Help buying a first motor boat

[Capt Popeye]

Do not be totally put off by the apocalyptic fuel consumption warnings. the maximum speed you will be doing on the Thames is
8 kilometres an hour.
Those monster engines will be operating at tickover and probably sipping 2 gallons an hour at idle, lets call an average a couple of hours up and couple of back....4 x hours total so £50 for fuel, not bad for day out for a family. ?
You will spend more on food and drink.
You need to get somebody who knows about boats with petrol engines nad outdrives or get it surveyed
Fuel consumption MerCruiser

The brutal truth is that a limited budget you may end up with a tired cramped bit smelly old boat which suits the Thames or something modern bright and airy that your other half is prepared to go boating in, which does not.

Well what you so state Mr O might be right, in certain cirumstances, BUT, guess that you are asuming that someone new to boating, buys a Sports Cruiser with say potential 30 -40 knots max speed , and keeps to the 8 knot (or whatever) speed limit is is place upon the river; Fair guess is that a newcomer will open up the Throttles a bit at times to Clear the fuel system out (alledgedly) or use the engine power to perform in /out locks etc unnecessarily !

Watching /curbing ones generated Wash by slowing own to maybe 6 knots maybe not deemed right by any newby , so guess that a craft designed / built for inland rivers and waterways will proove much less of a hazard to opperate in one's early stages than a performance craft designed and built for open waters and sea going !

 

[PaulRainbow]

Running a pair of 4 litre petrol engines at idle all of the time is just ridiculous. Not to mention servicing costs, servicing two outdrives etc etc etc etc, all ridiculous.

There are various makes/models of small motorboats that would be vastly better suited to inland waterways. Modern boats such as Sealine are good value and a single engined diesel will cost next to nothing for fuel.

For instance: 2000 Sealine S24, Conwy Conwy - boats.com

 

[oldgit]

Well what you so state Mr O might be right, in certain cirumstances, BUT, guess that you are asuming that someone new to boating, buys a Sports Cruiser with say potential 30 -40 knots max speed , and keeps to the 8 knot (or whatever) speed limit is is place upon the river; Fair guess is that a newcomer will open up the Throttles a bit at times to Clear the fuel system out (alledgedly) or use the engine power to perform in /out locks etc unnecessarily !

Watching /curbing ones generated Wash by slowing own to maybe 6 knots maybe not deemed right by any newby , so guess that a craft designed / built for inland rivers and waterways will proove much less of a hazard to opperate in one's early stages than a performance craft designed and built for open waters and sea going !

Not knowing the skipper I would not dare presume about his capabilities and I bow to your superior knowledge.
A quick search on Google suggests that the boat in question has been used and spent much of its life on the Thames and judging by the history of the boat, over a considerable period .
It also appears to have ventured a lot further a field than many other boats .
The previous owner seems to have had a lot of use out of this particular "unsuitable" for the Thames boat.

 

[oldgit]

Running a pair of 4 litre petrol engines at idle all of the time is just ridiculous. Not to mention servicing costs, servicing two outdrives etc etc etc etc, all ridiculous.

There are various makes/models of small motorboats that would be vastly better suited to inland waterways. Modern boats such as Sealine are good value and a single engined diesel will cost next to nothing for fuel.

For instance: 2000 Sealine S24, Conwy Conwy - boats.com

Standing on a Thames river bank might suggest that many of the boats moving past are not "suitable" , including some very impressive very powerful off shore craft with outdrives which spend their lives going only from lock to lock. They all seem to manage and enjoy their boating.


The OPs budget magically appears just gone up by nearly 30%.
It has the KAD 32 . Judging from larger KAD engines on the Thames, the skipper will spend his days enduring the banshee row of the compressor plus the turbo relay clunking in and out.
Diesel better no argument but single engine will be pig to handle in confined spaces even with no wind and as for those weeny narrow side decks and curved foredeck to be negociated at every single lock ?
It will also have to be transported to the Thames and its going to have to undergo the BSS into the bargain.
We are now a long way from sub £20K ?

