HELP!!! Heads sink plumbing ideas?

[KevO]

The heads area in our Hustler is getting overhauled in accordance with the latest promulgation of SROs (SWMBOs Routine Orders). As can be seen below, the compartment is pretty cramped and currently has a Jabsco compact loo and a 'pull out' sink unit. The sink unit drain is simple... you pull out the plug (no pipes connected to it) and the waste water just falls into the loo bowl below to be pumped out. The top part of the loo seat assembly has been removed (leaving just the seat ) to allow for this.

SWMBO wants a new, regular sized Jabsco fitted and the full seat assembly used. Therefore the sink cannot just drain straight down into the bowl (cos the lid's gonna be in the way). I am (apparently) allowed to reposition the sink as required to allow the new loo and plumbing to be fitted which is a bonus I'm sure you will agree.

Anyhoo... the old heads and sink unit etc is coming out, old waste pipes too, then the seacocks stripped down and serviced. Bulkheads are to be faced with new modern pattern formica (chosen by guess who) and the new loo fitted as per instructions. So... does anyone have any bright and practical ideas about how I can refit the sink and connect up the sink drain so that the waste water can be got rid of safely (without fitting a new skin fitting)?

 

[colind3782]

T into the heads outlet?

 

[sailorman]

Change swmbo simples

 

[LadyInBed]

Stick with slide out sink but T off the top (toilet flush) hose, maybe with a non return valve in, to the sink drain.

 

[KevO]

Stick with slide out sink but T off the top (toilet flush) hose, maybe with a non return valve in, to the sink drain.

OK..... As in allow the sink to drain into the loo bowl by joining into the 'flush water in' hose from the pump assembly? That might work... I suppose a non-return valve would ensure the flush water didn't get forced up the sink drain pipe.

 

[Zen Zero]

cup-saw a big hole in the Jabsco lid, and sand it to avoid getting splinters.

 

[sailorman]

we have a diverter valve on the toilet inlet & basin on another fine Holman & Pye design

OK..... As in allow the sink to drain into the loo bowl by joining into the 'flush water in' hose from the pump assembly? That might work... I suppose a non-return valve would ensure the flush water didn't get forced up the sink drain pipe.

 

[prv]

Use a tip-up sink instead of a sliding one (I'm assuming there isn't space to fit a fixed one). These have no plughole, but empty the water over the back into the housing when you tip them up to close. The housing then has a fitting for the waste hose. Then, if you are, or soon will be, out of the water, fit a new seacock for the sink drain instead of messing about plumbing it into the heads. This needn't be deep below the waterline; mine is exactly on it but you could also have it a little way above (not too far though or it'll have a visible streak running down from it).

Pete

 

[Rossynant]

Don't You Believe It
There was such thing on Hurley 27. Never understood this medieval UK tradition of filling the sink with water (like a bucket)... but won't work in a seaway. So how you wash on wrong tack, with water in sink sloshing out - in oilskins?

Connecting to toilet inlet may work, saw also T-ed to head outlet (with one-way valve!); but new seacock for outlet is not a pain to fit and best way.

 

[john_morris_uk]

I think that 'T'-ing into the heads inlet or outlet is fraught with potential problems. If you 'T' into the inlet then you will have to put a well fitting plug into the sink every time you flush to ensure that you pump properly. Furthermore to empty the sink you will have to pump the toilet again which is a pain. 'T'-ing the sink waste into the toilet flush gives you the potential for effluent to come back up the pipe into the sink and if you manage not to get effluent backing up into the sink where you wash your hands (and face?) you certainly might get smells coming up the pipe if someone doesn't flush too effectively. It will only take a slight blockage down stream of the T fitting for you to be pumping effluent back up into the boat. I cannot imagine that SWMBO will be too keen on that possibility?

I don't see any reasonable solution except to add another skin fitting and sea-cock. Put it near the waterline if you want? I know people hate drilling holes in their hull, but I don't see any answer to your problems. Its also the way that most every other boat does it...

 

[Tranona]

You may find your whole plan scuppered when you measure up the space required for a full sized bowl loo.

