grey coloured teak

[Marine Reflections]

The differences in opinion on this thread, and indeed all threads about looking after teak, highlights the need for some really objective data. Would be good if one of the sailing mags could undertake some more definitive long-term research into different ways of cleaning and looking after teak decks, like they do for antifoul. Not just subjective judgements about how good the teak looks with various treatments but some proper analyses of what the various products actually do to the teak surface, how long the effect lasts etc.

Would be pretty easy to design some controlled experiments using a series of teak planks left outside to weather and systematically treated with various products or just cleaned with water/seawater.

That is a good idea Vanilla and I dont know why it has not been done yet, the results would make good reading.

There are so many different circumstances and different environments teak has to perform in, is it getting wet at sea then being baked in high sunlight, or is it sitting on a pontoon on the Thames ?
Is it being used daily for grip in competition? or being gently trod on as you are coming into a lock?

The elements are not the teaks friend, however is is one of the best performing woods, it has plenty of natural oil and it is very durable and will last a life time (planted in the ground)!!

Whilst "low maintenance" has sold thousands of boats is has ruined just as many, there is nothing harsher on teak than neglect and yes using any chemicals, rubbing, scrubbing,washing & wishing may bring back the new teak look, other posters are correct that it will remove a small percentage of mass ( there is no way that it cannot) that being said you will also by using chemicals rob the teak of its natural oils (on the surface and just below), these will need to be replaced as there is only so much natural oil in the teak.

This oil, if left will oxidize on the surface causing the teak to go grey, as mentioned on post above "cockpit teak" is usually more protected from oxidation by means of an enclosure, cover etc limiting the exposure of UV rays. Quite how you polish cockpit teak with your bum is beyond me??? I have been wasting my money on scotch pads when the very tool I needed was being sat on..

Joking aside I guess the seating areas are what Chris was talking about.

When looking for answers on how to maintain your teak, you first really need to determine exactly what the teak is going to be subjected to, how much time you are willing to spend on it, how much use it is going to get and what you want it to look like.

As I work on behalf of some of the bigger stands at the London & Southampton Boat shows I can assure you that the fresh looking new teak decks on display were not looking that fresh a few weeks prior to the opening day.

So to relpy to the original post Yes your grey teak decks are normal and healthy, Can it stay that way and last? it depends on so many different factors as mentioned but the biggest factor (over here in our environment anyway) is water ingress. By far the biggest problem, natural oil protects from the water but once you clean the grey oxidized oil from the surface new oil will come up from beneath it, keep doing this and after a long time (yes thats a long time) it will have no defense left and start to shrink away from the caulking. This causes water to get deep down into the teak causing further problems through the winter months as this water freezes.

Quite simple really :

Clean decks and then apply a water / UV resistant barrier that retains colour and most importantly grip!

I hope IPC see the importance of a test between the various cleaning products, techniques and protective finishes as that will certainly provide good reading.

 

[Chris_Robb]

That is a good idea Vanilla and I dont know why it has not been done yet, the results would make good reading.

There are so many different circumstances and different environments teak has to perform in, is it getting wet at sea then being baked in high sunlight, or is it sitting on a pontoon on the Thames ?
Is it being used daily for grip in competition? or being gently trod on as you are coming into a lock?

The elements are not the teaks friend, however is is one of the best performing woods, it has plenty of natural oil and it is very durable and will last a life time (planted in the ground)!!

Whilst "low maintenance" has sold thousands of boats is has ruined just as many, there is nothing harsher on teak than neglect and yes using any chemicals, rubbing, scrubbing,washing & wishing may bring back the new teak look, other posters are correct that it will remove a small percentage of mass ( there is no way that it cannot) that being said you will also by using chemicals rob the teak of its natural oils (on the surface and just below), these will need to be replaced as there is only so much natural oil in the teak.

This oil, if left will oxidize on the surface causing the teak to go grey, as mentioned on post above "cockpit teak" is usually more protected from oxidation by means of an enclosure, cover etc limiting the exposure of UV rays. Quite how you polish cockpit teak with your bum is beyond me??? I have been wasting my money on scotch pads when the very tool I needed was being sat on..

Joking aside I guess the seating areas are what Chris was talking about.

When looking for answers on how to maintain your teak, you first really need to determine exactly what the teak is going to be subjected to, how much time you are willing to spend on it, how much use it is going to get and what you want it to look like.

As I work on behalf of some of the bigger stands at the London & Southampton Boat shows I can assure you that the fresh looking new teak decks on display were not looking that fresh a few weeks prior to the opening day.

So to relpy to the original post Yes your grey teak decks are normal and healthy, Can it stay that way and last? it depends on so many different factors as mentioned but the biggest factor (over here in our environment anyway) is water ingress. By far the biggest problem, natural oil protects from the water but once you clean the grey oxidized oil from the surface new oil will come up from beneath it, keep doing this and after a long time (yes thats a long time) it will have no defense left and start to shrink away from the caulking. This causes water to get deep down into the teak causing further problems through the winter months as this water freezes.

Quite simple really :

Clean decks and then apply a water / UV resistant barrier that retains colour and most importantly grip!

I hope IPC see the importance of a test between the various cleaning products, techniques and protective finishes as that will certainly provide good reading.

Bums on seats as they say! so the cockpit tends to be well polished by them.

I sometimes wonder if the teak in the cockpit is a different quality from the decks. The decks seem to be a wider grain, and more grainy than the cockpit, which seems to be a much tighter and harder surface.