 

[PaulRainbow]

Standing on a Thames river bank might suggest that many of the boats moving past are not "suitable" , including some very impressive very powerful off shore craft with outdrives which spend their lives going only from lock to lock. They all seem to manage and enjoy their boating.

It doesn't matter what other boats there are on the Thames or how many of them are unsuitable, running a small boat with two 4 litre engines in an area with an 8kph speed limit is just plain stupid.

.The OPs budget magically appears just gone up by nearly 30%.
Diesel better no argument but single engine will be pig to handle in confined spaces even with no wind and as for those weeny narrow side decks and curved foredeck to be encountered at every single lock ?

We don't know what the OPs budget is, only that he looked at a £20k boat.

Single engine is no problem at all, my last boat was a single engined motorboat and i had no issues with it, even on the Thames. My current boat is also single engined inboard diesel, but with sails, 35ft and i can comfortably mange it, single handed.

If you're struggling with single engined boats, perhaps some tuition might help

 

[Capt Popeye]

Standing on a Thames river bank might suggest that many of the boats moving past are not "suitable" , including some very impressive very powerful off shore craft with outdrives which spend their lives going only from lock to lock. They all seem to manage and enjoy their boating.


The OPs budget magically appears just gone up by nearly 30%.
It has the KAD 32 . Judging from larger KAD engines on the Thames, the skipper will spend his days enduring the banshee row of the compressor plus the turbo relay clunking in and out.
Diesel better no argument but single engine will be pig to handle in confined spaces even with no wind and as for those weeny narrow side decks and curved foredeck to be negociated at every single lock ?
It will also have to be transported to the Thames and its going to have to undergo the BSS into the bargain.
We are now a long way from sub £20K ?

Hi Mr OG I thought that most motor cruisers on the Broads have but one engine, probably a Diesel, most probably not a Big Un either; so my guess is that if Novices and Starter Outers on them Broads can manage it the Thames must be a doddle

 

[oldgit]

It doesn't matter what other boats there are on the Thames or how many of them are unsuitable, running a small boat with two 4 litre engines in an area with an 8kph speed limit is just plain stupid.



We don't know what the OPs budget is, only that he looked at a £20k boat.

Single engine is no problem at all, my last boat was a single engined motorboat and i had no issues with it, even on the Thames. My current boat is also single engined inboard diesel, but with sails, 35ft and i can comfortably mange it, single handed.

If you're struggling with single engined boats, perhaps some tuition might help

OG struggles with twin engine boats never mind singles.

When people mention that thay are interested in £20K a boat it does possibly indicate the price range they are interested in ?
.....................and six feet and half a ton of of keel might be of some help in a single engined boat ?

 

[oldgit]

Hi Mr OG I thought that most motor cruisers on the Broads have but one engine, probably a Diesel, most probably not a Big Un either; so my guess is that if Novices and Starter Outers on them Broads can manage it the Thames must be a doddle

"most" motor cruisers on the Broads are probably not featherweight soap dishes with all the weight hanging out of the back of the boat ?

 

[ARJP]

Do not be totally put off by the apocalyptic fuel consumption warnings. the maximum speed you will be doing on the Thames is
8 kilometres an hour.
Those monster engines will be operating at tickover and probably sipping 2 gallons an hour at idle, lets call an average a couple of hours up and couple of back....4 x hours total so £50 for fuel, not bad for day out for a family. ?
You will spend more on food and drink.
You need to get somebody who knows about boats with petrol engines nad outdrives or get it surveyed
Fuel consumption MerCruiser

The brutal truth is that a limited budget you may end up with a tired cramped bit smelly old boat which suits the Thames or something modern bright and airy that your other half is prepared to go boating in, which does not.

Thank you for the balanced view. Your final paragraph is pretty much where I am.

 

[ARJP]

A quick update,
I’ve taken onboard everyones views (fuel type, dual vs single engine, engine size, fuel consumption, resellerable value of the boat etc) which led me to reject the twin engined Sea Ray Mercruiser boat.
I’ve now opted for a much simpler boat and a completely different style as my first river boat. A single diesel engined 1.8l Freeman 27. Not the sports cruiser that was the Sea Ray, much more a ‘sensible’ river boat (I hope).