 

[ccscott49]

Stick with slide out sink but T off the top (toilet flush) hose, maybe with a non return valve in, to the sink drain.

+1, seemples!

 

[David2452]

Stick with slide out sink but T off the top (toilet flush) hose, maybe with a non return valve in, to the sink drain.

That would be ineffective as the pressure needed to pass a reliable non return valve is far greater than the head (pun intended) of water in the sink. It could be accomplished by fitting a "Y" valve to the inlet side of the heads which would either pump sea water or basin water through the bowl, but what a clat, both to fit and use, as has been said fit another overboard drain, that's if there's even room for a basin by the time the full size bowl is in there.

 

[john_morris_uk]

Stick with slide out sink but T off the top (toilet flush) hose, maybe with a non return valve in, to the sink drain.

I have just re-read your idea and agree with the others who say it won't work.

I assum you mean "t-ing" into the pipe from the toilet flush pump to the toilet pan. The theory being that water from the sink will end up filling the toilet and can then be flushed away.

If you didn't fit a non-return valve, then every time you flushed the toilet you would get water shooting up into the sink. If you fitted a non-return valve I agree with David that the pressure of head of water will almost certainly be not enough to allow the sink water to drain.

In addition you still have to pump the toilet out again once you;ve finished washing.

An extra skin fitting and sea-cock really is the way ahead... It also has the benefit of being simple.

 

[sailorman]

No plug req we use the diverter valve to retain the basin water. we have owned our boat 15 yrs trouble free in the basin dept

I think that 'T'-ing into the heads inlet or outlet is fraught with potential problems. If you 'T' into the inlet then you will have to put a well fitting plug into the sink every time you flush to ensure that you pump properly. Furthermore to empty the sink you will have to pump the toilet again which is a pain. 'T'-ing the sink waste into the toilet flush gives you the potential for effluent to come back up the pipe into the sink and if you manage not to get effluent backing up into the sink where you wash your hands (and face?) you certainly might get smells coming up the pipe if someone doesn't flush too effectively. It will only take a slight blockage down stream of the T fitting for you to be pumping effluent back up into the boat. I cannot imagine that SWMBO will be too keen on that possibility?

I don't see any reasonable solution except to add another skin fitting and sea-cock. Put it near the waterline if you want? I know people hate drilling holes in their hull, but I don't see any answer to your problems. Its also the way that most every other boat does it...

 

[sailorman]

we have a Lavac

I have just re-read your idea and agree with the others who say it won't work.

I assum you mean "t-ing" into the pipe from the toilet flush pump to the toilet pan. The theory being that water from the sink will end up filling the toilet and can then be flushed away.

If you didn't fit a non-return valve, then every time you flushed the toilet you would get water shooting up into the sink. If you fitted a non-return valve I agree with David that the pressure of head of water will almost certainly be not enough to allow the sink water to drain.

In addition you still have to pump the toilet out again once you;ve finished washing.

An extra skin fitting and sea-cock really is the way ahead... It also has the benefit of being simple.

 

[john_morris_uk]

Diverter valve or plug - it still does the same job of sealing the pipe to allow the flush etc?

I still think a separate skin fitting and seacock is the best solution.

 

[sailorman]

yet another hoe in the hull then

Diverter valve or plug - it still does the same job of sealing the pipe to allow the flush etc?

I still think a separate skin fitting and seacock is the best solution.

 

[john_morris_uk]

Yet another hole in the hull then

So? They are not dangerous in themselves and I don't understand why people have this strange aversion to holes in the hull. Just make sure you've got properly fitted skin fittings and sea-cocks. All boats have holes in their hulls for all sorts of reasons...

No-one seems bothered by the miles of seams in a traditional carvel boat that are filled with twisted cotton and putty...

 

[greenalien]

Run the drain pipe from the sink under the back of the toilet seat hinge, so it's clamped between the seat and the bowl. You'll need to flatten the pipe - heat helps - but as long as it's not flattened too much, water will still drain through it into the heads bowl, and no need for an extra skin fitting. I've used this arrangement for nearly 30 years, and it works fine.