cataldo
Member
we have a princess 440,1997 model, we are in co donegal north west ireland,the boat is in lough swilly there.is this agood time to sell it and should we go single broker or multi.opinions appreciated.
good time for selling ?.
- Thread starter cataldo
- Start date
Andrew_Fanner
New member
Weather. Who wants to go boating? The nnly potential buyers will already want a boat, the "lets get a boat" brigade are not out there.
volvopaul
Well-known member
I would personally get the boat tip top condition, get some good photos and put it on a web site, either ybw.com or boats and outboards, also for the cost of a private ad you might get lucky.
Do some research on others for sale, compare yours to them and most importantly of all price it right with the brokers 8% off to attract the genuine buyers, stick to what you have in mind, prepare all the paperwork relating to ownership , finance if any and vat proof status etc, be professional and you will im sure get a result.
Last straw................... use a broker
How much are you thinking?
Do some research on others for sale, compare yours to them and most importantly of all price it right with the brokers 8% off to attract the genuine buyers, stick to what you have in mind, prepare all the paperwork relating to ownership , finance if any and vat proof status etc, be professional and you will im sure get a result.
Last straw................... use a broker
How much are you thinking?
ari
Well-known member
[ QUOTE ]
Do some research on others for sale, compare yours to them and most importantly of all price it right with the brokers 8% off to attract the genuine buyers, stick to what you have in mind, prepare all the paperwork relating to ownership , finance if any and vat proof status etc, be professional and you will im sure get a result.
Last straw................... use a broker
[/ QUOTE ]
So let me get this right. Rather than sell through a broker and let them deal with all the viewings, tyre kickers, survey arrangements, advertising etc etc, you think sell it privately, and knock the 8% brokerage fee off?
So that way you get to do all the work instead, and end up with the same cash cos you've given away the 8% fee!
Is it just me that spots a flaw with that particular alternative? /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif
Do some research on others for sale, compare yours to them and most importantly of all price it right with the brokers 8% off to attract the genuine buyers, stick to what you have in mind, prepare all the paperwork relating to ownership , finance if any and vat proof status etc, be professional and you will im sure get a result.
Last straw................... use a broker
[/ QUOTE ]
So let me get this right. Rather than sell through a broker and let them deal with all the viewings, tyre kickers, survey arrangements, advertising etc etc, you think sell it privately, and knock the 8% brokerage fee off?
So that way you get to do all the work instead, and end up with the same cash cos you've given away the 8% fee!
Is it just me that spots a flaw with that particular alternative? /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif
cataldo
Member
hi paul, its in mint condition 600 hours well specked,im the second owner for the past two years would take e250,000 or thereabouts.
Sneds
Well-known member
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Do some research on others for sale, compare yours to them and most importantly of all price it right with the brokers 8% off to attract the genuine buyers, stick to what you have in mind, prepare all the paperwork relating to ownership , finance if any and vat proof status etc, be professional and you will im sure get a result.
Last straw................... use a broker
[/ QUOTE ]
So let me get this right. Rather than sell through a broker and let them deal with all the viewings, tyre kickers, survey arrangements, advertising etc etc, you think sell it privately, and knock the 8% brokerage fee off?
So that way you get to do all the work instead, and end up with the same cash cos you've given away the 8% fee!
Is it just me that spots a flaw with that particular alternative? /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif
[/ QUOTE ]
Good point!
There seem to be a lot of boats for at the moment so I guess the more adverts you have out there the better.
My boat is advertised privately and also on brokerage www.bristolyachtbrokerage.com
If a buyer comes from my advertising I only pay the broker 1/2 even though he will then take care of viewings etc
She has been for sale for 3 months (seems like 3 years!) and have had a few viewings and only one offer. Had the offer been £2k more she would now be sold.
Hope I'm not wishing I had taken it in 6 months time!
