sailaboutvic
Well-known member
New law to be voted on next months , Cancelation of the DEPKA is one part another is the freedom of EU yacht to sail in Greek waters. Although once we leave we won't be class as a EU yacht .
Greece maybe some changes
- Thread starter sailaboutvic
- Start date
nortada
Well-known member
Sounds like fewer Brit yachts heading east and more coming back west.
Tony Cross
Well-known member
Vic, do you have an authoritative link for this please?
sailaboutvic
Well-known member
It be interesting what going to happen , we off to North Africa in about three weeks weather permitting, after that it's back to Malta before heading west , maybe out of the Med for this season .
Although Greece lost my interest and my money , I through other maybe interest in any new changes .
sailaboutvic
Well-known member
The first reports have come from yacht agents in Rhodes , if that's any help , I doubts they be speading fake news .
There also new laws that come in re charting and to do with black market charters .
+30 6974447720 if you want more info.
Mr Cassandra
Well-known member
Any more information Vic?
sailaboutvic
Well-known member
Only what I posted Bob , I guess more will come out if any thing changes , but Greece being Greece it all moves slowly .
Sorry can't be any more help .
vyv_cox
Well-known member
Vic is reporting the info given here by Roditis Yachting. https://m.facebook.com/story.php?story_fbid=3506659309375237&id=181963308511537
Tony Cross
Well-known member
Thanks Vic, I've got one of my knowledgeable locals on it. If I hear anything new I'll post back.
Tony Cross
Well-known member
The draft law is at the URL below, the vote is next Thursday (27th) and my contact has no idea how it will go. The two main points on a very quick reading by me (it's a massive document) are these (translated by Google Translate)....
Άρθρο 67 Διευκολύνσεις απόπλου-κατάπλου ιδιωτικών πλοίων αναψυχής | Υπουργείο Ναυτιλίας και Νησιωτικής Πολιτικής
and Άρθρο 66 Κατάργηση Δελτίου Κίνησης Πλοίου Αναψυχής (ΔΕ.Κ.Π.Α.) | Υπουργείο Ναυτιλίας και Νησιωτικής Πολιτικής
Source: Εκσυγχρονισμός Θεσμικού Πλαισίου για τις Θαλάσσιες Ενδομεταφορές και λοιπές διατάξεις | Υπουργείο Ναυτιλίας και Νησιωτικής Πολιτικής
Άρθρο 67 Διευκολύνσεις απόπλου-κατάπλου ιδιωτικών πλοίων αναψυχής | Υπουργείο Ναυτιλίας και Νησιωτικής Πολιτικής
and Άρθρο 66 Κατάργηση Δελτίου Κίνησης Πλοίου Αναψυχής (ΔΕ.Κ.Π.Α.) | Υπουργείο Ναυτιλίας και Νησιωτικής Πολιτικής
Source: Εκσυγχρονισμός Θεσμικού Πλαισίου για τις Θαλάσσιες Ενδομεταφορές και λοιπές διατάξεις | Υπουργείο Ναυτιλίας και Νησιωτικής Πολιτικής
Artic Warrior
Member
I've just made a new post about my power of attorney in Greece saying we can only keep the boat in Greece 6 months... At a time....wonder if this is something to do with new ruling coming in
sailaboutvic
Well-known member
Yes that must be it
Artic Warrior
Member
But he commented that it's 6 months in and 6 months out...not just skip a day like we know now...Yes that must be it
Chris_Robb
Well-known member
This is a muddling of laws and this would be for someone with a non vat paid vessel from a "third Country" . The owners can TI the vessel for 18 months, but they can only stay on board for 6 months or otherwise import the vessel. And thats because - as far as the Greeks are concerned, at 6 months you are a resident - therefore your boat has to go into Bond.
More of the other problems to discuss when I have been for a walk. - Only just seen these 2 posts!
sailaboutvic
Well-known member
Chris
Has I understand it , Any one living in any EU country more then Six month has to apply for residency , it doesn't matter if they are a EU member,
except no other country apply that rule unless your working, have a business or own a property in
It seen Greece may even if your just keeping a boat there and living on it part time .
My suggest is keep under the radar .
If we look at Artic warrior other posting , the guy give him advise I say is wrong .
If come 12/2020 and we have to apply to the 90/180 rule , staying in Greece for six months before returning back to the UK would made him a over stayer,
Although I think his email has just been worded badly and that is what the guy meant.
But more important register his boat under another country flag would make no difference regarding the 90/180 rule regarding himself , so there no benefit to do so.
But as Tony rightly said , no one know what's going to happen .
Has I understand it , Any one living in any EU country more then Six month has to apply for residency , it doesn't matter if they are a EU member,
except no other country apply that rule unless your working, have a business or own a property in
It seen Greece may even if your just keeping a boat there and living on it part time .