I would be keen to know your views.

I’m buying the boat privately (no broker), what paper work should be completed. I’ve read about ’bill of sale’ and I should see the previous ‘bills of sale’. Is this correct and what else should be transacted?

Many thanks.

 

[oldgit]

This might be useful.


Engine condition is critical on boat of this age. Cooling system inspection check vital especially heat exchanger . Is the engine a bog standard known quantity ie. spares available of the shelf from motor factor or specialist for that type of engine.
River trial is important, be very careful if boat is ashore , especially for any length of time.
You do NOT want some cobbled togther " Frankenstein" engine . Your only option might be custom made spares . Its not just the money itys finding somebody to actually do the job and the time taken.
Any seller that can produce a thick wad of bills and invoices over his/her years of ownership is a boat owner who may have probably looked after his boat.
Worth a look .
Lancing Marine
https://www.lancingmarine.co

There is a Freeman boat owners group out there as well.
Freeman Cruisers - The Freeman Owners Club

Club might give you an idea if the asking price is fair or merely the result of the seller taking advantage of the boaty " Staycation" price inflation around at the moment.

 

[harvey38]

Love Freemans, had two of them, well built, a HUGE following so parts, knowledge, upgrades and information available by the bucket load. Well suited for inland waterways but there used to be a brave
old boy who crossed the Channel in his F22 quite a few times.

Enjoy

 

[oldgit]

Love Freemans, had two of them, well built, a HUGE following so parts, knowledge, upgrades and information available by the bucket load. Well suited for inland waterways but there used to be a brave
old boy who crossed the Channel in his F22 quite a few times.

Enjoy

Ideal boat for Thames and a couple of decent side decks to go forward quickly and safely when entering locks and mooring up.
A stable boat, unlike the wibbly wobbly sports boats that need the agility of a mountain goat with a life time of advanced mountaineering to clamber over foredeck while desperately gripping anything within reach.

 

[ARJP]

This might be useful.


Engine condition is critical on boat of this age. Cooling system inspection check vital especially heat exchanger . Is the engine a bog standard known quantity ie. spares available of the shelf from motor factor or specialist for that type of engine.
River trial is important, be very careful if boat is ashore , especially for any length of time.
You do NOT want some cobbled togther " Frankenstein" engine . Your only option might be custom made spares . Its not just the money itys finding somebody to actually do the job and the time taken.
Any seller that can produce a thick wad of bills and invoices over his/her years of ownership is a boat owner who may have probably looked after his boat.
Worth a look .
Lancing Marine
https://www.lancingmarine.co

There is a Freeman boat owners group out there as well.
Freeman Cruisers - The Freeman Owners Club

Club might give you an idea if the asking price is fair or merely the result of the seller taking advantage of the boaty " Staycation" price inflation around at the moment.

Many thanks for the insight and details. Is the picture you shared from a manual for the Freeman 27?

 

[oldgit]

Many thanks for the insight and details. Is the picture you shared from a manual for the Freeman 27?

The picture is from
25 YEARS OF MOTOR CRUISERS. 1960- 1984. BY Alex McMullen
IBSN 0-7136-3459-6
Published by Adlard Coles Nautical in association with Motor Boats Monthly, an august organisation who once published a magazine featuring actual boats.
Once if a boat was rubbish the boat test skipper said so.

 

[harvey38]

The picture is from
25 YEARS OF MOTOR CRUISERS. 1960- 1984. BY Alex McMullen
IBSN 0-7136-3459-6
Published by Adlard Coles Nautical in association with Motor Boats Monthly, an august organisation who once published a magazine featuring actual boats.
Once if a boat was rubbish the boat test skipper said so.

Motor Boats Monthly, I used to love that magazine, a constant source of down to earth, practical information, plenty of used boat tests and more in touch with reality showing boats at costs
that opened up boating to many more people on a modest income rather than todays publication.