I want a new boat and I WANT IT NOW!! /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif
[ QUOTE ]
Do some research on others for sale, compare yours to them and most importantly of all price it right with the brokers 8% off to attract the genuine buyers, stick to what you have in mind, prepare all the paperwork relating to ownership , finance if any and vat proof status etc, be professional and you will im sure get a result.
Last straw................... use a broker
[/ QUOTE ]
So let me get this right. Rather than sell through a broker and let them deal with all the viewings, tyre kickers, survey arrangements, advertising etc etc, you think sell it privately, and knock the 8% brokerage fee off?
So that way you get to do all the work instead, and end up with the same cash cos you've given away the 8% fee!
Is it just me that spots a flaw with that particular alternative? /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif
[/ QUOTE ]
Good point!
There seem to be a lot of boats for at the moment so I guess the more adverts you have out there the better.
My boat is advertised privately and also on brokerage www.bristolyachtbrokerage.com
If a buyer comes from my advertising I only pay the broker 1/2 even though he will then take care of viewings etc
She has been for sale for 3 months (seems like 3 years!) and have had a few viewings and only one offer. Had the offer been £2k more she would now be sold.
Hope I'm not wishing I had taken it in 6 months time!
I want a new boat and I WANT IT NOW!! /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif
RobWales
Active member
Do what I did Sneds,place the ad on as many of the FREE websites you can find,all in I reckon mine was on at least 8 !
The old saying works mate i.e...........
Throw enough shite at the wall and some of it will stick!!
Stick with it mate,I'm sure it will go soon,mine was on approx 14 wks!
The old saying works mate i.e...........
Throw enough shite at the wall and some of it will stick!!
Stick with it mate,I'm sure it will go soon,mine was on approx 14 wks!
Sneds
Well-known member
2 weeks to go then!
Knowing my luck she will sell just before the Bristol Harbour Festival!
Saying that, my broker said he will lend me a boat for the weekend if that happens, he has a nice Squadron sat there at the moment!!
Knowing my luck she will sell just before the Bristol Harbour Festival!
Saying that, my broker said he will lend me a boat for the weekend if that happens, he has a nice Squadron sat there at the moment!!
aquaholic
Active member
I would tend to agree with Volvo paul as far as boats upto a certain price, not sure what that price would be though. However if I was ever in the position to spend 250000 euros on a boat you can bet that money is only being handed to a reputable broker, I am sure there are others who think the same, but again comes the question 8% of 250000 ? 20000 euros is an awfull lot of dosh to pay.
Then comes the question why would you have to pay such a high cost to sell your boat but not your house ?......now I am confused !! /forums/images/graemlins/confused.gif
Then comes the question why would you have to pay such a high cost to sell your boat but not your house ?......now I am confused !! /forums/images/graemlins/confused.gif
ari
Well-known member
I suspect that if your boat is 250,000 euros you could probably do better than 8% though...
mainshiptom
Active member
I would say good time for buing ! Not selling but if you want to sell if you price the boat right ie not over priced like a lot of baots out there you should be ok to have a go to sell,
Having said that I have seen some really looked after boats which are not selling.
Tom
Having said that I have seen some really looked after boats which are not selling.
Tom
Andrew_Fanner
New member
And with interest rates up again another nail in the coffin?
Whitelighter
Active member
In the scheme of things rates are still low. If you can borrow in the euro zone they are even lower (3.87%). It will be 6% by Autumn, but 1/4% rises aren't really forcing anyone out onto the streets.
People are being charged big margins on boats anyway. The big three are still getting away with 2% or more on 100k boats. We are giving 1.5% on cars of that value. 599 customers are getting sub 1%. The lending market will sharpen their pencils to keep people borrowing. with a bit of negotiation
People are being charged big margins on boats anyway. The big three are still getting away with 2% or more on 100k boats. We are giving 1.5% on cars of that value. 599 customers are getting sub 1%. The lending market will sharpen their pencils to keep people borrowing. with a bit of negotiation
Andrew_Fanner
New member
I was thinking at the smaller end of the spectrum. The chap who sees £10K of nice little Freeman at a river marina is now rather less likely to wander into the bank and look at a £10K loan. Result of fewer folk start boating or can afford to trade up based on sale of a boat. The chap who was looking at a £100K marine mortgage isn't really so worried by 25 base points here and there when all is said and done.
