How do I buy a battery driven (i.e. cordless for boat use) product that retains power for longer than a year or two?

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Is there a chemist or true battery expert in the fraternity who can explain how to select cordless products that remain effective for more than a couple of years? Is there a specific battery chemical make-up that is preferable. I guess there must be or there would be a large number of irate electric cars drivers by now.
(I am fed up with newish vacuum cleaners, drills, inspection lamps lasting just a few minutes even though they have been fully charged - all are Lithium based)?
Cheers
Bob
 
Store your lithium based battery no more than 70% charge and the battery should last well.
Try not to go below 30% and above 80% when in use and charging and that should lengthen it's projected life.
I used my lidls hammer drill after a year of being in my shed and it worked fine.
 
We have a pair of Gtech vacuum cleaners which we inherited from a late SIL nearly 3 years ago and she'd had them a few years. I think that they're Li ion powered and they are very effective and hold their charge for ages. I don't know if Gtech make other items.
 
My Bosch cordless drill has an 18v lithium-ion battery, works well, and must be at least 15 years old.

My Dyson cordless handheld vacs are about 6 years old, I've bought a replacement battery for one.

I have loads of torches using 18650 lithium-ion cells (as used in Tesla cars!) and they all keep recharging happily.
 
Do you mean a battery that will hold its charge without being used or charged for over 3 years? Not going to happen.
But looking after a battery as described above will work as long as you don't use it 3 times a day for 3 years. No battery will last 3 years being used constantly for 3 years even if looked after.
 
Rappey said:
Store your lithium based battery no more than 70% charge and the battery should last well.
Try not to go below 30% and above 80% when in use and charging and that should lengthen it's projected life.
I used my lidls hammer drill after a year of being in my shed and it worked fine.
Click to expand...

Lithium based batterys should be stored at 30 - 50% of charge .... as an RC Hobbyist - we use all types of Lithium and that is a universal factor except for Lithium Iron or commonly termed LiFe ... where higher storage figures can be kept without damage to the cells.

Damage to Lithium cells is mainly by two factors :

Discharging till unit stops working - that means you have gone past the lowest charge level and should have stopped.

Storing fully charged. This leads to internal resistance increasing each time stored and that reduces use time until eventually you literally see full charge - but unit doesn't do its job ...

OK ... its a sad fact that most cordless have a short life and that's something I solve by using my RC Models side.


I have lots of battery packs that are no longer suitable for flight - but can power tools like this.

Another solution is to power the item by a lead from your 12v boat supply .................

I did this to a drill years ago ... and because the battery usually balances the tool in hand - I left battery pack in, but insulated it so it did not create a hazard.

Simply open up battery pack ... solder your lead to the contact board ... after cutting the battery connections ... lead the wire out of battery pack and then put battery pack back into tool ... plug anf now you have virtually endless power ..
 
I agree with the OP that battery products are disappointing. I am perfectly aware of the lithium batteries' needs, but in practice I own many items which are variously used daily, like my shaver, or only very rarely, such as my hand-held radio. The need to follow specific instructions just to keep a product working is tiresome and often expensive. There are other items that need attention too, such as my car, but in this case the business of checking oil, washer and tyres is easily managed and fitted into my daily or weekly routine.
 
I've been rather pleased with the DeWalt xr brushless drill I have on board. Batteries seem to hold charge better than previous tools I've had.
18v but with a charger (DCB119) that works direct from the 12v boat battery so easy to charge up if needed.

PS - Also put the XR cordless angle grinder into the "Rigging Emergency" bag this year.
 
Years ago we bought a really expensive dyson handheld vacuum for the boat on the basis of the a recommendation by Tom Cunliffe doubtless itself incentivised in some way as it came via a sailing mag. The thing was a nimh battery and for years on the boat it’s performance was pathetic- not holding charge for more than maybe a day, creating a race against time to vacuum th saloon of a 30ft boat every time we used it before it cut out within minutes.

Last year we removed it and on the basis that we only vacuum the boat when back in port (and on shore power) bought a 35 quid portable mains vacuum which works great.

Funnily enough we took the dyson home and plugged it in in the kitchen cupboard where it’s permanently in charge. It’s had a new lease of life as a handy vacuum but only cos it’s on charge all the time. It was rubbish for a cruising boat.
 
Older tools used NiCd (Cadmium based) batterys and when cadmium was outlawed - the NiMh (Metal Hybrid) took over. But the NiMh doesn't have the output capability the old Cadmium had.

Example : I have a burn mark on my left leg from a NiCd AAA cell shorting in my pocket ... yes I know - why carry an AAA in your pocket ...
The discharge rate of NiCd is extreme ... but NiMh cannot approach it even in the low capacity cells. As the capacity of NiMh cells increases - that discharge rate suffers ....

