Gummed up injectors VP 2003

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lampshuk

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Hi, all. Just looking for a bit of advice on how to approach this problem :

Was running up the engine on berth just for a 15 minute turnover.
It cut out after 3 minutes when changing gear.
Would not re-start.
I verified that I had remembered to switch on the fuel.
Checked the first filter by the tank. No significant gubbins in there.
Cracked open one of the injector return caps and found a milky white substance in the top of the injector.
Verified that there is nothing in the secondary filter on the engine.
The fuel that came out of the filter looked quite clean.
I did put a capful of biocide in the tank a couple of months ago, but I did also add a couple of gallons of road diesel, could that have worsened a bug problem?
(Actually:is it a bug problem? With none visible in the engine filter, how come it appears in the injector?)

Anyway, I removed the fuel line from filter to injectors, and the injectors (after a bit of a struggle). I hope that was a sensible thing to do!

I can clean the fuel line, but what do I need to do with the injectors? They look quite sooty at the business end, is that a problem? Since they are out, does it make sense to do anything else to them? I do get a diesel film in the exhaust, so perhaps they could do with being serviced. Anyone recommend a good engineer to do that?

Thanks for any thoughts or suggestions.

Lampsh.
 
We regularly ad fuel Doctor to our fuel and have a problem, no residue and no bugs, (tapping on wood now).

The bug in diesel in normally a brown sludge, the remnants of the dead bugs, so a whitish fluid would not indicate a bug.

Having cleaned the muck out and hopefully heated (annealing the old) or replaced the copper washers under the injectors did it run ok?

It could well be the throttle adjustment, not uncommon and well worth a look.

Good luck and fair winds. :)
 
Creamy white gunk would suggest a little bit of water, bugs usually present like coal dust in filters or dark grity substance in the fuel. Water would also cause the engine to stop and it can be hard to discern the difference between diesel and diesely water whilst in the dark enclosed space of the engine compartment. Best to take a sample in a clear bottle and see clearly in daylight.
If you are going to give your injector nozzles a brush make sure and use a brass brush so as not to damage tips. If your nozzles are dripping fuel you would get a pre detonation or knock. Needles and tips should be matched and fitted in very clean conditions so best to get a pro to do them.
 
cryan said:
Creamy white gunk would suggest a little bit of water, bugs usually present like coal dust in filters or dark grity substance in the fuel. Water would also cause the engine to stop and it can be hard to discern the difference between diesel and diesely water whilst in the dark enclosed space of the engine compartment. Best to take a sample in a clear bottle and see clearly in daylight.
Click to expand...

That's worrying. Now you mention it, some of the "fuel" coming out did feel a bit cold. Not down at the boat at the moment but that does sound like something worth looking into. I was thinking of removing and cleaning out the tank.
 
lampshuk said:
Hi, all. Just looking for a bit of advice on how to approach this problem :

Was running up the engine on berth just for a 15 minute turnover.
It cut out after 3 minutes when changing gear.
Would not re-start.
I verified that I had remembered to switch on the fuel.
Checked the first filter by the tank. No significant gubbins in there.
Cracked open one of the injector return caps and found a milky white substance in the top of the injector.
Verified that there is nothing in the secondary filter on the engine.
The fuel that came out of the filter looked quite clean.
I did put a capful of biocide in the tank a couple of months ago, but I did also add a couple of gallons of road diesel, could that have worsened a bug problem?
(Actually:is it a bug problem? With none visible in the engine filter, how come it appears in the injector?)

Anyway, I removed the fuel line from filter to injectors, and the injectors (after a bit of a struggle). I hope that was a sensible thing to do!

I can clean the fuel line, but what do I need to do with the injectors? They look quite sooty at the business end, is that a problem? Since they are out, does it make sense to do anything else to them? I do get a diesel film in the exhaust, so perhaps they could do with being serviced. Anyone recommend a good engineer to do that?

Thanks for any thoughts or suggestions.

Lampsh.
Click to expand...
Be careful here, IIRC the 2003 is a strange beast. The inj hold the copper inj housing in the head, you can loosen them and coolant water goes in the cylinder.
You need special tools to deal with them, Juggler of this parish was selling some a few months back
S
 
skipper_stu said:
Be careful here, IIRC the 2003 is a strange beast. The inj hold the copper inj housing in the head, you can loosen them and coolant water goes in the cylinder.
You need special tools to deal with them,
Click to expand...