I know things will be tight until I sell the previous boat as I'm running two at the moment.
I know things will be tight until I sell the previous boat as I'm running two at the moment.
Whitelighter
Active member
Fair enough, but bank loans haven't really moved. The average is up to 6.7% Apr from about 6.2% last summer.
Most banks loose money on personal loans anyway because of the profits they make on insurance and other products. With discount loans they have a very clever way of buying all your data (think what you give them on the forms) for effectively very little out lay.
That said, I do take your point.
Most banks loose money on personal loans anyway because of the profits they make on insurance and other products. With discount loans they have a very clever way of buying all your data (think what you give them on the forms) for effectively very little out lay.
That said, I do take your point.
Gludy
Active member
% interest rate rises in a row have increased the cost of borrowing by about 43% in a very short period. The rates rises seem small in themsleves but it makes a very significant difference to the cost of borrowing and this combined with the red issue etc means that the boat market is going to be pretty depressed for a fair while to come.
IMHO once the cost of fuel actually exceeds the £1 per litre level instead of just being a theoretical price in the future, the MoBo UK cruising market will decline never to recover to anything like it former levels.
The moves towards boat licencing and legislation that hits boaters in order to reduce the massive 1.5 people killed per annum where drink may have been involved, are just kicks as the industry stumbles.
IMHO once the cost of fuel actually exceeds the £1 per litre level instead of just being a theoretical price in the future, the MoBo UK cruising market will decline never to recover to anything like it former levels.
The moves towards boat licencing and legislation that hits boaters in order to reduce the massive 1.5 people killed per annum where drink may have been involved, are just kicks as the industry stumbles.
kcrane
Active member
I suspect that they will also bring in compulsory licences and insurance as per cars when they find there isn't currently anything to take off someone who is caught drunk in charge of a flapping genoa.
Having said that, the market in other countries seems to stand compulsory licences, more expensive fuel etc. without their boats being significantly cheaper than ours (or we would be over there buying them), so maybe there will not be a big collapse after all.
To answer part of the original question, there doesn't seem much point in hanging onto a boat waiting for say, interest rates to be significantly lower, as the flipping things cost a lot to keep and that would offset any marginally higher price. If you don't want it any longer better to sell it now IMHO, in case Gludy turns out to be right on boat values next year.
Having said that, the market in other countries seems to stand compulsory licences, more expensive fuel etc. without their boats being significantly cheaper than ours (or we would be over there buying them), so maybe there will not be a big collapse after all.
To answer part of the original question, there doesn't seem much point in hanging onto a boat waiting for say, interest rates to be significantly lower, as the flipping things cost a lot to keep and that would offset any marginally higher price. If you don't want it any longer better to sell it now IMHO, in case Gludy turns out to be right on boat values next year.
kcrane
Active member
Not a flawed alternative, just an alternative.
The broker option has you asking 100k for the boat, but then having to give £9,500 to a broker (8% plus VAT), leaving you with £90,500 IF someone will pay £100k for the boat when all the others out there, also trying to cover broker fees, are at £100k as well.
Option 2 is sell it yourself, but put it on the market at say, £92k. IF it sells, you get £92k, and you have differentiated your boat in the most obvious way (lower cost) with a small improvement on your takings.
The problem is that as you rightly say, you have to do the work yourself and you can't get listings on the closed broker-only sites, which a lot of people understandably use to search for boats for sale. But if you think the price makes a big difference, then effectively giving the broker commission to the buyer might get you a sale you would not otherwise have.
That boat also seems to be valued at a level where broker charges are trickiest. Low value boats, then 8-10% is a small absolute amount, so who cares. If the boat is very valuable, then selling without a prestigious broker could be difficult. But in the middle ground 8% can be a lot, and maybe you can sell it privately.
