How do you secure your liferaft??

Re: How do you secure your life raft??

Compared to you, I sure am.

I would not shiine in proper knowledgable company however.
 
Re: How do you secure your life raft??

[ QUOTE ]
Well,
I think that Robins arch would actually becom a safety feature for the helm if it did dismast, I dont think the mast would go through it, but it may deflect it a fair bit.
I also intend to have a similar arch.


[/ QUOTE ]

It most certainly is a safety feature! It isn't an add-on to the original pushpit but a special made of bigger diameter tubing and the two vertical poles that support the radar scanner and wind generator (Aerogen 6) are about 3" diameter. It was designed by a well known world girdling yacht designer, Mike Pocock. Standing at the wheel you are inside a very sturdy 'roll cage' and whilst a falling mast might dent it severely I would rather be stood under there than in the open, irrelevant as it is because we do have a sturdy mast and very adequate rigging and don't expect to be dismasted.

No I have never had to take to a liferaft, but I have two separate friends that DID have to, both because of fire on board, one was a mobo on race start boat duty and the other was motorsailing and both were engine associated fires.


Bedouin, I remember having coffee on your lovely boat and yes in your case I would hesitate to mount a 6 person raft on the pushpit but would have to accept a less easy to launch stowage of maybe a smaller raft.

Additionally, I do also wonder what a French or other 'jobsworth' might make of a boat with berths for 6 (actually ours was originally 10) but which is fitted with a raft only for 4. I now it is only Brit rules that apply but then explaining that to man with gun, little english and a big book of fine vouchers could be interesting.

If it looks like a motorsailer, quacks and puffs smoke like a motorsailer then it probably is a motorsailer, albeit closer to sail than motor! No amount of wishful thinking will make a heavily laden boat of this ilk do more than wallow in light airs without help from that chunky OM636.

LOL /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif
 
Re: How do you secure your life raft??

Are engine fires really that common? I'm surprised. I have never considered that a serious risk on a sailing boat (i.e. with a comparatively small inboard diesel)? It is not really something I have considered.

I'd love to see a breakdown of reasons for liferaft deployments.

In my case there is no real alternative to the lazarette, were I to mount it on my pushpit it would disappear over the side, along with the pushpit and guard lines, with the first decent wave on the stern. Having read accounts of knock downs I do wonder whether your boat would survive being rolled without any damage to all the gear on the pulpit/arch.

In theory I have a plan that should I ever get into a situation where there was a risk of collision with little notice (i.e. fog) I would transfer the lferaft to the cockpit, but I have not had to put that into practice yet.
 
Re: How do you secure your life raft??

I know of two cases caused by overheated exhaust hose and one where the main battery cable to starter chafed through and shorted out on the block.

The collision risk I refer to is more one of with an unseen submerged object rather than with another vessel, with a catastrophic inflow of water. At least collision with another vessel implies some kind of help might be near at hand, even from perhaps the other vessel.

I would doubt that any boat would suffer a rollover without some damage and that goes for what is on our gantry also! However we've managed to sail many thousands of miles and survive several bad gales without a knockdown by seas, just a wind generated one once in a line squall that caught us by shifting 90 degrees and going instantly from 10kts to 60kts of wind (in a Liz 30 with full sail including light No1 genoa which burst!. Likewise we have never had really serious waves over the stern although we did twice have such over the coachroof (again on the Liz) where many people chose to mount their rafts.

It is really all a case of double guessing and selecting the best perceived option to suit.
 
Re: How do you secure your life raft??

As with the liferaft thread a couple of weeks ago, it is instructive to go back to the MAIB reports where liferafts were deployed.

The only one that was "straightforward" was Wahkuna, the moody in collision with a container ship. In this case the boat did not sink immediately and the crew were able to launch and step into the raft - subsequently rescued by Condor ferry. The mast was lost in the collision so they were unable to trnsmit on VHF. Conditions were relatively benign. A similar incident (not in an MAIB report) is Megawat an Irish owned Hanse which lost its rudder, pulled a hole in the bottom and sank . Enough time to launch the raft, but it did not inflate. Rescued by a nearby boat using its RIB tender to collect crew.

All other records of launch have been in extreme conditions where the yacht was overewhelmed. In two cases it was launched because crew were already in the water and it was used as a means to try and recover. In one case Ocean Madam, 2 of the crew were rescued from the raft (the other already in the water died), but the boat remained afloat. In the other, the casualty died, but the boat was able to reach port under its own steam.

