chanelyacht
Well-Known Member
I meant when they went bust.
Their finance team did really well went they went bust, didn't they....
Their finance team did really well went they went bust, didn't they....
Has the RNLI lost the plot?
- Thread starter ffiill
- Start date
chanelyacht
Well-Known Member
Because at the start of the recovery, you don't know if you'll get a second immediate tasking - and yes, I've tasked lifeboats out to incidents in that situation a number of times.
Mister E
Well-Known Member
It is wind that severly limits travel lifts and makes them a non starter.
Sybarite
Well-Known Member
As I said above :
As far as making a travel hoist safe in high winds it is surely not beyond the wit of man to design for this.
chanelyacht
Well-Known Member
Thus making it twice as hard to recover - it's hard enough getting a large RIB into a DoDo trailer on a cross current shelving beach in a storm, never mind trying to get a 13m hard boat into a hanging sling.
The wit of man has designed a system that works, it's called the Shannon Launch System.
dogleg
Well-Known Member
[QUOTE=Sybarite;6080196]Well you seem to know better than the RNLI. I asked them what the operational limits were and that was their response. There is a clip on youtube of another boat being launched into waves (not a Shannon) and they found themselves pushed broadside on by the waves. They finally got off by getting outside the wave zone in reverse gear. I don't think the waves would have been 2m high.
Here it is : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KCYADeobHaI
As for 2m waves along the coast line you need to look at some winter storm videos. And that's when the boat might be most needed.
You seem to have forgotten that I have explained the incident you highlight with the Mersey, I will repeat it. The station had just taken delivery of the Mersey and with it a new launching procedure. The previous boats, a Rother before that a especially adapted Beach Watson had been launched over wooden skids ( as at Dungeness) down a steeply shelving beach. This was I think the first really rough exercise launch in a F7 easterly, the boat was released too soon from the carriage the rest you can see. This video was subsequently used for training purposes.
The Shannon launched system would have avoided this incident since it is basically a portable slipway with the boat released from inside the wheelhouse by the coxswain, no need for anyone on deck.
Most Mersey/ Shannon stations launch in sheltered sites, inside a drying harbour, a few on flat beaches where even in a storm the surf is not great (assuming of course the wind is on shore), A few(Dungeness, Hastings and others) will launch over steep shingle beaches. However I know of no occasion when a Mersey or earlier boats such as the Oakley being unable to launch.
I trust you do not seriously believe that LB crews would be so engrossed with their Sims screens that they would not keep a visual lookout. As Channel Yacht states the Tamar in particular will often be on scene commander in a large SAR operation requiring frequent communication and search planning. I have done it, have you? The new 19 metre Dutch LB currently on trials still I believe at the Imuiden station, has a version of Sims. The Dutch began this project in 2008.
Anyway soon I will be at Kiel week for relaxation, peace and quiet. Should I take my laptop?
Here it is : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KCYADeobHaI
As for 2m waves along the coast line you need to look at some winter storm videos. And that's when the boat might be most needed.
You seem to have forgotten that I have explained the incident you highlight with the Mersey, I will repeat it. The station had just taken delivery of the Mersey and with it a new launching procedure. The previous boats, a Rother before that a especially adapted Beach Watson had been launched over wooden skids ( as at Dungeness) down a steeply shelving beach. This was I think the first really rough exercise launch in a F7 easterly, the boat was released too soon from the carriage the rest you can see. This video was subsequently used for training purposes.
The Shannon launched system would have avoided this incident since it is basically a portable slipway with the boat released from inside the wheelhouse by the coxswain, no need for anyone on deck.
Most Mersey/ Shannon stations launch in sheltered sites, inside a drying harbour, a few on flat beaches where even in a storm the surf is not great (assuming of course the wind is on shore), A few(Dungeness, Hastings and others) will launch over steep shingle beaches. However I know of no occasion when a Mersey or earlier boats such as the Oakley being unable to launch.
I trust you do not seriously believe that LB crews would be so engrossed with their Sims screens that they would not keep a visual lookout. As Channel Yacht states the Tamar in particular will often be on scene commander in a large SAR operation requiring frequent communication and search planning. I have done it, have you? The new 19 metre Dutch LB currently on trials still I believe at the Imuiden station, has a version of Sims. The Dutch began this project in 2008.
Anyway soon I will be at Kiel week for relaxation, peace and quiet. Should I take my laptop?
Iminei
Well-Known Member
I'd leave the laptop at home if I were you.
I'm glad the RNLI and their French counterparts are there, & hope I never need their services. Been on the planet long enough to understand that no organisation is perfect. At least I'm not paying for either involuntarily.
Edited below
Why don't the people who are so obviously upset with the workings of the RNLI join it and try to change it, rather than posting on an internet forum?