Just a call you have to make, but not inherently foolish.
The broker option has you asking 100k for the boat, but then having to give £9,500 to a broker (8% plus VAT), leaving you with £90,500 IF someone will pay £100k for the boat when all the others out there, also trying to cover broker fees, are at £100k as well.
Option 2 is sell it yourself, but put it on the market at say, £92k. IF it sells, you get £92k, and you have differentiated your boat in the most obvious way (lower cost) with a small improvement on your takings.
The problem is that as you rightly say, you have to do the work yourself and you can't get listings on the closed broker-only sites, which a lot of people understandably use to search for boats for sale. But if you think the price makes a big difference, then effectively giving the broker commission to the buyer might get you a sale you would not otherwise have.
That boat also seems to be valued at a level where broker charges are trickiest. Low value boats, then 8-10% is a small absolute amount, so who cares. If the boat is very valuable, then selling without a prestigious broker could be difficult. But in the middle ground 8% can be a lot, and maybe you can sell it privately.
Just a call you have to make, but not inherently foolish.
Gludy
Active member
[ QUOTE ]
Having said that, the market in other countries seems to stand compulsory licences, more expensive fuel etc. without their boats being significantly cheaper than ours (or we would be over there buying them), so maybe there will not be a big collapse after all.
[/ QUOTE ]
I think the markets are different and there are other factors.
We prop up the demand for med boats by putting our boats there. Even so Med boats tend to be cheaper than UK boats.
In the UK the weather counts as a significant negative factor - the decision of anyone to keep a boat here is a balance of many factors including weather, frquency of use, costs etc. If the marginal cost of operation increases a lot then the balancer changes and more will sell up or move to the Med etc - there will be a reduction in demand.
For years many in eire have travelled to the UK to buy boats because boats have been cheaper over here - I yself sold my first boat that way. So there are and have been market unbalances.
The core of boating is not the big expensice boat - its a more modest sized boat who owners often have to struggle to keep. It those that are being hit most by the large increase in boating costs that we now face.
Having said that, the market in other countries seems to stand compulsory licences, more expensive fuel etc. without their boats being significantly cheaper than ours (or we would be over there buying them), so maybe there will not be a big collapse after all.
[/ QUOTE ]
I think the markets are different and there are other factors.
We prop up the demand for med boats by putting our boats there. Even so Med boats tend to be cheaper than UK boats.
In the UK the weather counts as a significant negative factor - the decision of anyone to keep a boat here is a balance of many factors including weather, frquency of use, costs etc. If the marginal cost of operation increases a lot then the balancer changes and more will sell up or move to the Med etc - there will be a reduction in demand.
For years many in eire have travelled to the UK to buy boats because boats have been cheaper over here - I yself sold my first boat that way. So there are and have been market unbalances.
The core of boating is not the big expensice boat - its a more modest sized boat who owners often have to struggle to keep. It those that are being hit most by the large increase in boating costs that we now face.
volvopaul
Well-known member
The reason ari I gave that advice is that most people who try and sell through a broker dont really know the true value of there boat and just stick it on way over market value to cover what the broker wants then after its had a kicking over things that are wrong after survey, if it actually gets an offer after its on at a very high price.
Its not hard to sell if the boats right in the first place, there are enough people out there looking that know what to do with buying and selling, there is also loads of info free on how to do it if you dont.
I cant see what hardship it is to go down to your pride and joy to show it off, as viewings are arranged around a mutual agreement, and no sea trials or surveys incurring cost are done untill money is handed over, would you want to hand over 8% of the best part of 200k ? I know I wouldnt.
Its not hard to sell if the boats right in the first place, there are enough people out there looking that know what to do with buying and selling, there is also loads of info free on how to do it if you dont.
I cant see what hardship it is to go down to your pride and joy to show it off, as viewings are arranged around a mutual agreement, and no sea trials or surveys incurring cost are done untill money is handed over, would you want to hand over 8% of the best part of 200k ? I know I wouldnt.