A Westerly Konsort foundered approcahing Plymouth in severe weather, hitting rocks. The lifeboat was standing by and an attempt was made to launch the raft, but it drifted away.

A Maxi yacht was severely battered in the Bay of Biscay, and, although it was still floating, the decision was taken to abandon ship to aid rescue (helicopters and other vessels), but difficulties were experienced because of size and weight, and inflating upside down.

Hooligan lost its keel and capsized off the Devon coast. Liferaft was on deck but lashed down. Hydrostatic release was not fitted because the boat often shipped water and it would have been activated accidentally. Crew member managed to cut the raft free from the upturned hull, inflate and after much difficulty all three surviving members of the crew boarded and were rescued - the fourth died and it was believed that he was knocked out in the capsize. Al survivors were experienced and well trained sailors.

I am including so much detail because the main debate is largely academic - firstly because the chances of needing a raft for most of us is so low, and secondly there is so little hard data on which to base a decision. I recognise that a world wide search will throw up other examples. However, from the incidents recounted above having a raft secured on deck or the transom with a quick release mechanism (and painter tied on!) seems to be sensible.

Further reading of fishing boat foundering incidents (much more common) would support this.
 
Re: How do you secure your life raft??

But you have also managed to sail the same number of miles and through the same number of storms without having to deploy your liferaft either /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif What has always frightened me is the stories of liferafts getting washed away during a "survival storm" - didn't that happen to Satori?

I have always assumed that in the case of collision with a submerged object I would still have at least a couple of minutes to abandon ship.

The overheating exhaust hose is a worry that I had not considered. Since on my boat the exhaust runs through the same compartment where the liferaft is stored, were it to cause a fire there it could destroy the liferaft before it was noticed.
 
Re: How do you secure your life raft??

[ QUOTE ]
But you have also managed to sail the same number of miles and through the same number of storms without having to deploy your liferaft either What has always frightened me is the stories of liferafts getting washed away during a "survival storm" - didn't that happen to Satori?


[/ QUOTE ]

And I have absolutely no intention of being at sea in a survival storm either!!!

With modern communications and forecasting unless crossing oceans and away from tradewind routes the ultimate survival storm should be an unlikely scenario for 99% of us. Non-forecast gales imply that they haven't had days to build up the associated seas and whilst they are nasty shouldn't be a reason to abandon a yacht for a plastic lilo. I made a vow after the 1979 Fastnet (I was at sea in my then Liz 30 at the start of that storm but missed the worst of it) NEVER to take to a liferaft unless I stepped up into it unless maybe the flames of a fire were getting too hot on my bum. There are too many recorded instances of boats remaining afloat after folks abandoned them in favour of a liferaft and followed by loss of life from the raft itself, in my book lifrafts are the very very last resort. I dutifully buy and have ours serviced by someone I really trust and then mount it and look after it as best I can, but I never ever want to see it inflated away from the service shop!
 
Re: How do you secure your life raft??

Well said Robin! You have a well found boat where the keel is unlikely to fall off and provided you keep out of the way of ships (much easier now with AIS and radar) you have got risk of having to take to a liferaft down to pretty much zero.
 
I used to use the safety pin from a hand grenade to hold my catch shut on the liferaft cradle!..................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................but I soon got fed up holding the grenade in my hand all the time.
 
Mine is stored down below! it doesnt get stolen. It doesnt get washed away. It doesnt get weather damaged. If we ever hit something and worry about sinking we will get it out. If I am flipped by a wave I will worry about getting in the life raft then, but I suspect I will have other issues to worry about too. I sail a cat with lots of bouyancy tanks so an upturned cat might be a better bet than a life raft
 
Re: How do you secure your life raft??

[ QUOTE ]
Well,
I think that Robins arch would actually becom a safety feature for the helm if it did dismast, I dont think the mast would go through it, but it may deflect it a fair bit.
I also intend to have a similar arch.

A dismasting is a peculiarly slow event.


Its a motor sailer, no doubt.

[/ QUOTE ]


Speaking strictly as someone who got dismasted, within 3 months of buying his first boat... ( Story of a Dismasting: S/V Sunny Spells )

I'm hoping I've had my dismasting, and count myself lucky that a life raft was totally unnecessary. However, the (45ft, double spreader) mast did fall on the pushpit. The pushpit suffered no worse than a dent (photos on the website) but actually supported the mast quite well. Not bad for 1inch stainless steel tubing!

The dismasting WAS a slow event, right up to the point that the spreader hit my skull...
 
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