A review by a mag would be useful but would take a long time. For example it takes months for the mildew to dissapear with MMC - don't know with Oxalic acid. So long as they take into account that there are 2 types of teak owners: The show boats, and the ones that wished they never had teak, and are worried about the replacement costs!

 

[Marine Reflections]

Bums on seats as they say! so the cockpit tends to be well polished by them.

I sometimes wonder if the teak in the cockpit is a different quality from the decks. The decks seem to be a wider grain, and more grainy than the cockpit, which seems to be a much tighter and harder surface.

A review by a mag would be useful but would take a long time. For example it takes months for the mildew to dissapear with MMC - don't know with Oxalic acid. So long as they take into account that there are 2 types of teak owners: The show boats, and the ones that wished they never had teak, and are worried about the replacement costs!

It's not a different grade of Teak it's just the weathering on the exposed parts that makes it look that way, of course there are softer parts of the grain and it is these that get weathered faster than the hard parts making it appear to be wider grained, it's the reason Teak should not be scrubbed or rubbed along the grain but against it.
Sanding brings back that once tight grain look but again how thick is your teak? is it ply backed teak? years ago they used to make it 2 inches thick but today with teak prices as they are it's a luxury not all builders can afford.

I would have thought though Chris that after spending 25 grand on yours it's solid and will be durable for a long long time. There are plenty of sealers out there that are hydrophobic and UV resistant and retain the teaks grip, just please please dont oil it. (personal opinion) tin hat on.

 

[Chris_Robb]

QUOTE]

Tony - It used to be the Westerly teak deck - that was ply with veneer. they disintergrated and the last owner put these on. The preparation and execution is good, with all screw holes being filled and faired. The new deck is made away from the boat, made up onto a thin epoxy sheet, and the laid in sections on the deck, and presumably epoxied on. A large amount of the cost would have been in labour as the (un-cunning) builders put teak under every fitting, (unlike Bavaria) so every fitting had to be removed (and inspected).

No I will never let teak oil get near the deck!

I have seen other decks covered in a clear yellowy varnish (coelan??) which I think looks absolutley horrid.

So I am very very careful!

 

[Marine Reflections]

Chris- I think thats for garden fences, but I have seen the "yellow decks"

Most sealers come in various shades for some reason, try to go for a clear or natural shade to retain the look of new teak, otherwise the results will be as horrid as mahoghany stain on pine furniture, also don't overlook the fact that application is a little more in-depth than most assume, and is easily hurried with corners cut.


Permagard is a good one along with Semco, both offer UV protection and are hydrophobic but bear in mind that preparation is so much more important than choice of sealer.

Some before and after pics for you, the second has sealer on, but as you can see from the before 1 the teak was in a bad way, in-fact it was owned by an MP perhaps I should have left it slippery

 

[Didleydude]

Teak, Cleaning and Protecting

Wow! This one's been flying! Where was everyone when this was discussed before!

Thanks to ksutton who recognised the good dialogue that went on at http://www.ybw.com/forums/showthread...highlight=teak . As has been said, if you want a grey coloured deck then 'go for it'! Everyone to their own! But I underscore the point that NO-ONE (oopps...did I shout a little) would ever buy a new boat with a grey coloured, dirt bound, grubby looking teak, iroko, ipe or whatever wooden deck is offered if a nice clean and new looking wooden deck was the alternative choice.

And again, sorry Chris...but Brinton's does not 'clean' (i.e.remove) any ingrained dirt of which decks get tons of the stuff! From the air, the rain, the shoes, the birds, the suntan oil, the food spillages.....the list is endless. I have personally used Brinton's and it's great and I can recommend it but it don't 'clean' a dirty deck!! It won't remove anything...just stop the mildew and algae etc. It turns a dirty dark grey to a light 'cleaner looking' grey. But it's still grey and still has the dirt and other stuff embedded.

Read the story at www.oaklandoutdoor.co.uk and the case story of Rangatira. It's a model example, starting and ending with Holmenkol's products through cleaning and protecting. And there are some great before and after pictures.

The protector really does make the cleaned and brightened finish last so much longer, it reduces further cleaning (and therefore the rubbing process) and it is a product at the best end of the protecting spectrum...whilst oil etc. are at the worst end!

By the way, Brinton's does kill and delay the future onset of algae, mildew & moss etc. and was designed for patio, paving etc. It has a chemical base but it does not remove any fibres!

Only the act of rubbing removes fibres. This can be from shoes, bums, ropes, slipping or whatever!

But in this context, it's the cleaning process that is the 'rub' and a sensible clean with a good cleaner and no stupidity with the cleaning equipment will bring your deck back as good as new (well ...nearly)!

Unless you act like a mad man (oops not PC...mad person) then your wooden deck should see most owners and the boat to the end of life!

To help gauge and calibrate! A light rub with your finger versus a full blooded Makita sander process gives you an idea of the spectrum (and DON'T sand unless you really have too...and before going that way get some teak cleaner and brightener or oxalic just to give yourself one last chance...you'll be amazed)!

Again, read the earlier dialoge via the link given above and make the choice.

Stay 'grey and old' or get 'good clean and good looking'!

Wood CAN be cleaned and better protected and there are real choices and great solutions nowadays!

And as before 'OVER [and OUT]...Cringe!!

 

[Didleydude]

Teak Cleaning and Protecting

Sorry all...my feeble attempts at cutting and pasting a hyperlink were just shocking and down to laziness!

Try this one and sincere apologies!!

http://www.ybw.com/forums/showthread.php?t=219891&highlight=teak