How do you actually manage sleep on a 3-5 day passage with two crew?

[NatalieG]

My partner and I have done a fair amount of offshore sailing together including a couple of Atlantic crossings, and every passage we tweak the watch system. We've tried 3 on/3 off, 4 on/4 off, and various split watches — and honestly none of them felt like we'd cracked it.

What we found was that the first 48 hours were manageable but by day 3 we were both running on fumes. The science backs this up — we published a research paper recently looking at fatigue in offshore sailing (galvanicworks.com/research/ if you're interested) and the evidence is pretty clear that accumulated sleep debt is the real killer, not any single bad night.

Curious what systems people here use, especially couples or two-crew boats doing multi-day passages. Has anyone found a rotation that actually works past day 3?

 

[AngusMcDoon]

Four threes three fours. Four hour watches during the day and three hour ones during the night. That way each crew has shorter watches at night and also the watches alternate every day. It's between midnight and 6am that most people struggle and this way it's equally shared. After 6am and up to midnight most people are ok.

Breakfast and lunch is done by whoever is off watch between 0600 and 0900 and 1300 and 1700. Evening meal done by off-watch crew between 1700-2100. That way you get to do breakfast and lunch one day and evening meal the next.

0000-0300 A
0300-0600 B
0600-0900 A
0900-1300 B
1300-1700 A
1700-2100 B
2100-2400 A

0000-0300 B
0300-0600 A
0600-0900 B
0900-1300 A
1300-1700 B
1700-2100 A
2100-2400 B

As you've discovered no system is great, including this one. I've found that it's not the night hours that hurt, it's the not being able to get decent sleep when off watch on a noisy moving boat until you are absolutely exhausted on day 3.

 

[Minerva]

Well it sounds like we need an

“intelligent safety systems that adapt to your specific circumstances”

Why not cut to the chase and tell us what you’re selling?

 

[LittleSister]

In my limited relevant experience, I think there is a 'hump' after a few days - 3 or so - that you have get through, then it becomes somewhat easier as your body adjusts to the new time routines.

The first two or three days, I reckon, you are able to keep going on reserves, even though you are probably not sleeping fully when you can because your body thinks it's the wrong hour and likely also the excitement and uncertainties at the beginning of the trip. Day three or so you feel rough because you've depleted your reserves yet haven't fully adjusted to the new routine. After another couple of days or so, your body is better adjusted (and also knackered!), so you sleep instantly and more deeply in your new pattern, are more generally relaxed, and also likely the shipboard routine has been honed (including expectations lowered), and is somewhat less taxing.

I say 'body' above, but there's also a mental aspect to getting into a routine, too. (Similar in some ways to settling to a new job.)

Anyway, the above is just my experience/conjecture based on limited relevant experience.

I think three hours watches are too short, generally, and even six hours can be OK, even at night (see below), if conditions and weather are relatively benign. (Not sure whether I'd still cope well with that now I am getting old.)

Unlike Angus above, I think that changing the watches so you rotate through different times of day is undesirable in terms of your body getting used to sleep hours patterns. On an ocean passage (and others) we arranged the watches, at my suggestion, according to the inclinations of the crew. I am very much a night owl, and two partners I sailed with (separately) at different times were defintely not and would both always fade noticeably late in the evening, so we allocated watches with that in mind.

 

[geem]

Like you, we sail as a couple. We have done several Atlantic crossings and numerous other crossings of multiple days at sea.
We started of with 3 on 3 off but found it didn't work beyond one or two night duration. We find the first night at sea, neither of us sleep well until we get into the rhythm of a passage.
We then adopted 4 on 4 off. This was better but still not ideal. We then adopted 5 on 5 off from the advice of friends who had sailed around the world.
This is now our normal watch system for night-time. It ensures the off watch crew get good rest. Its hard initially for the on watch crew but after about 3 or 4 days, it becomes normal. On an Atlantic crossing in December, you have to deal with 13 hours of darkness. We would start the first 5 hour watch as it goes dark. The person taking the first night watch would sleep in the afternoon so they were ready for the night. The person doing the first night watch then does a second stint of darkness but get the sunrise.
We don't adopt a formal daytime watch system. The amount of sleep needed during the days varies depending on what kind of weather you are enduring. We also don't swap the watches around during the passage. Its better to get used to your slot and stick with it.

 

[dunedin]

I guess the answer also depends on whether have a “bullet proof” autopilot and/or self steering system.
Some still hand steer, which makes a completely different problem for watches.

 

[KevinV]

We crossed the Atlantic (west-east) with 4 on 4 off, no problem at all. The skipper was a morning person, I'm an owl, and both of us have the ability to just lie down and sleep which probably helped. Housekeeping, preparing drinks and cooking done by the off watch.We liked that the rota means you're doing the same thing each day - I make better porridge and bread, skipper was better at dinner. 20 days to the Azores, a week off, then 10 days to Southampton and we arrived well rested.

 

[pcatterall]

With 3 we relaxed things a bit in daylight but ensured there was always someone officially nominated as being on watch. A more fixed regime was observed in the dark hours.

 

[Rhylsailer99]

I struggle to sleep on a swinging mooring. God knows how I would sleep on a long passage.

 

[BobnLesley]

In my limited relevant experience, I think there is a 'hump' after a few days - 3 or so - that you have get through, then it becomes somewhat easier as your body adjusts to the new time routines.