Enter the world of Lithium ... LiPo type Litium Ion batterys have one of the highest energy densities for retail batterys and have become popular for high power models etc. But they are charge and storage sensitive cells and rapidly fail if not used correctly. Enter more tolerant forms ... LiFe in both base and polymer versions ( LiFe / LiFePo) and non polymer LiIon ....

The LiFe cells can be charged and stay charged for long periods unlike LiIon and LiPo ...

Why the above info ? The battery used in your hand item is the deciding factor and how you use it. If its NiMh - then its going to be pi**-poor whatever you do.
If its standard LiIon - then its going to have a shortish life before battery gives out. Just check out your Laptop computer which generally uses LiIon basic ...
If its LiFePo or LiFe - then you stand a chance of longer life and good use.
It its LiPo - then it will give good service but soon battery will die with the abuse.

Answer ? Remove old cells and put in 18650 ... 22xxx LiIon or even better LiFe cells .... as close to the original voltage as you can get. But you will have to also change your charger as the one you had with the original pack is likely not suited.
You can get budget chargers to suit Lithium form cells .... many of which can also charge many other forms of battery - even your main boat or car batterys.

Of course you can buy another manufacturers battery - but that's just wasting money ..... IMHO.
 
I keep an Aldi 16v combi drill on board, and it's been fine for the last 3 years. I did buy a second battery for it and so far it's been perfect for the occasional drilling job on board during the season. I keep a Ryobi 18v cordless drill at home which has been excellent for the last 10 year, including building an extension.
 
CFG98 said:
Do you mean a battery that will hold its charge without being used or charged for over 3 years? Not going to happen.
Click to expand...
Smoke detectors and epirbs batteries are 10 years. I did google and they are lithium batteries.

This is a very interesting thread . Seems some batteries can go up to 10 years in regular use but other items like mobile phones and tablets batteries can start to fade around 3 years.
An effect of fast charging or just a very hard life, being charged every day to 100% and then depleted to ??
 
Rappey said:
Smoke detectors and epirbs batteries are 10 years. I did google and they are lithium batteries.

This is a very interesting thread . Seems some batteries can go up to 10 years in regular use but other items like mobile phones and tablets batteries can start to fade around 3 years.
An effect of fast charging or just a very hard life, being charged every day to 100% and then depleted to ??
Click to expand...
If it is necessary for a battery to be charged to 70%, then there should be a function allowing this as an option. Why should I want to sit for hours pehaps and watch the percentage, even on those few gadgets that display it? All I ask for is something like a green LED showing when 70% is reached, and a second one if I want to charge fully. Also, an amber one when it falls to 30% would be nice. A little diagramm of a battery with three bars tells me nothing.
 
johnalison said:
If it is necessary for a battery to be charged to 70%, then there should be a function
Click to expand...
I agree with that. Makita batteries are not cheap but in professional use they get depleted until they cut off, fast charged to 100% and so the cycle continues.
Would be nice to be able to charge to whatever percentage is best for storage automatically.
The chinese clones display a voltage so at least you have some idea of the state of charge/discharge.
 
Rappey said:
Smoke detectors and epirbs batteries are 10 years. I did google and they are lithium batteries.
Click to expand...
These are completely different chemistry being non rechargeable batteries. Typical battery is CR123 type. often used in EPIRB etc. With typical shelf life of 5 to 10 years.
great for emergency flash light radio etc. Not practical for high usage devices. ol'will
 
Rappey said:
I agree with that. Makita batteries are not cheap but in professional use they get depleted until they cut off, fast charged to 100% and so the cycle continues.
Would be nice to be able to charge to whatever percentage is best for storage automatically.
The chinese clones display a voltage so at least you have some idea of the state of charge/discharge.
Click to expand...
Makita battery packs have built in electronic protection to prevent them being discharged completely.
 
Thanks everyone.
I agree with those suggesting that if a charging profile is necessary (the 70% thing) then it should be designed in to the charger circuit. I know how incapable I am of undertaking 'routines' - paying attention to battery charging status of multiple tools is not how I will spend my remaining days!

From your other thoughts, it would seem to leave two possibilities:-
Ensure the supplied battery is the LiFe variant (Even the most expensive Miele cordless vacuum uses Li-ion, so that may be difficult?)
or
Buy only 12V battery devices and skillfully use one's engineering training (bodge) to add an ability to power the device from the boat's main battery [although that would produce a pretty hefty current draw in the case of a vacuum cleaner - best avoided].

Cheers
Bob
 
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