My suggest is keep under the radar .
If we look at Artic warrior other posting , the guy give him advise I say is wrong .
If come 12/2020 and we have to apply to the 90/180 rule , staying in Greece for six months before returning back to the UK would made him a over stayer,
Although I think his email has just been worded badly and that is what the guy meant.
But more important register his boat under another country flag would make no difference regarding the 90/180 rule regarding himself , so there no benefit to do so.
But as Tony rightly said , no one know what's going to happen .
Chris_Robb
Well-known member
Vic
Vic, Just going to start reading the other thread in detail - I started and it was all total misconception. However Tony haspicked up what I have been waiting for since September - the scrapping of the DEKPA so I have not seen this even though I only spoke to the Greeks on Friday - Like pulling out teeth!
Chris_Robb
Well-known member
So in reading the law, it confirms the scrapping of the DEKPA and refers to other passenger list that must be kept. I am hoping that will be the replacement to the Transit Log issue I have bee worrying about - with no feed back since it was raised last October. (no surprise there!)
So to clarify what Artic was worrying about I think it may have been:
^ months - in the country and then six out. I think this is referring to a NON vat paid boat with a TL, and that the owner has residency. In which case the boat has to be put into Bond, sailed out with the owner, or VAT must be paid. - Simples.
But for most of us, we will have VAT paid boats and will just have to comply with an UTL (unlimited Transit Log). However the provision in article 66 above look like they may be answering my query on the replacement for the UTL for us - ie to just maintain a signed crew list at every change of crew. If I am right that will be good news.
viz
b. Where private recreational vessels, irrespective of flag, are nationals of a State outside the EU. or the EEA the crew and passenger status shall be kept in accordance with the conditions laid down in point (a). The present crew status also contains the date of disembarkation of the above employees on board the vessel when it is recorded in Greece. The status of the crew present here is provided by the Master or Commander at the Port Authority of the first port of departure of the ship in the country from abroad and of the last port of departure for the country and considered. The visa requirement also applies in the event of the change of the above employees.
Note the VISA details that are required - this is looking very hopeful.
We need clarity on how to prove we are not illegally chartering when say, a family member is using the vessel FOC. that is work in progress.
So to clarify what Artic was worrying about I think it may have been:
^ months - in the country and then six out. I think this is referring to a NON vat paid boat with a TL, and that the owner has residency. In which case the boat has to be put into Bond, sailed out with the owner, or VAT must be paid. - Simples.
But for most of us, we will have VAT paid boats and will just have to comply with an UTL (unlimited Transit Log). However the provision in article 66 above look like they may be answering my query on the replacement for the UTL for us - ie to just maintain a signed crew list at every change of crew. If I am right that will be good news.
viz
b. Where private recreational vessels, irrespective of flag, are nationals of a State outside the EU. or the EEA the crew and passenger status shall be kept in accordance with the conditions laid down in point (a). The present crew status also contains the date of disembarkation of the above employees on board the vessel when it is recorded in Greece. The status of the crew present here is provided by the Master or Commander at the Port Authority of the first port of departure of the ship in the country from abroad and of the last port of departure for the country and considered. The visa requirement also applies in the event of the change of the above employees.
Note the VISA details that are required - this is looking very hopeful.
We need clarity on how to prove we are not illegally chartering when say, a family member is using the vessel FOC. that is work in progress.
Artic Warrior
Member
Oh I see...thank you for making it clearer...
Star-Lord
Well-known member
Maybe Greece will give the English a pass regarding 90/180 day rule. I think they may because it would make economic sense. I am almost certain Portugal will always welcome boats, even after negotiations and 2020, but they will ask you to register officially.
I am moving East. I do not understand why a liveaboard cruiser (who likes moving) would move in any other European direction! Turkey, Albania, Montenegro and Croatia are all outside Shengen (I hope!). So 3 months in Greece and 3 months in Turkey is the easiest option for a digital nomad. Or Greece to Albania, Montenegro, Croatia and back to Greece is another option. And then there is Cyprus - not the North - (outside Shengen I think) and Israel is not far away once in Cyprus.
I am moving East. I do not understand why a liveaboard cruiser (who likes moving) would move in any other European direction! Turkey, Albania, Montenegro and Croatia are all outside Shengen (I hope!). So 3 months in Greece and 3 months in Turkey is the easiest option for a digital nomad. Or Greece to Albania, Montenegro, Croatia and back to Greece is another option. And then there is Cyprus - not the North - (outside Shengen I think) and Israel is not far away once in Cyprus.
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Chris_Robb
Well-known member
As the Greeks are well aware, that they could loose longterm sailors to Turkey and even the over winter boat yard fees. They are keen to do something and the CA is making progress in that respect for a 6 month "yachting Visa" without the detail of an annual residency.