Has anyone tried Biodiesel?

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Dalliance

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I've just tested some biodiesel as a replacement for red diesel for our (auxilliary) Beta and it apears to be an excellent alternative. It has NO SMELL and, if you accidentaly spill it overboard it has virtually no environmental impact. Even after a long run under engine the cabin doesn't smell of diesel fumes which must be good news for people who find the smell worsens their sea sickness. If it can be provided under the same Tax regime as Red diesel (and I believe farmers can buy it as a replacement for Red) then it works out about 8-10p per litre more than red diesel. I don't have shares in a BioDiesel company but I'd be prepared to move over to it and perhaps our Mobo cousins could use it to counter the charge that they're so environmentally unfriendly. Apparently it can't be treated to prevent "thickening" below +4oC but German truck drivers use electic tank heaters in winter mornings to overcome this before the engine warms up. What do fellow forumites think? Is it worth asking our marinas to consider the change?
 
1st let me say i have a vested interest as i am part owner of a bio diesel production company
a couple of things to consider
make sure the diesel is produced to the correct eu standard
i will not bore you but if it isnt beware
also after one full tank use you should change your fuel filters and oil filter
this is because the bio diesel cleans the engine and tank of built up carbons and other pollutents
finally if your engine is still under warrenty dont use it neat as it will probably invalidate your warrenty
you may be able to use a 5% mix without loosing the warrenty
cheers alan
 
Why do people think of Biodiesel as direct replacement ?

Until further development - it is not a direct replacement and will invalidate most warrantys if used as such. You will find on checking warranty's clauses that most likely a max %age mix of 5 - 10% is only allowed.

BIoD has a property that alienates it from conventional fuel - you cannot use conventional additives to winterise / boost or improve the quality.

Also remember that it takes a lot of Fossil fuel to produce commercial quantities ......

As to spillage and non-polluting .... I'll reserve comment on that one .... as Mr. Plod when called by Marina staff for a smear / scum on water may think otherwise ...
 
Re: Why do people think of Biodiesel as direct replacement ?

with ref to the amount of carbon/fossil fuel used to make it,
it can be made from new oil (very carbon intensive)
or as most is made from used cooking oil this is not only recycling used oil which would otherwise be used probably for land fill at best and at worst simply poured down the drain
so if the green issue is important ask the questions.
 
Amount of fuel / energy reqd

The amount of fossil fuel produced energy needed to produce BioD .... recycled chip-oil or excess farmed rape-seed oil .... far outweighs the green argument ... - that is what I was getting at.

The TV stunt of mixing Chip pan oil and "alcohol based" additive is fine in small quantities .... or an owner of a chain of Chip_shops !! but no use to anyone who requires reasonable qty's. They are back to manufacturers who are using fossil fuel produced energy in large amounts ....
 
Re: Amount of fuel / energy reqd

[ QUOTE ]
The amount of fossil fuel produced energy needed to produce BioD ....far outweighs the green argument

[/ QUOTE ]

I'm not convinced that it far outweighs the green argument - while wiki isn't always 100% accurate, this article: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Biodiesel covers a lot of the issues and refers to a USDA study that reckons an energy yield of 3.2 units of energy for every unit of fossil fuel consumed (compared to 0.84 for fossil diesel). And that is for "virgin" biodiesel, not recycled chip fat.

There are plenty of issues with biodiesel - quality control, different burn characteristics, potential for environmental impact if you end up burning rainforest to clear land for palm oil etc. But it's plenty efficient enough to be worthwhile. Especially if you use chip fat!
 
Re: Amount of fuel / energy reqd

Especially if you use chip fat!

No, chip fat doesn't work from a green point of view.

To make biodiesel from chip fat in useful quantities we all have to eat more chips, which results in our weight increasing. Increased passenger weight means that more biodiesel is required to transport them than before and energy (mostly derived from oil unless we go nuclear) is required to make that biodiesel

So, that means that to make that extra biodiesel we all have to eat even more chips, so getting even fatter and even more biodiesel again required to transport the extra weight than before.

So, that means that to make that extra biodiesel we all have to...

Well, you get the picture. While I understand that the efficiency re oil needed to produce the biodiesel from the chip fat does converge to a solution after quite a number of chip eating episodes, the result is that it is far more efficient to just burn the oil in the first place than use it to make biodiesel.

John
 
Re: Amount of fuel / energy reqd

Good points! The other problem is food miles - if the fat has been used to fry potatos that were grown in Egypt and flown halfway round the world to get here, then the total fuel consumption, including aviation kerosene far outweighs the benefits.

Personally, I only use biodiesel made from cold-pressed extra-virgin, organic, GM-free, biodynamically cultivated, fair trade, locally grown walnut-oil.

(I'm actually determined that my next car shall be a diesel just so I can use bio - I feel guilty about the extra motoring I do since owning a boat...)
 
Re: Amount of fuel / energy reqd

From surfing around on the Internet, it appears that some of the problems or risks with home-brew Biodiesel result from traces of water and/or methanol used in the process, and not properly removed from the final product. Reportedly these can cause damage to certain parts of the fuel system.

I hope all these issues get sorted out - I'd love to run Bio in the boat, but I worry quite enough about the engine stopping at an awkward moment as it is.

PS - Don't suppose anyone has any first hand experience of Biodiesel in a Volvo MD7A do they?
 
Re: Amount of fuel / energy reqd

Bio from chip oil sounds very clever. BUT, how much chip oil actually goes to waste over any given week? How does that compare to, say, one Tesco home delivery lorry's fuel use in a week?

Methinks there ain't enough chip oil, even in Glasgow, to make a difference beyond a few vehicles. Use it by all means, but don't trumpet it as the alternative for Everyman.
 
Chip oil ....

Over here that's not the problem .... problem here is no chip pans !!! That is the ones with the chip basket in to drain off the oil ...

/forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif
 
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