I'm glad the RNLI and their French counterparts are there, & hope I never need their services. Been on the planet long enough to understand that no organisation is perfect. At least I'm not paying for either involuntarily.
Best post in the thread?
Edited below
Why don't the people who are so obviously upset with the workings of the RNLI join it and try to change it, rather than posting on an internet forum?
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Sybarite
Well-Known Member
Just feeding information which you may choose or not to use.
As I said many years ago If I were an RNLI donor I would not be happy.
But I am not going over there to join. What I have done is email the RNLI with some sample posts so that they cannot claim top be unaware of the issues. However I have been informed that the thread is monitored - or at least it was in the past.
They are free to jump in at any stage.
Sybarite
Well-Known Member
A hanging sling is not what I intended. I may have expressed it badly but i envisaged something like a cradle or cage being suspended into which the LB could be run. Alternatively I suggested that pad-eyes could be built into the structure to which hooks from the travel hoist could be attached. It's not rocket science.
What I am suggesting would cost a fraction of the RNLI's solution.
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Sybarite
Well-Known Member
Oh come on Bru you can do better than that...
Mister E
Well-Known Member
As an accountant have you looked at the full costs of your hoist idea?
Because busting public myths about the RNLI and thereby educating 10,000's of people is the best way to change the RNLI.
Informed public debate about the RNLI on a highly Google indexed resource such as YBW.com will eventually be picked up by mainstream media research and then rebroadcast to millions on prime-time TV.
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D
Deleted member 36384
Guest
Upset, I doubt that, the 'obviously' emotional responses are from those who are critical of Sybarite. This is the Scuttlebutt, it's what it exists for, posting on an internet forum, where we 'chat' and 'debate' about sailing topics.
The debate is quite relevant as RNLI funding could be reduced in future if the British public have less association with the sea. I think that both sides defending and challenging positions is a good thing. Lots of information has been brought into the Scuttlebutt and made available for us to review and think about, which would otherwise not be readily available. What a wonderful thing that is.
dogleg
Well-Known Member
can you tell me your 5 year plan for the RNLI?
Bru
Well-Known Member
I can, I have, it's a waste of time! You've got your entrenched opinion, I've got mine and we're never going to agree
The sun is shining, guests arrive later, rum and beer will be consumed in great quantities over the weekend, I'm playing a gig on Sunday and we go sailing on Monday.
Circular arguments on an obscure and unimportant Internet forum are fine on the cold dark depths of winter but now it's time to have some fun
The RNLI operates as a defacto Government department so any thorough 5-year plan for the RNLI needs to include reform of other State agencies in the marine environment.
So I will offer just a light-touch plan independent of wholesale reform of maritime State agencies.
Light-Touch.
This plan is based on the belief that, like other mega corporate British charities, the RNLI has become corrupted by cronyism among the liberal elite class. I think that most executive decisions within the RNLI are made in the belief that unlimited corporate style expansion of the RNLI is an unquestionable mission and the ensuing development of career opportunity for cronies is an unmentioned fringe benefit. On that basis I would put the RNLI into special measures and direct control by an appointee of the Charity Commission.
Actions to be taken:
- Issue redundancy notices to all employees earning over £60k p/a.
- Close down the RNLI Press Relations department on the basis that its systemic tendency to distort the truth has caused immeasurable reputational damage to the RNLI.
- I would appoint Sybarite as "Lead Custodian" of the RNLI. I find it offensive that any charity should decide to employ a "Chief Executive".
- I would ask Sybarite to calculate what savings could be made by relocating the RNLI to Hartlepool as I find it ridiculous that any large charity should locate its HQ within waving distance of one of the world's top-10 real estate hotspots.
- I would also ask Sybarite to reduce RNLI operating costs to near French levels and then calculate if remaining financial reserves would allow the RNLI's commercial Bay Watch service to be provided free of charge to Britain's cash starved Town and District Councils.
- Finally I would take measures to repair the breakdown in trust triggered by mismanagement at RNLI. When volunteers at lifeboat stations resort to protest and resignation over executive incompetence, leading to station closure, something profound has gone wrong with the prevailing cultural ethos at RNLI HQ.
- Finally No.2. The RNLI has developed worrying Liberal Fascist tendencies in recent years, the HQ staff behind this would be removed though in practice sacking those paid over £60k p/a and relocating to the North East would largely self correct this problem.
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Iminei
Well-Known Member
Fair point.
On a slight tangent (& ignoring all the pro & anti arguments) I actually appreciate & enjoy some of the Tamar boatsheds as some fine pieces of marine civil engineering - Padstow & the Mumbles for example. I'll have to go and have a look at St Davids sometime.
Sybarite
Well-Known Member
The RNLI couldn't afford me.....
[163233]
...
Can you be a liberal fascist?
Bru
Well-Known Member
The sun is still shining, there's some really interesting boats arriving, the beer is just the right temperature, life is good. Why worry?