilst I'm reasonably well acquainted with most nautical jargon I do tend to go with more infantile terminology. Sharp end and blunt end for example, except that I have a double ender, so it's sharp end and the other sharp end. Up f*ckers and down f*ckers aplenty and I often give the command "turning round!" when tacking.

It makes life more fun, and stops people taking themselves too seriously.
 
I use the colours, probably as there are 11 ropes that can be adjusted on the go, but that's a dinghy. Pull/let go/ease the blue one or pink and white one works. That is with beginners experienced crew don't need to be told much.
 
The big classics are fun. Every rope is beige.

On joining one boat once all the lines had been labeled with blue tape and felt tip. I gave the rest of the crew two weeks and then removed them. It was interesting to see which of the crew struggled after that. The first mate was still going round in circles after six weeks.
 
johnalison said:
I agree that there is probably an irreconcilable difference between traditionalists and those that prefer to branch out on their own.

Many types of jargon, as in sailing, medicine and many others have evolved over many years or centuries to provide a nationally or internationally-recognised set of terms to avoid ambiguity. Outsiders tend to see these terms as somehow exclusive in motivation but this is never how it originated.

I like to use the "correct" terms, partly because they were the ones I was taught, partly because the difference between "main halyard" and mainsheet" is more concise than any other terms, and partly from a sentimental pleasure from using words and phrases which our sailing ancestors were using several centuries ago. Like many crews, we use joke-phrases often, such as "the blunt end", where I think the joke is mainly on ourselves.
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Wot he said!

Oh and it's not unknown for the cry "For Gods sake, turn left" to be heard on Brigantia (Michael Green "The Art of Coarse Sailing" for those who don't know the reference)
 
Woodlouse said:
The big classics are fun. Every rope is beige.
Click to expand...

Yep :)

A while ago I counted in my head (actually I had to write down subtotals and add them up) the number of pieces of running rigging on Stavros. Can't remember the exact figure now, but it was somewhere around 200. All the same buff colour, no labels anywhere.

I used to enjoy taking a couple of people at a time and teaching them how to identify everything.

I still have to think quite hard to pick the right one of the four different staysail halyards on the foremast, but everything else is ok.

Pete
 
prv said:
Yep :)

A while ago I counted in my head (actually I had to write down subtotals and add them up) the number of pieces of running rigging on Stavros. Can't remember the exact figure now, but it was somewhere around 200. All the same buff colour, no labels anywhere.

I used to enjoy taking a couple of people at a time and teaching them how to identify everything.

I still have to think quite hard to pick the right one of the four different staysail halyards on the foremast, but everything else is ok.

Pete
Click to expand...
It's why keeping every rope on its own pin is important. Then it really does come down to calling things by their correct names.
 
I love nautical terminology, and its etymology.

However, if someone else uses different words, I can't get too excited about it (but, yes, 'port' and 'starboard' are much better than left and right).
 
I still have to think quite hard to pick the right one of the four different staysail halyards on the foremast, but everything else is ok.

Pete[/QUOTE]

Fat - Sailor - In - Ostend
 
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