Wot E Sed.
24 hours is no effort, 24-48 can be hard work; I actually attempted to time our departure windows to make night two rather than night one the most conducive for sleeping - as noted by others, night one's never good for sleeping anyway.
Unless you've managed a decent night's sleep on night two, 48-72 hours is a pain in the backside, but once you're over that hump, the enjoyment begins and after that, within reason, passage time becomes irrelevant, the days just roll into each other.
As for watch periods, Lesley and I targeted 3-hour stints when offshore, but cut those to two and a half, or even two (90 minutes in the Humboldt Current) if it was cold/wet/generally unpleasant or extended them to four+ in the tropics. We also tailored them to our sleep cycles/preferences: I invariably took the night's first watch (checking that the sun went down in the right direction) which began at around or 20 or 21:00 and ran until I was tired/fed-up/cold (anywhere from 2300-0100) after which Lesley would do a stint. My second watch always ended before sunrise, because Lesley likes watching sunrises, plus I get off to sleep more easily if my head's down before the sunrise. Day time was flexible, depending how each of us felt. Lesley would almost always have another sleep once she'd finished that early morning watch, while I generally enjoyed/preferred an afternoon kip... I don't need to be afloat/on passage to enjoy those.
The only times we significantly changed from that routine was when we that knew that bad weather was due. Lesley would then do all day and/or 3/4 of the night to allow me to sleep/rest in advance of its arrival; well rested and with Lesley providing a steady supply of strong coffee, cigarettes and peanut butter & red-jam tortilla wraps, I could go for 24 hours fairly comfortably, or 36/38 hours at a push.

 

[BobnLesley]

I struggle to sleep on a swinging mooring. God knows how I would sleep on a long passage.

It's just what you're used to; when we were living aboard full time, I always struggled to sleep for the first few nights when we came ashore.

 

[Poignard]

When I was a 2nd Engineer on coasters there were two of us on board, the Chief Engineer and I. We kept 5 hour watches.

If a big repair had to be done that needed both of us we would work until it was done.

It's tiring but you get used to it.


In one of his books, Alan Villiers describes the two watch system used on Finnish sailing ships:

0000-0400
0400-0800
0800-1300
1300-1900
1900-2400

 

[LittleSister]

I struggle to sleep on a swinging mooring. God knows how I would sleep on a long passage.

I doubt you'd have a problem. You'd be surprised how much exhaustion helps!

The challenge becomes staying awake when you're doing nothing but look-out. Your body soon acclimatises to the continual movement and noise.

 

[michael_w]

We always sail double handed. 3 on and 3 off works for SWMBO and I. Watchkeeping doesn't start till after supper and in the morning, provided nothing is happening, we'll leave the off-watch slumbering till a reasonable hour for breakfast.

This assumes a good pilot/windvane doing most of the work, so the on-watch crew is merely machine minding. Often at night I'll hand steer to pass the time as I can't read my book. If someone has to leave the cockpit at night, the off-watch crew gets woken up and is aware. Rather than coming to with the harness clip rattling along the deck.

So far, our longest passage has been 21 days.

 

[WoodyP]

I found the most difficult watches were when it was cold. Once you're chilled you don't get warm enough to sleep when you go off watch.

 

[Tamar]

I found the most difficult watches were when it was cold. Once you're chilled you don't get warm enough to sleep when you go off watch.

No heating below?

 

[michael_w]

When below and cold, if the heating is on. Don't wear too many clothes, as you'll be insulating your body from the heat source. Recommend an electric blanket with 'added features' if available for warming up. The added features being tits.

 

[WoodyP]

No heating below?

No. And when I crewed the skipper was too tight to turn it on apart from his cabin.

 

[Sea Change]

In one of his books, Alan Villiers describes the two watch system used on Finnish sailing ships:

0000-0400
0400-0800
0800-1300
1300-1900
1900-2400

We use the same or very similar, described as Eric Newby's Swedish Watch System in a book I have about Atlantic crossing.

I think my least favourite length of passage is 24hr. I just end up pulling an all nighter and I can pretty much write off the next day entirely. 48hr isn't much better.

By about day four things have settled in to a rhythm, and you're tired enough to sleep through anything. After that it doesn't make much difference.

Our first multi day passage was five days across Biscay. It was definitely a learning experience. Two adults and a five year old. Strong Easterly wind meaning no realistic bailout options- we went straight from Ireland to A Coruna. First couple of days were horrible, big fetch coming down the English Channel. It got a bit better once we were south of Brest and better again when we entered truly deep water.

We had nowhere near enough solar power to keep up with our autopilot, so I was hand helming a lot at night, to save power for my wife's watches. We kept to a rigid 4hr system. We didn't prepare anywhere near enough food before leaving.

We came through it feeling like it was the hardest thing we'd done since having a newborn: you're constantly tired, you don't have a clue what you're doing, and everything is potentially terrifying.

A year later we did the leg from Gib to the Canaries, with a fair degree of trepidation. By this time we had tripled our solar and added a windvane. We also added a freezer and had prepared enough meals to last almost the whole passage. And we dropped the rigid watch system and went for 4hr night watches and longer day watches, rotating the pattern each night.

It worked a treat. We have employed the same system on every passage since then, including the 18 days from Mindelo to Guadeloupe. We now feel that 300-500nm passages are no big deal.

 

[thinwater]

Did it once.

During the day we went back and forth, typically 4-6 hours, according to who was doing what. Some napping when off. At night my crew covered until ~ 2 am, (I crashed early), and then I covered from then until dawn. As long as we got a few naps during the day, that was fine. We were both people who did our deep sleeping early. If either was tired, we adjusted it a little. If bad weather was coming, we tried to bank some sleep ahead. Rigid shifts did not fit our sleep patterns as well as something a little more flexible.