The injectors in a 2003 fit into copper sleeves, the cylinder end of which is flared to hold it in the head. The only time this is a problem is if the injectors have got stuck in the sleeves, otherwise the copper sleeve stays securely in place.
 
lampshuk said:
(Actually:is it a bug problem? With none visible in the engine filter, how come it appears in the injector?)

Anyway, I removed the fuel line from filter to injectors, and the injectors (after a bit of a struggle). I hope that was a sensible thing to do!
Click to expand...

If your filters are clean, you don't have a bug problem. As you've removed the injectors, it's worth getting them serviced before refitting them - any commercial vehicle diesel specialist will do it fairly cheaply.
 
pvb said:
The injectors in a 2003 fit into copper sleeves, the cylinder end of which is flared to hold it in the head. The only time this is a problem is if the injectors have got stuck in the sleeves, otherwise the copper sleeve stays securely in place.
Click to expand...

It is best to leave VP 2003 injectors undisturbed as there is a high chance that you will disturb the integrity of the copper ferule. This will then require the entire head to come off as the ferule is replace from inside. You will know at once of the seal fails - a phut phut sound on each compression stroke. This happened to me without any interference and the head had to come off - but every cloud has a silver lining - and this was the chance to overhaul the head. No smoke on start up now.

Why did the OP take the injector out rather than just cracking the union to the injector to see if fuel was flowing?
 
Chris_Robb said:
...

Why did the OP take the injector out rather than just cracking the union to the injector to see if fuel was flowing?
Click to expand...

(i) Because he's a noob. Also:
Because I found that white gunk on the outlet from the injector, leading me to believe the injectors were blocked. Fuel from from the pump is fine.
Could the injectors actually be blocked?
Rather worried now about what I may have done to the engine. No sign of the copper seatings coming out with the injectors, so fingers crossed.
Noted about the cu washers. Only the after-most injector clamp was kind enough to unscrew the stud end. The other two both left the stud in, making it much harder to withdraw the injectors (just used manual force to remove)
I must admit it never occurred to me that this could be a problem. I once popped the injectors out of a Landie diesel engine and it was a piece of cake.

I think I will send the injectors off to Panda Diesel - or maybe try locally in Andover. I guess they will be able to give them a scrub up as well as servicing.

Ulp!

Fingers crossed.
 
Chris_Robb said:
It is best to leave VP 2003 injectors undisturbed as there is a high chance that you will disturb the integrity of the copper ferule. This will then require the entire head to come off as the ferule is replace from inside.
Click to expand...

I always thought you could do it without removing the head, using a Volvo Penta special tool to flare the end.
 
pvb said:
I always thought you could do it without removing the head, using a Volvo Penta special tool to flare the end.
Click to expand...
You can remove them without the head off with the Volvo tool if you are lucky, however one of mine was leaking where the injector seals due I think being assembled with a minuscule piece of dirt, I borrowed the Volvo tool that in my case didn't work, I damaged the tool and had to remove the head and grind the copper away with my Dremel took some time, the collar (sleeve) is swaged out into a larger dia taper in the inside of the head, this done from outside due to the hole inside the sleeve where it fits is tapered to a smaller dia, there is a Volvo tool then when forced down through the tapered hole swages the copper out sealing the bottom of the sleeve, and clamping the injector in place seals the top of the sleeve this insures that pressure can be maintained in the water jacket. It is most important to use the injector removal tool because this holds the sleeve in place while extracting the injector.
Regards Mike
 
You have to be very lucky indeed if you manage to remove the injector sleeves without removing the head on these!!

And even then, getting out any bits which have dropped into the bore will be difficult, and trimming the end of the sleeve to be flush with the head would be impossible.......

If you do go down the head removal route do a compression test first.
 
pvb said:
The injectors in a 2003 fit into copper sleeves, the cylinder end of which is flared to hold it in the head. The only time this is a problem is if the injectors have got stuck in the sleeves, otherwise the copper sleeve stays securely in place.
Click to expand...
"you can loosen them" seems pretty clear to me, can being the operative word! The injector does hold the tube in place, the flare certainly wouldnt! Better the OP knows that a prob can arise if he is not careful.
S
 
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